Why are so many women hellbent on acting against their own interest?

I think you are being way too extreme in your analysis op and it means it doesn't ring true.

Like the bathing suit. You happen to live in a place where men wear trunks, go to France and you will see a lot more male crotch hair. And some men will remove it.

And there is actually quite a wide variety of female bathing suit styles that are fashionable.Lots of options with shorts.

Now the super-sexed up bathing suits in things like Sports Illustrated are not like that, but why would anyone expect them to be? The whole point of them is to be highly sexualized, so by definition they aren't modest, thy push all the boundaries. If you go to a beach those kinds of suits aren't typically the majority and no one thinks, gee, why isn't that middle aged plump woman wearing a skimpy bikini? I don't think anyone expects most women to look like pin-up models. Just like we don't expect most men to look like Chris Pine. Lots of women and men might like to look like that, but we all know that's not realistic.

A few people have mentioned that girls in particular go through a phase of trying a lot of the more sexualised fashions on, and feel pressure to do so. That's true, and it would not be a bad thing if that pressure were lesser, but to some extent I think it's natural that young women are trying to get a handle on their sexuality, which is new to them. They don't understand all the social implications yet, they don't really know who they are, and their hormones are also ramped right up. And the element of female social hierarchies is huge there, teen boys are not the ones driving the bus on these things, overall.

It's also the case that teens in general have a hugely elevated sense of being watched and judged compared to adults, this is a well recognized psychological aspect of teen development, and it means they feel a lot more pressure, in many cases, than is really there.

Teen boys social hierarchies exist too, but they are structured around different things, and they are a lot simpler.

Schools and parents typically try and help teen girls through all this by not allowing them to go all out in certain settings like school, and by playing down the importance of trends, and just being adult and reasonable. Tbh I am not sure that feminism has always been helpful in this area.

I also think that people engaging in dangerous (potentially) sexual practices is not social issue. A woman with a dangerous kink does not pose a risk to you no more than a smoker who smokes only at their own home.

Sure. you can argue "normalisation" but despite fetishes existing since forever, they are still not "normalised". Vast majority of people will hear about strangulation and think it's weird at best.

Teeth straightening usually isn’t cosmetic, it’s to foster healthy teeth and gums so you don’t lose teeth by age 30 and be in dentures by age 40.

@thedankness except men are not "accepted in their natural form" - I have heard people mocking particularly hairy men. Men are socially "allowed" a bit more hair than women, but a man with hair on his back will get as many sneers as woman with hairy armpits. its up to him whether he cares though

if a man chose to wear speedos his pubes would be exposed too, just buy tankini z shorts, every sportswear store sells them...

You literally have a choice and seem annoyed that others have the same choice and pick a different option to you

Things you've listed your employer or family would either not know about (sex life) or not pay attention to (leg hair).

I work in the most corporate of corporate environments and I am 100% that not all women wear make-up or heels. it may have been an issue in the past, but its much less so now because there isn't an expectation for women to want to look pretty at work

so at worst people will think you're ugly IF they will even consider your appearance for long enough to come to that conclusion

It was concern about fertility, not the appearance. At the same time, men were warning women not to drive cars because the speed of the car would displace their womb and would cause the loss of a baby if pregnant or infertility if not pregnant.

PaintedEgg is correct. Corsets started out as comfortable, supportive undergarments. They did the same function as a bra and being made with flexible whale bone that flexed and moved with you, they were more comfortable than today’s underwire bras. They even had pregnancy corsets that helped to support your pregnant belly for which we have modern support bands now.

Women who went to work in WWI doing loading of trucks and factory work actually protested to keep their corsets on under their dresses because it gave them back support and kept the breasts from being hurt by the physical labour. By WWII we had bras, which had replaced the corset as support for the breasts. But many WWII women worked without the back support that corsets also provided and ended up with injured backs- as did and do male manual labourers.

Tightlacing was a fashion trend akin to the skinny heroin chic look of the 90s where a small minority of young women got very competitive about how narrow they could make their waist. Unfortunately, Hollywood always portrays corsets with the practice of tightlacing so most people assume that is how a corset was worn.

@Psychoticbreak Exactly. I was part of the extreme end of the church for much of my life, and having a massive problem with the behaviour of others was part of the package. It was exhausting and pointless. Since I got out, I've made my peace with other people doing stuff I don't agree with or understand. We have our own priorities and it's very patronising and totalitarian to point at someone different and say they're getting it wrong.

My mother was like this when I was with my ex constantly saying things like I cannot believe you are getting your hair done/putting on a tan/getting nails done/wearing makeup all FOR A MAN. I was single for 11 years before I met my ex and tanned and got my hair and nails etc done but my own mother seemed to have not noticed this. Judgemental people annoy me.

OP:
I see time and time again women who absolutely defend their own subjugation

I think some of the backlash is in your initial OP, the list of things you see as subjugation did not include the very dangerous sexual fetish of choking during sex (which goes both ways, men have been strangled to death accidentally during sex as well as women). If you had limited your OP to just this one dangerous fetish, you would have had a much more positive response. Stating that these are all subjugation of women “From TWAW, pro "sex-work", "kinky sex" and porn, plastic surgery, accepting low standards in relationships with men, being anti-abortion to more trivial things such as wearing heels, and yes, shaving, and so much more, so many women will defend these things to the hilt. They refuse/are unable to see how these things are bad for themselves and/or women generally, even after presented with arguments.”

Well many of us are questioning your list. We don’t agree much of it is the subjugation of women.

@Psychoticbreak Exactly, surely one of the most fundamental principles of feminism is "my body, my rules", and I've got no time for people who judge and sneer at the choices of others, and make out that they're somehow letting the side down. My mother in law does it and I can't stand it.

Never plucked my brows thank christ. Some of my friends still have that tiny whispy brows from too much plucking. Waxing yes but I cant pluck. I love having a mainly hairless body though. I have long hair and nice brows and lashes but not a single hair on the rest of my body as I dont like it. Possibly linked to my autism which I never thought of but I am single and hairless cos I want to be not cos society tells me I should be. Society wouldnt even know if I had long hair on my body or not especially in this weather. Honestly live and let live.

OP:
“Why is it so common for women to act against their interest?”

I don’t think it is, I think that women being individuals with their own wants and desires are simply not behaving the way you would like them to.

The argument of “we are all influenced” is combined with a sneering implication that women who like traditionally feminine things must be weaker of mind and need to be told off by those of stronger and more masculine minds. This is said without a shred of irony, that the more masculine a woman you are, the stronger you are mentally. 🙄

Because its essentially a long list of criticising of women, from women who sound entirely unhappy and exactly like those type of men who criticise women because they need a blame outlet for failure in their own lives, can't bear women to have choices, and wish they could control and subjugate women into doing exactly as they're told.

oh, the eyebrow plucking! the wonderful, ever-changing trend nightmare that most men are either unaware of or don't understand and would not dare to approach the topic - but women seems to always have an opinion about eyebrows of other women 😂

The OP's beef with shaving doesn't even remotely consider why some people do it, male or female. I have a friend who is autistic and regularly shaves and waxes extensively, as she finds the interaction between body hair and clothing a sensory nightmare.

So yeah...leave people alone and stop telling them what their best interests are.

I see truth in this. I can't forget the mockery of the never ending eyelashes and eye brow plucking. And I distinctly remember a period when husbands were worried they'd missed the new hair do.

But these trends did not stop. Women wanted to outdo each other.

There is a female social greasy pole...

@TempestTost and yet it was women themselves who fought for that liberation.

I absolutely disagree that casual sex is harmful to women as a whole - nobody is forcing anyone to do it! normalisation of one end of spectrum of sexual behaviour does not mean the other end is now "not normal". People can wait until their wedding night if they wish and they will find those who share those values.

There is not one way to be a woman, a human, a member of society, and range of behaviours and preferences is generally accepted - at least on social, if not individual, level.

And I think what posts and theories like some presented here are missing is the fact that women are also people. Each woman is a person with unique set of influences (some unconscious , some chosen) and experiences that shaped her personality and life. For example, not every woman will want committed relationship at certain point in her life, but that does not mean she won't want some sort of companionship and sex. Sometimes one needs a placeholder, women included, and it's fair for all parties involved to be open about it. If a man she slept with will then go on to never want another committed relationship then that's also fine, normalising it will mean he will be more inclined to be honest about it...although realistically, when people find the right person (cliche, I know) their commitment-phobia tends to disappear.

I do find the angle of women's hierarchy interesting and I absolutely agree that these do exist independent of men and patriarchy...and just like men can be absolute dicks to each other, women are often not above stepping on another woman to just prove a point.

@CuriousAlien in my home country we have a proverb that translates to literally "you don't discuss tastes". It's not that discussing tastes and preferences is bad, but that it often does tend to boil down to one person trying to explain why another person is wrong to do or like something. In reality, there is not a one solid argument as to why an individual should not do something, especially if the argument would require an assumption that the person making it knows what is best for the other person...and few things annoy people as much as "I know what is best for you" does

This is an interesting point. I would say that casual sex is "against the interests" of women far more than wearing some make-up, or even a lot of make up. The normalization of casual and uncommitted sex is nice for women who like it but creates huge, sometimes quite serious issues for women as a group.

But you don't often see posts saying, "I can't believe all of these women just having casual sex don't realize they are working against the interests of women, why don't they understand it's unfeminist? That it's a socially driven belief that it's healthy and normal? They must be selfish or a bit stupid. if they don't get it."

Even those who tended to agree with the principle would tend not to want to say it was unfeminist, or that society should discourage women from perusing sex outside of commitment.

My hypothesis on this is that it isn't directly to do with men at all, it's about establishing female social hierarchies. Which may give access to men, but it's about power to a large extent.

Not everything women do is about the patriarchy or men. Female social hierarchies are their own thing and evident in a lot of societies, very much including ones where women hold power.

@PaintedEgg yes I completely agree there may be so many different underlying reasons for any particular observed behaviour. And this thread for me has seen a lot of people give their different takes on that. Prompted by a first post which for me had a sad and questioning tone.
And actually the people who felt offended or disagreed also made lots of good points. There began to be more of an edge to the thread (not talking about anyone in particular, this is just me remembering the impression I felt). That interested me is all. Especially in the wider cultural context of no-debate and people feeling their identity (or even their existence) is invalidated by disagreement (not saying this thread, more generally.)
Good stuff.

@CuriousAlien the body of the main post mentions specifically people denying harm of presented examples even when faced with evidence for it...then no evidence was actually provided

a lot of the assumed harm comes from own perspective, even when discussing how these things affect (or are affected by) wider society.

For example: some women believe wearing make-up is harmful as it enforced already unrealistic expectations of appearance. They also may believe that if it was not for men then women would not wear make-up.

Other women may think this is a non-issue

While others may agree that make-up is something enforced by society but the issue is far more complex than "wanting to appeal to men". For example, even without male presence having acne may prompt some women to want to cover their skin condition - and if we are being honest, it would be probably other women who would make comments about it, not men