Menopause legislation - helpful or not?

This sounds like a great accommodation from a reasonable employer and I’d hope it could be made to any woman of any age who suffered similar debilitating issues with their periods.

Can you tell potential employers you’re past it and you’re safe to be employed? 🤷‍♀️

No, I don't like this either. Insofar as menopause is debilitating for some, it can be managed like any other medical condition in the workplace.

And the stuff like opening windows and uniforms is stupid. Yes, it can be good to open a window for a hot employee. But it has to be balanced against the needs of the business, other employees, and customers or clients too! The fact that it is menopause doesn't make it more (or less) important than the needs of any other person in the workplace. The current trend to decide certain people's needs and even preferences are more important than others is a little disturbing, IMO.

I also think there needs to be some discussion around the limits of workplace accommodation - some of it makes me rather uncomfortable. My aunt has a condition that means she takes a medication that requires her to be really regular in her sleep habits if she isn't going to have a flare up. She had been in a job that was shift work, and found it impossible to manage. She went to her employer to see about the possibility of a days only job opening up, or was going to resign. He manager told her that she could claim medical need for an accommodation, so she was put on days only. Of course this meant that the other two people in the job did not get first dibs on day shifts, and in fact had to rearrange the night shifts. One was happy enough with that, the other, with small kids, also had hoped to move to more days - too bad for her. I am not totally comfortable with that approach, there seems something off about the overall effects, and my aunt wasn't totally happy either, although she accepted the position.

As someone who isn't there yet, and so who still no doubt has a lot to learn, the current menopause narrative and focus feels very double-edged to me. More awareness is clearly positive and needed, and there are heart-breaking stories of women who have really struggled and had no support from anyone, including HCPs. But it can feel very doom-laden and it does sometimes feel that I'm essentially a write-off, particularly career-wise - I'll just get over being flaky because I have small children then menopause will hit...

My irregular periods and flooding made it almost impossible to work as a teacher at my previous job, but due to concessions at my new workplace I’ve fared much better. Having a fixed base that I could adapt and store a change of clothing, and supportive colleagues who would watch my classes if I needed to dash out to change a pad made the difference between me being able to work or not.

Jesus wept. How utterly patronising. Normal life cycles are not a disability.

Any initiative, no matter how well meaning, that marks women out from "default human" is going to have some negative impacts. Some things, like maternity leave, are important enough that they counter balance the downsides (though I still think increasing pat leave will be even better).

I don't think this policy is going to be an overall positive in the slightest.

It feels patronising to me. It also seems to reinforce the stereotypes and prejudices against older women in the workforce.

Women in their fifties are far more likely to drop hours/responsibilities at work not just due to menopause symptoms but also all the other shit that we’re dealing with. Children going through exams. Elderly parents and in-laws needing care. Husbands having their mid-life crisis own health issues. We become the default support unit for everyone around us and somehow we’re the ones that pay for it with our careers.

What would be more useful if debilitating symptoms of menopause were treated more seriously as one of the reasons amongst many (medical or otherwise) that any employee can ask for reasonable adjustments. Lots of employees could be more productive/avoid breakdowns with a more imaginative approach from employers. Acknowledging they employ humans and treat them with a bit of respect and dignity all round and then you wouldn’t need to separate out people into “special” groups.

I would choose an option to have more uniforms so that I can change during a shift if needed. I would definitely like cotton or linen uniforms, I don’t think that is an option though. More uniform would help.

An option for shorter shifts and ideally to be rostered for late shifts rather than earlies due to feeling like I can never get enough sleep when getting up at the crack of dawn or at this time of year well before it.

Yeah I understand your point. And as someone has already said, it's no-one's business at work what medication anyone is taking for whatever reason.

As long as the managers are men or younger women, nothing will happen positively.

@Floofydawg I am all for choice around HRT, but I think legislation like this will mean women truly are expected to take HRT if they want to be considered 'serious employees' who do not disrupt business in any way. It feels very off to me.

Exactly. People struggle due to unmanageable workloads, unreasonable expectations and lack of care wrt life balance. This is ok when you're in your twenties and don't have dependents, it's harder when you're older and do. Fuck all to do with whether you're a menopausal woman or not. Lots of middle aged men also suffer burn out.

I left a senior job that required long hours & extensive traveling, due to a horrific combination of insomnia, brain fog, anxiety that hit at the same time as my - not local - DM started suffering falls and confusion, and my teens were going through GCSEs and A levels.

What would have helped me the most was

• HRT and not antidepressants
• a manageable workload
• A review of my travel requirements for work (travel hours to have counted as working hours).
• my home working agreement honoured (I was pressured to be in the office more than agreed, which combined with traveling meant a lot of early starts.

It's great headlines, but I'm not sure labelling menopause as a disability would have helped. Nor am I convinced by the sexism arguments. HRT aside, the key things I needed should be available to both sexes and all ages.

And either way, on HRT or not, none of your 40y old male boss's business!

I disagree to some extent in that it's really the only way to replace the hormones you're missing post menopause, but appreciate that some women can't take it for whatever reason. However it's not the magic cure-all that some people think it is.

I do get intensely irritated by the current narrative around HRT. It is literally expected that you go on HRT now to manage what is a totally natural process of womanhood.

This will only make that narrative worse. You can just hear the subtle probing about whether someone is on HRT...and if so, no problem, but if you dare to go wild and just go through the menopause 'unmedicated' - instant liability.

More medicating away of womanhood ahead.

And you're exactly right with 'exposed and humiliated' - that's exactly it!

Oh no no no, this is ghastly. As a 50 year old woman I feel exposed and humiliated. My menopause and HRT are my business and mine alone.

Spot on re this bring your whole self to work bullshit.

Yeah. I'm as cynical about this as most posters.

I would prefer the government to spend less time creating more exciting gesture legislation and a whole lot more time making the existing legislation actually work effectively.

My family memebr, in his thirties, works for a trade union and loves a cause. I had a big argument with him recently about this. He was going on about how women who work in Morrissons have a right to demand cotton uniforms not polyester when they're menopausal (er the younger women and the blokes would probably also appreciate being cooler), and really couldn't come up with anything else when I asked him what their shiny new menopausal policy would actually entail. He also didn't have an answer when I asked him whether anyone had actually asked woman 40-60 whether they wanted all this extra scrutiny. I haven't met one as yet.

Yes, abolutely, Caroline Noakes is of that school of thought.

Definitely not. It's not only patronising, but sends the (incorrect) message that all older female employees are a liability. Just gives employers another reason not to take on women as staff.

Also, what reasonable adjustments are really needed? if you need a day off because of symptoms then you phone in sick, as normal. If you are suffering from hot flushes and don't want to take HRT, which btw makes menopause pretty much a non issue in terms of symptoms but I appreciate not everyone cam/wants to take it, then bring a fan into work, if you don't mind everyone knowing that you are experiencing menopause. Other people such as myself are much more private and I don't want HR bods coming up to me and asking me about menopause becasue I am approaching 50. And I have to say people going on about it and flapping their arms and going on about hot flushes does imo make them look like they're not going to be able to cope with a full workload.

This is just a new initiative dreamt up by unions and HR people becasue they've run out of things to fetishize about being a woman. Where are the Erectile Dysfunction and Male Pattern Baldness reasonable adjustments?

Terrible thing in my industry. It's hard enough being a) a woman and b) older in tech without giving them ANOTHER reason to pass over for promotion/pay less/age out women.

I file this under the same 'don't bring your whole self to work' initiative as the john Lewis fetishists. My menopausal status (or mentsrual status) is no one at work's business and I don't want HR drawing attention to it, making me look old and past it to the 30 something dude bros. If it is affecting your ability to work, just like pregnancy, PMT, IBS, any long term chronic condition - then you see your GP and speak one on one to HR.