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Telegraph: Parents who refuse children gender change face seven years in jail in Scotland

141 replies

ResisterRex · 09/01/2024 19:43

What to say? They'll stop at nothing. Women and children, and parents are just cannon fodder. Who cares if they get hurt.

For shame.

"Parents who refuse to allow their children to change gender would face up to seven years in jail under SNP plans to ban “conversion therapy”.
Proposals published on Tuesday state that actions designed to “change or suppress” another individual’s gender identity, causing them physical or psychological harm, would become illegal under the radical law.
SNP ministers acknowledged that so-called conversion practices often took place in a “family setting”, raising the prospect that parents could be criminalisedd_ if they refuse to go along with their child’s declaration that they are transgender.
Stopping someone from “dressing in a way that reflects their sexual orientation or gender identity” was put forward as an example of an action that would become illegal, even if a parent believed they were acting in a child’s best interests.
A consultation states that alongside new criminal sanctions, preemptive civil orders could be obtained against parents or religious leaders, even where conversion practices had not yet taken place.
The plans are the latest controversial measure put forward by the SNPP_. Critics argue the proposals would have a devastating impact on freedom of speech, privacy and family life in Scotland.
Religious campaigners have vowed to fight the ban in the courts.
“We have grave concerns that these plans will criminalise loving parents, who could face years in jail simply for refusing to sign up to the gender ideology cult,” Marion Calder, a director at the campaign group For Women Scotlandd_, said.
“They will also hand activists and social workers unprecedented powers to meddle in family life, while having a chilling impact on therapists and counsellors.
“If the SNP and Greens insist on pushing this through, it is likely to go the same way as the toxic self-ID and named person laws and be blocked in the courts.”"

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/01/09/parents-refuse-child-gender-change-jail-snp-conversion-ban/

OP posts:
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Kucinghitam · 14/01/2024 07:02

Igneococcus · 13/01/2024 19:22

Second one is a comment by Alex Massie:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/c7cae9ce-c7cd-4bb7-9849-c2e65f5e7692?shareToken=7a0702d657b6b3e3d067971207f584d0

That is a really good article. I particularly agreed with this paragraph:

Moreover, the government has offered no evidence this bill is necessary save to the extent it bolsters ministers’ “progressive” credentials. Never mind the detail; admire the feelings. For the consultation documents acknowledge that the government doesn’t know how widespread “conversion practices” are. It bases the need for legislation on “the collection of anecdotal evidence” and “engagement with key organisations” who have spent years demanding a ban on conversion therapy. This does not seem a robust or compelling basis for action.

Igneococcus · 13/01/2024 20:54

I think this sign or similar ones makes a regular appearance at rallies @DuesToTheDirt

DuesToTheDirt · 13/01/2024 20:30

Igneococcus · 13/01/2024 19:21

Two articles in the Times:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/49e723fc-1c11-48e4-9631-ef6c192eace3?shareToken=c43ab223d16030a06f1e85a66ec0a60d

"Stop killing my trans siblings." Eh? What? Do trans activists just put random things on their placards?

DogsAkimbo · 11/01/2024 19:00

With all the current issues, why are the SNP so obsessed with this, to this extreme? I’m surprised as it hasn’t gone so well for them so far? Feel like I’m missing something.

Morwenscapacioussleeves · 10/01/2024 22:15

I think it would be blocked by the courts like all the rest of the SNPs crap legislation- surely it contravenes the right to a family life?

But yes surely Westminster will have something to say if the SNP are going to prevent free movement within the uk ?!

ArabellaScott · 10/01/2024 21:17

The suggestion that the child will want 'bottom surgery' is horrible to watch.

IcakethereforeIam · 10/01/2024 21:00

I'm not sure if I've ever watched the Leo doc. In the Wings over Scotland clip while Leo is talking about chest binders the camera cuts to a pair of hanging baskets full of dead plants. Which seems very metaphorical. Wolton talking about her top surgery, 'you won't be doing the YMCA', she treats it as a joke but she's saying it's too painful to raise your arms. Infertility? Just brushed off.

Igmum · 10/01/2024 19:02

It's horrific. My mind boggles at the thought of any sane group of people even contemplating this. Truly trans stuff operates at a level way beyond normal rational thought

Justwrong68 · 10/01/2024 18:17

There was a discussion about this on Good morning Britain this morning. Someone asked what conversion therapy was and it was conflated with gay conversion therapy
So people are still misusing that phrase. Who wouldn't vote against something that's associated with chemical castration?
But of course everyone agreed you should talk to your child before they change sex.
It's a farce.

IcakethereforeIam · 10/01/2024 18:07

An article in the Telegraph, I've not read the thread..do you blame me?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/01/10/snp-conversion-therapy-ban-wrong-law-election-year/

It's been archived.

Signalbox · 10/01/2024 17:59

It's sinister that the SNP keep trying to isolate children from their parents.

It really is. It’s a tactic of authoritarian governments on both left and right. Shocking that people are still voting for them.

XRAYTHIS · 10/01/2024 17:44

Madness

ArabellaScott · 10/01/2024 17:33

"dressing in a way that reflects their sexual orientation or gender identity"

A child dressing in a way that reflects sexual orientation sounds like an automatic safeguarding referral to me, tbh.

EasternStandard · 10/01/2024 17:18

OldCrone · 10/01/2024 16:57

They also need to describe what "dressing in a way that reflects their sexual orientation or gender identity" means.

Are they going to produce a document which describes which items of clothing or styles of dress go with which sexual orientations and gender identities?

Show quote history

I don’t even get what that phrase means

But yeh what exactly are they referring to - hair styles, clothing styles

We could ensure children are left free to look different rather than this totalitarian, extreme response

Adults who are neck deep in this are entirely culpable

IonaPenis · 10/01/2024 17:06

Would it make sense if any other phrase was used instead of "gender identity"?

Parents to be imprisoned for 7 years for refusing to accept their child's new shoes/hair colour/dodgy boyfriend/truancy. Parents to be imprisoned for 7 years for refusing to let their child stay out until midnight/ride a bike without lights/never change their bedsheets? No.

OldCrone · 10/01/2024 16:57

ArabellaScott · 10/01/2024 16:26

So, Scotgov.

Define 'gender identity'.

They also need to describe what "dressing in a way that reflects their sexual orientation or gender identity" means.

Are they going to produce a document which describes which items of clothing or styles of dress go with which sexual orientations and gender identities?

ArabellaScott · 10/01/2024 16:26

So, Scotgov.

Define 'gender identity'.

ArabellaScott · 10/01/2024 16:24

rogdmum · 09/01/2024 20:05

It’s awful Parents are being told they don’t have to “actively” support their child’s gender identity but must not do anything to “suppress” it. They have even specified clothing, so, for example parents would not be able to tell their adolescent daughter that she may not wear a binder.

it also gives ScotGov the legal basis for self ID in schools. To date, ScotGov have danced around. The fact that there is no legislation to compel schools to support social transition. This changes all of that and makes child led affirmation mandatory.

Equally worrying is the fact that they are not just legislating around “conversion”. They are also legislating around “suppressing” which has a very broad meaning and places a chilling effect on parents, teachers and social workers.

argaghghgahg

Britinme · 10/01/2024 15:18

One could possibly use the scroll button.

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