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Original poster

Finally: Gender questioning children: draft schools and colleges guidance

503 replies

WarriorN · 19/12/2023 10:37

Gender questioning children: draft schools and colleges guidance

consult.education.gov.uk/equalities-political-impartiality-anti-bullying-team/gender-questioning-children-proposed-guidance/

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PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/12/2023 11:44

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/12/2023 11:21

Schools are expected to follow non statutory guidance (it actually states that in the document) and IF they choose not to then they must be able to evidence why very clearly.
So abandoning safeguarding this group of vulnerable children because adult transactivists are cross really won't cut it.

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Yup, the nature of statutory guidance is that schools have to consider it and, if they choose not to follow it, they have to have a very good reason.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/12/2023 11:41

Ofsted have also commented on the safeguarding risks of schools transitioning children in secret from parents:
‘It is really important that parents understand what their child’s concerns are – if their child is having serious questions or doubts or explorations of gender identity, to keep parents in the dark about that is obviously a safeguarding risk,’ Amanda Spielman (Head of Ofsted)

More back up for parents in challenging transactivists in schools.

medianewbie · 19/12/2023 11:41

@WarriorN good to know that about NHS training materials thank you.

My DD is Autistic. She believes she is gay (I suspect this will turn out to be correct but, age 16, she still takes a plushie to school so is very immature still (10 hrs a wk mainstream provision as she's 'not ASD enough for special school'). She also, heavily encouraged by school, believes she's 'Trans'. She recently took part in some NHS online workplace 'training' (at school) & was told off for saying that paramedics sometimes attend women in labour.

She's vulnerable & just the sort of girl / woman who needs most protection but Scotland is far worse than England on this & will now worsen still: a political move. Meanwhile our children are enduring a horrible social experiment.

Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 11:28

That guardian article is really useful; it's in the Guardian (many teachers read the guardian), it demonstrates the reasoning some of the "revolting teachers" have, which is all stone wall bs, and it spells out exactly why, using Bayswater quotes, this guidance is needed.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/dec/19/englands-schools-must-be-involved-in-new-transgender-guidance-union-warns?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

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heathspeedwell · 19/12/2023 11:27

It's brilliant that they use the factual term 'gender questioning children' instead of the loaded and inaccurate term 'trans children.'

Now schools that referred to children as 'trans' will hopefully update their terminology.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/12/2023 11:24

I suspect that all the teachers / Headteachers who've been on the airwaves reinforcing their determination to keep transitioning children without parental consent and insisting that teenage girls must share changing rooms with sad boys will find it quite difficult to justify their opposition to this guidance.

SerpentEndBench · 19/12/2023 11:23

I recall shoulds and musts in my dealings with educational guidelines many moons ago. The revolting teachers no doubt will point at the shoulds not being musts.

We shall see.

But I am pleased nevertheless with what we have been presented with today.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/12/2023 11:21

Jackiebrambles · 19/12/2023 11:18

I mean if teachers don’t follow the guidelines/ guidance then surely they will be subject to some kind of sanction. They can’t just refuse with no consequences can they?!

Schools are expected to follow non statutory guidance (it actually states that in the document) and IF they choose not to then they must be able to evidence why very clearly.
So abandoning safeguarding this group of vulnerable children because adult transactivists are cross really won't cut it.

ResisterRex · 19/12/2023 11:21

I don't disagree @Hurrydash but anyone seeking to reverse this will have to formally do so. That's if this document is adopted after consultation, of course.

Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 11:19

In reply to Hurrydash

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Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 11:18

I don't know; I think the more the specific safeguarding issues are spelt out and the litigation against the dfe comes through, they will find it harder to reverse the premises set out in the guidelines which are very reasonable.

Especially as nhs training materials are moving back to evidence based, not affirming immediately and more exploration.

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Jackiebrambles · 19/12/2023 11:18

I mean if teachers don’t follow the guidelines/ guidance then surely they will be subject to some kind of sanction. They can’t just refuse with no consequences can they?!

Hurrydash · 19/12/2023 11:14

EdgeOfACoin · 19/12/2023 11:02

It will be interesting to see Labour's reaction.

Can only think, based on their previous drivel, Labour will reverse all of this after the next GE.

So unless the country stops them coming to power, this is probably a false dawn for vulnerable children's well being - and parents chances to protect them.

ResisterRex · 19/12/2023 11:13

WarriorN · 19/12/2023 11:07

Teachers are already telling Gillian Keegan they will be ignoring the guidelines.

x.com/gilliankeegan/status/1737055920897548607?s=46&t=A2fpFNgDRyXF2d6ye97wEA

Operation Let Them Speak

EasternStandard · 19/12/2023 11:12

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/12/2023 11:11

The guidance is well written I think - clearly holding the line about facts and reality and centring children's needs and safeguarding. I ilked this about pronouns:
"It is expected that there will be very few occasions in which a school or college will be able to agree to a change of pronouns. On these rare occasions, no teacher or pupil should be compelled to use these preferred pronouns and it should not prevent teachers from referring to children collectively as ‘girls’ or ‘boys,’ even in the presence of a child that has been allowed to change their pronouns".

Brilliant, this was a key question for me

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/12/2023 11:11

The guidance is well written I think - clearly holding the line about facts and reality and centring children's needs and safeguarding. I ilked this about pronouns:
"It is expected that there will be very few occasions in which a school or college will be able to agree to a change of pronouns. On these rare occasions, no teacher or pupil should be compelled to use these preferred pronouns and it should not prevent teachers from referring to children collectively as ‘girls’ or ‘boys,’ even in the presence of a child that has been allowed to change their pronouns".

EasternStandard · 19/12/2023 11:08

WarriorN · 19/12/2023 11:07

Teachers are already telling Gillian Keegan they will be ignoring the guidelines.

x.com/gilliankeegan/status/1737055920897548607?s=46&t=A2fpFNgDRyXF2d6ye97wEA

I wonder if they think about parents seeing tweets knowing schools won’t follow guidance

Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 11:07

Teachers are already telling Gillian Keegan they will be ignoring the guidelines.

x.com/gilliankeegan/status/1737055920897548607?s=46&t=A2fpFNgDRyXF2d6ye97wEA

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EdgeOfACoin · 19/12/2023 11:02

It will be interesting to see Labour's reaction.

EdgeOfACoin · 19/12/2023 11:02

Robust stuff! Excellent!

Feathers Will Be Ruffled.

Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 10:58

It's clear that changing pronouns at secondary level is a big deal with lots of discussion and many adults involved. And schools can refuse.

More gate keeping

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HipTightOnions · 19/12/2023 10:57

FFS q9 of the consultation response form:

  1. Is the gender you identify with the same as your sex registered at birth?
[ ] Yes [ ] No [ ] Prefer not to say
EasternStandard · 19/12/2023 10:55

ZeldaFighter · 19/12/2023 10:43

Am I reading this right? Pretty much every part of transitioning has been banned, with sex-based data, single-sex provision and single-sex sports. Is it Christmas already???

Sounds good

Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 10:47

Very clear on pronouns not being used at primary age level

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Original poster
WarriorN · 19/12/2023 10:47

It's terfmas 😎

It's also the anniversary of JK's infamous tweet! 4 years!

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