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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Communication on new building - room available for 'chest feeding'

259 replies

Sizzlysausage · 18/01/2024 10:01

I got an email today about our new building (I work at a university). This explained space had been put aside in the new building for 'breast and chest feeding.' I find this so ridiculous I just need somewhere to vent (don't dare do so to any of my colleagues)!

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PonyPatter44 · 21/01/2024 10:17

@worriedrn I am so sorry you are being gaslit (gaslighted?) by the exact people who are meant to be supporting you through such appalling trauma. I dont have any helpful suggestions, but just wanted to offer you my sympathy and support. I'm also really angry on your behalf...

Datun · 21/01/2024 10:17

worriedrn · 21/01/2024 10:12

@Dadjoke2 It's pervasive - counsellors are now so afraid of the BACPs ethics guidelines they can't "affirm" my "assigned identity" (ie admit I was a woman before "chest cancer" and still am afterwards) they can only talk about what gender identity I should choose now I don't have breasts. Leaves women like me coming round from a mastectomy wondering when the world changed and decided we are no longer allowed to be women. I went through a whole mental health assessment triage questionnaire with a counsellor a few weeks ago - I explained I am dealing with society's insistence that I perform femininity (e.g. have a breast reconstruction) before I am allowed to be viewed as a woman again as an intrusive/compulsive thought and that it is society that is insane, not me. At the end of the call she said they had some gaps in their form/data on me - could i just confirm my gender identity. When I said I didn't have one she said I needed to say somethnig for the form. I just burst into tears. no one will tell me how to find the person who 'assigned'me female at birth so I can get them to reassign me so the cancer will go away/not come back. The narrative the mental health professionals are forced to parrot just to keep their jobs is destroying me to have to hear it over and over again. Meg John Barker has a lot to answer for. The profession is so confused.

Christ, worriedrn, I'm so sorry. That is Absolutely appalling.

worriedrn · 21/01/2024 10:12

@Dadjoke2 It's pervasive - counsellors are now so afraid of the BACPs ethics guidelines they can't "affirm" my "assigned identity" (ie admit I was a woman before "chest cancer" and still am afterwards) they can only talk about what gender identity I should choose now I don't have breasts. Leaves women like me coming round from a mastectomy wondering when the world changed and decided we are no longer allowed to be women. I went through a whole mental health assessment triage questionnaire with a counsellor a few weeks ago - I explained I am dealing with society's insistence that I perform femininity (e.g. have a breast reconstruction) before I am allowed to be viewed as a woman again as an intrusive/compulsive thought and that it is society that is insane, not me. At the end of the call she said they had some gaps in their form/data on me - could i just confirm my gender identity. When I said I didn't have one she said I needed to say somethnig for the form. I just burst into tears. no one will tell me how to find the person who 'assigned'me female at birth so I can get them to reassign me so the cancer will go away/not come back. The narrative the mental health professionals are forced to parrot just to keep their jobs is destroying me to have to hear it over and over again. Meg John Barker has a lot to answer for. The profession is so confused.

PTSDBarbiegirl · 21/01/2024 10:09

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ArabellaScott · 21/01/2024 10:05

bobomomo · 21/01/2024 09:53

Why would there be children on site unless there's a creche there too? If it's actually for pumping then call it that, no controversy. Only natal females can pump (or feed) I can't get too worked up though, better they call it a baby feeding room and avoid the terms altogether

Calling it the Pump Room may cause confusion.

2Old2Tango · 21/01/2024 10:04

@Dadjoke2, no, nothing to gloat about when your husband has secondary BREAST cancer and is actively dying from it. He’s an intelligent man and understands that men can have breast tissue too.

What irks me is the people who don’t want to be/identify as women and get offended or traumatised by female body part names, yet don’t hate it enough to want to do a completely womanly thing like grow and/or feed a baby.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 21/01/2024 09:59

Man spends hours on a feminist site telling women they're wrong about something only women experience - again 🙄

As Datun pointed out - like moths to a flame

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:57

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:55

Yeah someone made it up and now a bunch of people use it, therefore it's a word that's in use. Nobody says unicorn feeding. Do you understand the difference?

Yes. I do. And to you, the only difference is frequency of use. You would have no issue with unicorn feeding being put on an official sign if enough people used it. Like I said, bonkers.

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:55

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:47

Yes literally it's fine. "Unicorn feeding" is not going on a sign because that's a term you just made up.

Chest feeding is a term someone made up. Both equally inaccurate.

then yes that would be fine

It’s like when teenagers are so committed to being right they don’t care how stupid they look.

Yeah someone made it up and now a bunch of people use it, therefore it's a word that's in use. Nobody says unicorn feeding. Do you understand the difference?

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:54

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:50

Well not your truth, obvs 😆

Maybe get Jack Turban on the case. He’s good at getting surveys to show you the answers you want, rather than the answers they actually give.

bobomomo · 21/01/2024 09:53

Why would there be children on site unless there's a creche there too? If it's actually for pumping then call it that, no controversy. Only natal females can pump (or feed) I can't get too worked up though, better they call it a baby feeding room and avoid the terms altogether

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:52

ArabellaScott · 21/01/2024 09:51

Some people can use whatever words they want. Some will be fired, bullied, threatened and pilloried for it.

... and arrested. Don't forget arrested.

ArabellaScott · 21/01/2024 09:51

Some people can use whatever words they want. Some will be fired, bullied, threatened and pilloried for it.

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:50

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:46

Are survey results from AIBU "the truth" then?

Well not your truth, obvs 😆

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:49

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:44

Yes literally it's fine. "Unicorn feeding" is not going on a sign because that's a term you just made up. But if enough people started using that term for themselves, enough that a person designing a breastfeeding room thought "we should probably put unicorn feeding on here too because some people use that", then yes that would be fine.
This is the third time I've had an argument about language on FWR and it always comes down to "so if people used X term, you'd really be okay with it???" And the answer is always yes of course, people can use whatever words they want. If people don't understand the word then that's an issue but in the fictional universe we're talking about, "unicorn feeding" is a recognised term isn't it. To the extent that someone put it on a door.

And the answer is always yes of course, people can use whatever words they want.

Explains a lot.

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:47

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:44

Yes literally it's fine. "Unicorn feeding" is not going on a sign because that's a term you just made up. But if enough people started using that term for themselves, enough that a person designing a breastfeeding room thought "we should probably put unicorn feeding on here too because some people use that", then yes that would be fine.
This is the third time I've had an argument about language on FWR and it always comes down to "so if people used X term, you'd really be okay with it???" And the answer is always yes of course, people can use whatever words they want. If people don't understand the word then that's an issue but in the fictional universe we're talking about, "unicorn feeding" is a recognised term isn't it. To the extent that someone put it on a door.

Yes literally it's fine. "Unicorn feeding" is not going on a sign because that's a term you just made up.

Chest feeding is a term someone made up. Both equally inaccurate.

then yes that would be fine

It’s like when teenagers are so committed to being right they don’t care how stupid they look.

BayCityCoaster · 21/01/2024 09:47

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:44

Yes literally it's fine. "Unicorn feeding" is not going on a sign because that's a term you just made up. But if enough people started using that term for themselves, enough that a person designing a breastfeeding room thought "we should probably put unicorn feeding on here too because some people use that", then yes that would be fine.
This is the third time I've had an argument about language on FWR and it always comes down to "so if people used X term, you'd really be okay with it???" And the answer is always yes of course, people can use whatever words they want. If people don't understand the word then that's an issue but in the fictional universe we're talking about, "unicorn feeding" is a recognised term isn't it. To the extent that someone put it on a door.

So, rest assured then - that in a couple of years, ‘chest feeding’ will have become normalised, and then IT will be desperately triggering for the tiny minority, in the same way ‘breastfeeding’ apparently is.

So maybe we just wait and watch…

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:46

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:45

Yep. They'll never do this tho. 'They can't handle the truth'.

and they're not after it anyway. They're drawn to this board like moths to a flame.

Edited

Are survey results from AIBU "the truth" then?

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:45

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:44

Post it AIBU then, with a survey. Love to see how you go there 🍿

Yep. They'll never do this tho. 'They can't handle the truth'.

and they're not after it anyway. They're drawn to this board like moths to a flame.

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:44

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:32

So in other words, trans activism in a nutshell. “We don’t need to worry about stuff that never happens!”

But logically though, why one false term over another? Why not “unicorn feeding” or “pixie dust feeding”? So your logic is it’s ok to have falsehoods on signs because enough people like the false word? So that can be applied to anything, right?

Yes literally it's fine. "Unicorn feeding" is not going on a sign because that's a term you just made up. But if enough people started using that term for themselves, enough that a person designing a breastfeeding room thought "we should probably put unicorn feeding on here too because some people use that", then yes that would be fine.
This is the third time I've had an argument about language on FWR and it always comes down to "so if people used X term, you'd really be okay with it???" And the answer is always yes of course, people can use whatever words they want. If people don't understand the word then that's an issue but in the fictional universe we're talking about, "unicorn feeding" is a recognised term isn't it. To the extent that someone put it on a door.

BayCityCoaster · 21/01/2024 09:44

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:43

lol. Extrapolation not required.

Awkward innit, when women have opinions of their own that you cannot undermine.

Yes, exactly.

We’re not going away, and we’re never going to agree with you.

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2024 09:44

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:36

Yes several people on the anti-trans subforum of Mumsnet disagree with me. Can we extrapolate that?

Post it AIBU then, with a survey. Love to see how you go there 🍿

Datun · 21/01/2024 09:43

Dadjoke2 · 21/01/2024 09:36

Yes several people on the anti-trans subforum of Mumsnet disagree with me. Can we extrapolate that?

lol. Extrapolation not required.

Awkward innit, when women have opinions of their own that you cannot undermine.

HearTheSubGoBoom · 21/01/2024 09:41

Why do you want to police language?

Why do you want to police language?

This specific example is a room at work, that is likely never to have an actual infant in it, but has been provided by the employer as it is legally obliged to, for nursing mothers to express their breast milk and store it, before taking it home to their child. It's a room with a chair, a plug, a door lock and possibly a fridge.

It probably doesn't even need a sign on the door but someone has decided to ram one up calling it a "chest feeding room" when the only accurate word to describe it in that phrase is "room."

ArabellaScott · 21/01/2024 09:41

The mask is slipping, Dadjoke2.