Size 18 "Praised for Beautiful Body"

I'm talking about all men in public eye. Actors, etc.

Excellent post, @Fukuraptor

The problem about going on about the health outcomes of living with obesity is that feeling ashamed and judged of our large bodies doesn't actually help us eat nourishing food and stay/get active.

As a very large person who desperately wants to go into my 40s at a healthy weight, concerned about mobility and wider health problems - trying to stay active but struggling with impulse control/habits/emotional binge eating...

Seeing larger people represented in media is not so much about celebrating the fact of being large, it's about still being seen as people rather than a before picture - not waiting to be skinny (which may never happen) to live our lives, to love and be loved. Accepting the reality of where we are, rather than hiding away from the world because we feel unacceptable and eating our feelings.

There's lots of unhealthy, self destructive behaviours and lifestyles - it just so happens that when you overeat it is so visible to other people and it is such a lagging indicator that even when you have months of eating well and being active, you can still look like someone's idea of "unhealthy" whilst the slim for now folk could be eating fast food and sweets and it just doesn't show yet.

And that's before you get to all the obesogenic environment /society stuff that is out of our control. Dr Chris van Tulleken's book on ultra processed people is good on that side of things.

I can’t speak for these models but definitely know people in real life who have surprisingly flat-ish stomachs despite being very plus sized and relatively slim faces like Ashley Graham.

Maintaining the look of a “regular” model definitely does not require being healthy - and very often it involves anorexia, bulimia and suppression of diet through coke and other harmful substances. Many of them also have cosmetic enhancements not sure why you’re singling out plus sized models? They’re no more artificial or airbrushed than other models.

We need to remember skinny or even slim does not equal healthy.

The problem in the 90s was pushing excessively skinny as the standard. I’d argue that fat shaming was worse then. People would put on a bit of weight and the tabloids would go wild. I knew slim girls with curvy bodies who would be slammed for having a “fat ass” in school/college. You had to be skinny and straight up and down. Even Tyra Banks (and other judges) who was quite curvy herself would make unflattering comments about slightly curvy contestants on Americas Top Model in the early noughties. Very few plus sized models back then and most shops didn’t cater for plus sized.
Yes, concerns eventually began to be raised at the sheer level of emaciated and gaunt looking models walking down the catwalk, but that was the correct thing to do IMO. I really don’t see how that can be called skinny shaming. And I say that as someone who was a size 6 -8 in the 90s/noughties. Many of these models have since spoken out to reveal how unhealthy their diet was to get to that size, so it wasn’t just a simple case of that was their natural figure. Things have surely improved since then.

I’m not necessarily advocated for everyone and all models to be plus sized but we don’t need a return to the 90s either.

I know a few women who have competed as bodybuilders, very strong very muscular women.

You should hear some of the repulsive things said about them.

And yes, they have unrealistic bodies- the time and work that’s gone into looking the way they do at competition time isn’t even sustainable for them.

But having moved so far from what is seen as conventionally attractive for a woman seems to allow so many people to openly call them disgusting.

Beauty standards are really narrow. If you chose to make a living fitting into them that’s up to you but I hate companies who celebrate “real women” but only by saying “it’s ok, blokes will fancy you as well! Even though you look like that!”

There’s nothing wrong with wanting to be attractive but it’s not the be all and end all of being a woman.

Agree.
This woman is still being valued only for her appearance, which seems to happen much more to women than men.
How many times has a woman been told by some obnoxious, oversensitive git that they're not fanciable anyway (or some other such 'devastating' putdown), because as far as some people are concerned we are only good for decoration or entertainment.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

It's the same for slim models though as well isn't it, their bodies invariably conform to the same standard- tall, long legs, certain proportions; its a wider issue in modelling really. Models bodies are invariably chosen to be aspirational even though they're unobtainable no matter how much someone diets/has surgery- same is the case with plus size models.

As a health care professional I’m quite uncomfortable about the body positive ‘sexy & beautiful at any size’ message promoted at the moment!

You're brave! I do think it's tricky though as of course people who are overweight shouldn't be seen as lesser and should be empowered to feel confident etc, but it shouldn't be an excuse to neglect health to the point it becomes an issue. Not sure of the answer really, most people know if they're overweight and many do try and address it even if they herald the inclusion of more visibility for overweight women- invariably there's more going on than just being able to eat less and there isn't really any support in this country.

It's a reaction to the anorexia pushing 90's though isn't it. Just as life threatening and terrible for people's mental health trying to be stick thin.

Promoting healthy is key. Not size.

Maybe just stop judging women on the appearance / weight like its the pinnacle of their life's achievement 🙄🙄🙄

Most plus size models have lipo on certain areas, it’s all a scam. Agencies like them to have: Chin lipo - no double chins allowed. Waist lipo, upper arm lipo and often lipo round the knee area.
Its just as unrealistic and contrived as size zero models.

Th fashion industry exists to sell crap overpriced clothes and other sundries to women, they will use any low down cheap and dishonest means to do that =feminist issue.
most women, more than 50% of women in the western world are overweight, either by a few lbs like myself or morbidly, it makes sense to advertise to the people you’re selling to.
Personally I don’t agree with glamourising obesity, it’s bad for individuals health and society as a whole.
I think it’s worrying these images are being more normalised and as most modelling pics are not based in reality, these girls have probably had surgeries or are wearing fat pads in the right places.
At least the heroin chic anorexic look was really how starving women look and if you did aspire to that it was achievable if you put the work in, I know because I did it, I was Ill and miserable and I’m not advocating for it but It was more honest and could be achieved without going under the knife.
I could eat myself to a plus size, I’m tiny frame, I’ve got a pretty face but my weight does not go on in the proportions you see in these pictures and I very rarely see overweight women who look like this.
We have no concept of what is normal weight and size now, the average person is bigger than is good for the health, I’m 1 stone over weight and I still look small to most people and get mocked if I say I’m fasting or trying to lose weight.

As a health care professional I’m quite uncomfortable about the body positive ‘sexy & beautiful at any size’ message promoted at the moment!

It’s a health time bomb just waiting to go off. So many of my patients have weight related issues and you might be fine to carry 4 or 5 extra stones in your 20s-30s but eventually by the time your in mid 40s probably, you will have mobility issues, joint pain etc. And that’s before we mention the more serious aspects of CHD, diabetes, cancer etc. Obviously those of a normal weight suffer these too but being very over weight vast increases your risk . We all know this but I feel young people are being given the wrong messages about body image !

While it’s good that there are plus size models as we do come in many shapes and sizes, we need to be very careful about sending out the wrong messages! We are an over weight population and as we continue to get bigger out NHS will struggle more and more to deal with the consequences!

Maybe some people think this is beauty.
I just see someone who is killing themselves with food. I see a morbidly obese young woman who will age rapidly and will struggle to make it beyond 65 without being in constant pain.
I see a massive drain on the NHS as people emulate this trend and don’t take any responsibility for their health

50 years ago smoking was considered sexy and attractive. I have witnessed too many friends live with the consequences of smoking. Spending years not realising how much smoking restricted their lives and then dying relatively young

Greed is now the sexy and attractive trend and like smoking people will spend years of their life being a prisoner to their greed and then they will die at a young age.

Most plus sized models have liposuction and liposculpture to give them shapely waists, slimmer cheeks, and to remove double chins. Ashley Graham is rumoured to have had a lot of sculpting work done. It is completely unrealistic for the average obese/overweight woman to look like a plus-sized model, without absurd amounts of cosmetic enhancements.

If we have to acknowledge that maintaining the body of a regular model would require some degree of a healthy lifestyle and/or diet control, we should acknowledge that's it's not naturally possible to be overweight and have a flat stomach and a defined face.

There is also a massive double standard: back in the noughties was the height of skinny shaming, with bodies under a BMI of 18.5 considered wrong and not fit for public consumption. Models of this body type were banned from catwalks (even though at that time, many models were teenagers, when the cut off for a healthy BMI is actually 16.7). Women who are underweight are just as "real" and deserving of representation as other women.

It is appalling that a woman's body can be considered dangerous to look at, and weaponizes and grossly over-simplifies anorexia in order to banish women with imperfect bodies. They would never dream of banning women with a BMI over 25, even though constant exposure to the appearance of overweight people is distorting what is perceived as normal and healthy.

Wow a size 6 or whatever of a Victoria secret model is not the representative of an average slim woman of that size. I don't see why this is controversial. Shape, tone and a beautiful face were always going to be a winner. Its not a feminist issue. Its an aesthetic issue. Even in men, a size 30 waist doesn't look the same on all men. A man with narrow shoulders vs a wide shoulder will make the same jeans size look very different and one will be more conventionally attractive. Its biologically hardwired to like a slimmer waist and Good muscle tone
Hardly controversial.

I'm not sure what is unrealistic about her body, every part of it is over weight and her breasts are far from pert. I've seen a lot if plus sized models with far better and enviable figures. To me this is just an overweight lady in a bikini.

She looks good. Very glamorous. She is quite fat though and at her age could get fatter. I am not sure that plus size body positivity is such a good idea. It normalises being overweight and even encourages it when it is unhealthy.

Difficult to find the balance these days though.

She's far more than a size 18

And notice that there is no weight on the faces of these plus sized models - they all carry theirr weight on their body, not face.

It's not cool to look like a pie face

You don't see many old fat wrinkly male models.

Honestly, I have a hard time caring about this.

Models are meant to be nice to look at. They are, whatever their side, going to be people who are better looking than average. The things most people find better looking are similar - being symmetrical, pleasing proportions, smooth skin and healthy hair, and lots of the other things people have noted.

I don't think it's immoral to acknowledge that some people are more beautiful than average. And I don't think it's odd that advertising models would be chosen from people who are attractive to look at.

There is some distortion going on here - I don't believe this person is a size 18.

I'm 40odd 4foot 10 and a size 12/14 on top and a 16 on the bottom, no idea of weight I have never owned a scales. I have the body of a reject lego man, like the top of me has been slotted into the bottom if you see what I mean, The tops of my arms are gross&flabby like a flying squirrel, I have smallish boobs 36c, a flatish(3 c sections) belly, huge hips, huge arse and thighs, but I am healthy and my diet is good(mostly) it's just my shape.
Women are all shapes and sizes and that is fine, I don't get the obsession with weight and making other women feel inferior because they are too fat or too thin. Why do some women want to tear each other apart based on what the scales say?

The point is that the 'alternative' models still aren't typical.

There's still beauty standards at play.

You don't get plus size models with a large gunt over hang do you?

I agree this is fucking ridiculous. You have to be pretty in any shape, form, age - whatever you are, its fine, as long as you are PRETTY. Men, in general, can be old, fat, ugly, wrinkly - but wow, they are so cool, so authentic, so intelligent, it doesn't matter. Women - no. PRETTY.

Something that really annoys me about most of the body positivity movement is that it's still all about how women look. Does it really help when people post glamorous, photoshopped pictures of themselves in an attempt to prove that women who are overweight can still be approved by society? Many of the looks depicted require so much money and time that they are often as unattainable for most of the women as slimmer figures! Why can't we focus on what women of all sizes think, do or create, and get rid of this tyrannical idea that the only possible way to be worth anything is a woman is to be a beautiful one. Then perhaps we might have detoxified the conversation about weight to the point where we can talk about health and obseogenic environments in a more sensible way.