In the actual Guardian! "The law is now clear: you can’t be punished for having gender-critical views. So why does it keep happening?"

Well, perhaps not, but you conflated the two as equally abhorrent. Was that your intention?

He thinks he's being extremely clever, but all it shows is his misogyny and lack of understanding of these issues.

I think that Susanna Rustin most probably saw that article by Haroon Siddique the other day and thought what we all thought, namely that the line "she suggested there were likely to be a greater number of claims brought by transgender people alleging harm, though many go unreported" was complete horseshit. And so she decided to write this article highlighting the large number of cases that had been brought by gender-critical feminists - but without mentioning the article she was responding to.

And I expect you're right, it probably has been scrutinised. That's why it's so cautiously worded. And she probably had to argue with her editor to get it published. That's my guess, anyway.

"The TRAs don't get they are the flat earthers of the modern age"

Love love love this, @WinterLobelia.

I think it might too. It depends how the belief was framed.

If your gender critical views cause you to misgender someone in the work place, or tell a GNC person they can't use a specific bathroom, it's likely to be harassment.

It entirely depends on the facts of the case. "GNC" people aren't protected under the Equality Act. Gender reassignment is, but it doesn't automatically follow that males with that PC can use women's spaces.

If your gender critical views cause you to misgender someone in the work place, or tell a GNC person they can't use a specific bathroom, it's likely to be harassment

Au contraire. Someone needs a briefing in the law.

I think "harassment" needs more harassing context around it to constitute harrasment in front of a judge. e.g. repeated, unwelcome, inappropriate, threatening.

For instance if two workers are on tea break together politely discussing gender, then I don't think it would come anywhere near harassment for one of those workers to say they were gender critical and for the other to say they were supportive of gender identity.

But now the tea break is over and they both go back to work. One of those two didn't like the other's point of view and starts shouting at them agressively and abusively. The recipient of the shouting calmly says "ok we can discuss this later, but we're on work time now". It has no effect, the shouting continues. The one being shouted at asks the other to stop. It doesn't stop. The shouter tries to recruit other workers to their cause in shouting abuse at the other one. This goes on for several days. An email campaign is started by the shouter to everyone in the office denouncing the other person's views. Management and HR get involved.

In both hypothetical made up examples above two diametrically opposing views get expressed, but clearly the context of what's happening where, how, trying to involve others, the repeated nature, agressive attitude, insults, threats, all count. There's a ton of additional factors on top of a belief that in my opinion are necessary to constitute harassment. Just expressing a belief politely I don't think on its own is harassment.

I am very very shocked that the Graun (which used to be my newspaper of choice before it became ridiculous) has published this.
And it's definitely a very happy moment!!!!

Let’s not get derailed by the misogynists on the thread.

This is great news, yet another sign that the tide is turning away from the oppressive bullshit the Graun has favoured previously.

I suspect that 'climate change denial' isn't protected under Equalities legislation. Any more than having an opinion on Volvos is. So I'm not quite sure where Dad's going with that. Or maybe I'm missing something - I'm fairly new to this board 😂

The protected belief I am referring to is that gender identity doesn't exist

Oh do stop making things up. Sure, some people see themselves as having a Gender identity. Some people have a religion. We all know that religion and gender identity are very real and very important to some people.

Doesn't mean everyone else has to agree.

I'll repeat - I don't think that being gender critical makes your a racist.

Well, perhaps not, but you conflated the two as equally abhorrent. Was that your intention?

I'll repeat - I don't think that being gender critical makes your a racist

yes

you’ve said that…and i agreed

Yep.

facts. facts and Facts. The TRAs don't get they are the flat earthers of the modern age.

edited to add- when it comes to science.

I'll repeat - I don't think that being gender critical makes your a racist.

@WolfFoxHare plenty of legal beliefs are bigotted, which is why the expression of such beliefs can be considered harrasment.

It should be blindingly obvious that holding one of those views doesn't necessarily mean you hold other others.

oh I agree

but i think that everyone on here can see what you are doing…maybe accidentally?

its been commented on on other threads and this one…

Who on earth said that climate change denial means you are a racist? It certainly wasn't me.

Climate change denial, IQ differences between races and a lack of belief in the existence of gender identity are all views which are not illegal but not supported by qualfied experts in those fields. It should be blindingly obvious that holding one of those views doesn't necessarily mean you hold other others.

The protected belief I am referring to is that gender identity doesn't exist, in the face of the views of every reputable major psychological and medical body.

If your gender critical views cause you to misgender someone in the work place, or tell a GNC person they can't use a specific bathroom, it's likely to be harassment.

Given the presumed prevailing ethos at the Guardian, I would guess that the piece has been scrutinised word for word as disgruntled colleagues looked for reasons not to publish it so I am also guessing that points made in it do stand up and are inarguable

I must say, I'm halfway convinced that, erm, certain posters are actually doing some sort of reverse, by posting inaccurate rubbish, to be torn to pieces by irked Terves.

Perhaps he'll disappear in a cloud of self righteous pique and a cloud of Johnson's?

Talcum X must be absolutely livid 😂

Equally, calling a gender critical person a hateful bigot or a transphobe or comparing them to nazis is discriminatory. I guess that must just burn you up, huh? Oh well 🤷‍♀️

Ha ha, at my age he does seem like a young man!