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Original poster

Saxon a spectrum

86 replies

IcakethereforeIam · 04/02/2024 11:12

More batshittery in academia

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/02/03/anglo-saxon-warriors-transgender-liverpool-university/

https://archive.ph/zoRIx

Tooth decay is female coded, who knew? While the rough tough girls transmen were out (and proud) fighting for Odin, the lads transwomen were plaiting their/them hair and eating sweeties 🙄

Some Anglo-Saxon warriors may have been transgender, says academic

Modern gender norms may not have applied in the Dark Ages, a study of seventh-century burials in Kent suggests

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/02/03/anglo-saxon-warriors-transgender-liverpool-university

OP posts:
Treaclewell · 05/02/2024 09:20

Among the Viking burials at Repton was a male with a boar's tusk between his thighs, and there was speculation on TV as to whether this was Ivar being provided with a prosthesis for his afterlife.

Treaclewell · 05/02/2024 09:15

The Jutes had a very nice line in feminine grave goods; a set of crystal ball in a metal sling with a hemispherical spoon with a punctured bowl. These were usually very high status, but sometimes a bit less classy. The Victorian clergyman who wrote the directory of Jutish grave goods argued that the Jutes obviously imitated Roman spoons while missing the point, as they wouldn't have worked with holes in. As an antiquarian he had obviously never been to afternoon tea with his mater, since the design is almost exactly that of a tea strainer, without the projection for resting it on the cup. Which is relevant as it shows men not really understanding women's culture, or even trying to. High status women administered medicine to their dependants.

Original poster
IcakethereforeIam · 05/02/2024 09:10

There's a famous viking whose name has peaked the interest of many a historian. They've speculated it was because of an accident or injury leading to amputation or a congenital illness causing limb reduction.

I think one of they/them should explore if Ivar the Boneless had undergone gender affirming surgery. That's probably another PhD up for grabs.

OP posts:
AmaryllisNightAndDay · 05/02/2024 08:54

MarieDeGournay · 04/02/2024 13:10

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YpGnzfd8KGs
What would they make of the shero of this song who was a gallant sailor and 'a maiden all the while'.
Unlike other versions of this song, she doesn't enlist to follow her lover, she seems to do it just for the hell of it ☺ I love the last verse, where she says she'll happily 'put off my hat and feathers and I'll run the rigging again'.
I'm a bit disappointed about the fine lady in London grassing her up to the captain, though...

(The singer is Tríona Ní Dhomnaill, sister of the equally great Maighréad and the late Micheál, and founder member of the influential 70s group Skara Brae.

Great song! Cheered me up.

Abhannmor · 05/02/2024 08:44

So everyone raves about Angles and Saxons but it's Jutes Schmutes. Written out of history but why? Could they have been ...drum roll....a third sex!
Yet another PhD in the making.

EBearhug · 05/02/2024 00:22

But one of them was only Harthacnut, not a whole one...

SabrinaThwaite · 04/02/2024 23:49

I read somewhere that the Danes were the most disliked of the invaders of Britain.

Apparently they were a right bunch of Cnuts.

Original poster
IcakethereforeIam · 04/02/2024 21:04

I'm feeling a bit needled.

If it wasn't for the Jutes we wouldn't have such a wide selection of reusable shopping bags and doormats.

Doormats and shopping bags are generally female coded in trans academia. There's probably a PhD in it.

OP posts:
newtlover · 04/02/2024 21:04

the comments under the article are hilarious

what about the simplest explanation probably being the best eh?

NitroNine · 04/02/2024 20:33

Do so enjoy it when accidentally missing a couple of words (in this case “to Anglophones”) changes the sense of your post so/renders it not-quite nonsense (stilts optional).

dapsnotplimsolls · 04/02/2024 20:25

Jutes Schmutes, nobody cares about them!

Abhannmor · 04/02/2024 20:17

Fair enough. I feel a bit Cowed.

EBearhug · 04/02/2024 19:59

I went yo the Isle of Wight once. I don't feel the need to go again, so there's no need to mention the Jutes.

Abhannmor · 04/02/2024 19:54

I feel this is Angle phobic. And what about the Jutes? Does nobody care about them? They settled in the Isle of Wight . Someone had to go there.

Brefugee · 04/02/2024 19:17

sorry, didn't see that @EBearhug had already said that.

Brefugee · 04/02/2024 19:13

NitroNine · 04/02/2024 16:14

@JanesLittleGirl faintly reminiscent of all the modern-day U18 AFAB NB Germans 😉

(For anyone wondering what I’m blithering on about, the German for girl is “das Mädchen”; a counterintuitively neuter word.)

Baby is also "das" and Kind is also "das" in German.

to be fair to German everything ending in the -chen used as a diminutive of something (like Brötchen) take the neutral article.

LenaLamont · 04/02/2024 18:13

EBearhug · 04/02/2024 17:29

It's counterintuitive in some ways, but all -chen words are neuter, so it's very intuitive in that way.

Show quote history

I’m glad you said that - I was sure that was the reason but as my last German lesson was in the mid 80s, I didn’t feel confident saying so.

Frau Hausman would be very proud 😂

dapsnotplimsolls · 04/02/2024 17:45

PurpleSparkledPixie · 04/02/2024 17:33

Loki in fact changed sex and bore offspring as a horse

This is going to be one of those threads where it goes off on many different (but still fucking weird) paths isn't it...

Hedgehog masturbation ...

JanesLittleGirl · 04/02/2024 17:38

I've had another little poke around 8th Century Saxon culture and, while it was generally fairly sexist, widows inherited their husbands' social status and property. When she died, the widow of a high-status warrior would have been buried as a high-status woman and with her husband's weapons.

PurpleSparkledPixie · 04/02/2024 17:33

Loki in fact changed sex and bore offspring as a horse

This is going to be one of those threads where it goes off on many different (but still fucking weird) paths isn't it...

EBearhug · 04/02/2024 17:29

NitroNine · 04/02/2024 16:14

@JanesLittleGirl faintly reminiscent of all the modern-day U18 AFAB NB Germans 😉

(For anyone wondering what I’m blithering on about, the German for girl is “das Mädchen”; a counterintuitively neuter word.)

It's counterintuitive in some ways, but all -chen words are neuter, so it's very intuitive in that way.

Februarysiceandsleet · 04/02/2024 17:24

“The theory has been put forward by James Davison, a PhD candidate and tutor of medieval history at the University of Liverpool, who also convenes the Trans*Historical Conference.”

I wonder what would happen at this person’s PhD viva if one of his examiners suggested that, rather than “modern gender norms may not have applied” but actually modern sex-based norms may not have applied, ie women could be warriors and high status, and the whole premise of the thesis was wrong.
You have wasted the last 3+ years, go back and start again.

FrancescaContini · 04/02/2024 17:19

Don’t know where to begin with “Gendering Victorian Mermaids” or “Queer Indigenous Archaeology”.

SinnerBoy · 04/02/2024 17:13

ApocalipstickNow · Today 17:11

I’m sorry I slurred you as a shandy drinker

I am weeping into my pint of Tyne Bank.

FrancescaContini · 04/02/2024 17:12

dapsnotplimsolls · 04/02/2024 13:31

Some of the delights from last year's conference:

Trans*Historical 2023 Conference, Online, University of Liverpool, 10-11 July 2023 — International Center of Medieval Art

Thanks for the link, really enjoyable 🤣🤣