Home Secretary James Cleverly apologises for 'ironic joke' about spiking wife's drink

I agree that people shouldn't be sacked for a one off mistake.

However, as regards to the apology, for me it really depends on the quality of the apology. If he had said that he initially thought the remarks were acceptable (ie taken responsibility for making them), but that after talking it through with others he had learned why it was unacceptable and won't do it again, I could respect him a whole lot more. It would show he had learnt something. Even members of his own party have said 'hopefully he's learnt from this'. 'Hopefully' isn't good enough.

Instead he's tried to double down and use the 'it was only a joke' excuse beloved of bullies.

Not only that, he issued the apology via a spokesperson (as far as I could see)ie someone else reports that he is very sorry. If he was that sorry he'd be saying it himself.

Depends on how much thinking you allow yourself to do.

I think it's possible to think this joke tells us a lot about JC while also thinking it's not a resigning offence.

I’m inclined to forgive people for one off offences. I think we all mistakes and we can all learn from it - I think it’s right that there is condemnation of the “joke” because politicians help to set standards and reflect values. But on the whole if someone apologises I think it should be accepted and we should move on.
However ….. I have heard of other objectionable remarks from JC ( in addition to “ shithole”) so I’m not feeling as forgiving anymore…. He sounds pretty horrible.

Let us not forget what came moments before this:

MP: "Why are the people of my constituency (Stockton-On_Tees) still in poverty?"
Cleverly: (under his breath) Because it's a shithole.

Again, the mask slipped, showing his true personality.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/dec/29/tory-mp-james-daly-struggling-children-bury-north-crap-parents Not related, but here’s another Tory.

@Theunamedcat - surely a joke amongst friends or family demonstrates a person’s character - arguably more than one made in public, because they are relaxed and feel able to be fully themselves?

Why is it OK to joke about date rape at all?

I have always understood that a joke should be funny. Secondly, it should not depend on targeting a person who cannot respond, because that is bullying. And it should not be defended by claiming the target "can't take a joke" or lacks a sense of humour", because why should they collaborate in their humiliation? And the number of times I had to point that out to year 4 boys, usually the leader of the bully group, sticks in my mind. And I always refused to listen to any sentence which began "It was only" or "It was just". It was just NOT FUNNY.
Y4 boys it's expected. They have to learn. What the blazes JC has been doing with his social education beggars belief.
JC should know marital rape is now a crime, and that iswhat his "joke" was about.

Theunamedcat Yesterday 17:47

There is a huge difference between jokes amongst family and friends and an official work function part of being an MP is knowing the difference and acting appropriately

You're absolutely right, I mean, how can anyone take their spiel about spiking seriously now?

You, me and the rest of the country. They need to go.

Thank fuck we get to get rid of them next year.

Disgusting “joke”, disgusting PM and their apologists.

I'm sick of men like this coming out with 'jokes' like these, and it's especially disgusting coming from the Home Secretary. Just shows how JC's mind works. Vile. Can you imagine someone within an organisation which is trying to prevent and punish cases of racism who makes racist jokes?

Even if it had been a purely private joke, I don’t think that makes a difference. All it means is that he is good at hiding his true nature. It demonstrates a nasty, misogynist attitude towards women and women’s safety, and I do not want someone who has these attitudes in Government, even if he manages not to display his misogyny in public.

Added to all of which he had announce only a few hours before that the Tories were going to take a far harder position re spiking of drinks.

If only announcing were doing, eh ?

'Fit of the vapours' - your internalised misogyny is showing 🙄

I suppose we shouldn't worry our pretty little heads over it either?

Comments like his reinforce the 'boys will be boys' apologist culture that allow rape and sexual assault to be so rife.

As has been said upthread, his position of authority is also significant. He's not Jimmy who works in wetherspoons, nor the unknown MP for bumfuck, nowheresville, he's literally the most senior person in the Government who is in charge of making and enforcing laws.

Would it have been as 'funny' or acceptable if he was joking about other crimes only being a bit illegal? Perhaps only having stabbed some teenagers a little bit? That feels like a very different statement doesn't it? Why is that?

Urgh I’m so fed up of hearing the Conservatives apologising, just don’t do it in the first place.

@Justcallmebebes - can you explain how date rape/date rape drugs are funny?

There is a huge difference between jokes amongst family and friends and an official work function part of being an MP is knowing the difference and acting appropriately

Bingo again.
" fit of the vapours" TICK
Must have been watching Gone with the Wind over Christmas.

I'm not a man but can see a poorly executed joke, can see it for what it is and not take a fit of the vapours over it

You are both either men, or very naive unconsciously self-hating women. Is it that you don’t care how this reinforces a misogynist culture, especially from the Minister in charge of the law, or do you simple not care? If you are a women, don’t you know that the misogynists and self-entitled men have contempt for you, even when you join in with the “banter”? 🙄 Of course my comments with trigger defensive bile or sarcasm because thinking it through will be too uncomfortable for you!

Ah the can't take a joke apologists for arseholery behaviour have landed. How predictable.

I'm running out of bingo cards.

Because he was referring to his wife and not a colleague? I assume his wife can take a joke, unlike you lot

Thank God someone sees it. It was a joke people, get over it and no, it wasn't particularly funny but he was joking