Page 12 | Butches against transpohobia

Catsanfan · 2023-10-24T15:09:00+00:00

I saw a woman wearing a T shirt saying 'Butches against transphobia' today. It astounds me that some lesbians would think that way. I wonder what she would do if presented with a penis on a date?

StarlightLime · 25/10/2023 13:33

DadJoke · 25/10/2023 13:31

I can do better, I can tell you a rights that transgender people already have which GC people want to remove, for example, the right to use bathrooms and changing rooms which match their gender, as they currently do.

I sure you can come up with lots of reasons why you oppose these rights, but they are existing rights.

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No, that's not a "better" answer; it doesn't address the question 🙄

DadJoke · 25/10/2023 13:31

StarlightLime · 25/10/2023 13:23

The view that you should only support the rights of particular groups because you are willing to date them is really quite repellent
Can you explain what rights trans people are currently being denied, @DadJoke? What does supporting their rights actually look like in practice?

Edited

I can do better, I can tell you a rights that transgender people already have which GC people want to remove, for example, the right to use bathrooms and changing rooms which match their gender, as they currently do.

I sure you can come up with lots of reasons why you oppose these rights, but they are existing rights.

StarlightLime · 25/10/2023 13:23

The view that you should only support the rights of particular groups because you are willing to date them is really quite repellent
Can you explain what rights trans people are currently being denied, @DadJoke? What does supporting their rights actually look like in practice?

Flickersy · 25/10/2023 13:19

forgotmyusername1 · 25/10/2023 12:55

But would you have been suprised to have gone to bed with your boyfriend for the first time and find out that your boyfriend had a vagina.

You assumed your boyfriend had a penis and that is a reasonable assumption to make. What if they didn't?

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Well, as everyone on here says: "we can always tell".

So the situation would never arise.

ArabellaScott · 25/10/2023 13:18

DadJoke · 25/10/2023 11:40

Source for favourable views of transgender people by non-trans lesbians:
https://yougov.co.uk/society/articles/45983-what-do-lesbian-gay-bisexual-and-transgender-brito

Note non-trans lesbians have a more favourable view of transgender people than any other group. The idea that they have been "pressurised" into this view suggests a very low opinion of lesbians. Consider that it's the six percent who are the ones who have been radicalised. There is a reason that, under oath, the LGB Alliance admitted that only 6% of their supporters were lesbians.

The view that you should only support the rights of particular groups because you are willing to date them is really quite repellent. Peoples' dating preferences are their own. You can support marriage equality without wanting to marry someone of the same gender.

Finally, one of the arguments against gay marriage was that it destroyed the definition of marriage for straight fundie Christians, whereas it had no impact at all. The same argument applies to people who object to trans women who are lesbians.

Lesbians particularly love it when blokes argue on their behalf, I hear.

Wanderingowl · 25/10/2023 13:17

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 11:42

I don't have the link handy but I saw an interesting article that first states over half of the population are against LGBT rights. But then it breaks it down by age which shows the vast majority are middle-aged and elderly, with all the younger generations supportive and becoming more and more supportive each generation.

Which means in just one more generation there will be a huge change.

Could you maybe get that link, I'd be quite interested to read it and the data it's based off because it absolutely flies in the face of all current polling which shows that the younger generations, especially the boys, are increasingly conservative in their opinions on gender identity and (unfortunately) homosexuality. There are signs that there is some very real anger brewing in the kids that are being exposed to this ideology. So if you've got a link to some actual data showing the opposite, I'd be incredibly interested to see it.

Essenceofpetunia · 25/10/2023 13:13

Yes, I thought that was a rather unfortunate choice of username too @StarlightLime.

PorcelinaV · 25/10/2023 13:12

PlanetJanette · 25/10/2023 09:14

That is precisely the point.

Lesbians are being told - very often by straight people - what their lesbianism has to mean. It's BS. That is straightforward policing of women's sexuality.

Lesbians get to decide what their sexual or romantic boundaries are - no one else.

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If someone claims to be an atheist, but they also claim to believe in Zeus and Apollo etc., are we allowed to police the meaning of "atheism" or would that be some terrible act of gatekeeping people's spirituality?

StarlightLime · 25/10/2023 13:09

Could you get any more "she's" and "hers" into your post about a male rapist @Stephannee ??
Interesting username, btw 🤮

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 13:07

The "case by case basis" that operated in Scotland, had somehow resulted in double the amount of MTF trans prisoners in the female estate, as a proportion of all of them, than England.

Original poster

Catsanfan · 25/10/2023 13:05

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 11:39

Re the prison issue and IB, trans women aren't automatically put in a woman's prison it's decided on a case by case basis (as is what happened with IB).

She was being held in a woman's prison only while waiting for the decision where she would end up serving her time, in there she was in isolation and kept separate from the prison population. There was a lot of misleading articles on this which left these facts out.

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So you are happy with rapists in women's prisons. OK. And do you think Lia Thomas has an advantage against his, sorry her, competitors?

OP posts:

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 13:05

It would be interesting to do a nationwide poll to find out how many people have ever got naked with a new partner for the first time to discover a vagina when they were expecting a penis or a penis when they were expecting a vagina.

I'm imagining the number of people who have experienced this is probably incredibly low.

forgotmyusername1 · 25/10/2023 12:55

Flickersy · 24/10/2023 16:34

"Presented with a penis" is such a strange expression to be fair. It makes it seem like some posters think that's how TW say hello. Perhaps an alternative to shaking hands.

I've only ever dated men and I don't think I've ever been "presented with a penis". I did have one ex at uni who tied a bow round it one Christmas when we were both pissed.. maybe that counts?

But would you have been suprised to have gone to bed with your boyfriend for the first time and find out that your boyfriend had a vagina.

You assumed your boyfriend had a penis and that is a reasonable assumption to make. What if they didn't?

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 12:46

OneMorePlant · 25/10/2023 12:44

Let's be real there wasn't a question mark over which prison he would go to. He was going to go into the women's. It just happened 9 days after that new gender law that JK Rowling put on full blast and it blew up so much and went viral in the news that politicians had to intervene and send him to the men's trying to save face.

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Yup.

I'm glad it blew up in their faces.

Why does no one have the balls to say, "No, you cannot identify as a woman if you have used your penis to rape women, the two things are incompatible. Now off you fuck to the men's estate."

OneMorePlant · 25/10/2023 12:44

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 12:41

Absurd, isn't it?

Why was there ever a question mark over which prison he would be going to?

It's about time we made it illegal for sex offenders to change their name, their gender or anything else about their identity.

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Let's be real there wasn't a question mark over which prison he would go to. He was going to go into the women's. It just happened 9 days after that new gender law that JK Rowling put on full blast and it blew up so much and went viral in the news that politicians had to intervene and send him to the men's trying to save face.

bombastix · 25/10/2023 12:43

aswarmofmidges · 25/10/2023 12:22

Gender critical may well be the default in a few more generations

Gender restrictive is so old school - encouraging people to change their bodies to fit gender expectations is horrific and the current approach to transgender will be seen to be a sticking plaster attempt on a flawed society

Yea it is! I remember working on a case for years ago where the client was from Iran. Client was definitely gay but had asked to seek to transition as part on appeal. I explained that this wouldn't make much difference to his case but it was explained that transgender women had a much better time and were accepted in Iran. I explained that the UK was not like that. However, that was 15 years ago. Things have changed.

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 12:41

OneMorePlant · 25/10/2023 12:36

Oh the male double rapist was "only" put in the woman's prison while waiting to find out where he was going to be doing his full sentence. That makes it ok then don't it... 😡

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Absurd, isn't it?

Why was there ever a question mark over which prison he would be going to?

It's about time we made it illegal for sex offenders to change their name, their gender or anything else about their identity.

lifeturnsonadime · 25/10/2023 12:38

All I see is a load of anti women crap on here again.

It's not anti LGB to say no to men.

OneMorePlant · 25/10/2023 12:36

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 11:39

Re the prison issue and IB, trans women aren't automatically put in a woman's prison it's decided on a case by case basis (as is what happened with IB).

She was being held in a woman's prison only while waiting for the decision where she would end up serving her time, in there she was in isolation and kept separate from the prison population. There was a lot of misleading articles on this which left these facts out.

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Oh the male double rapist was "only" put in the woman's prison while waiting to find out where he was going to be doing his full sentence. That makes it ok then don't it... 😡

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 12:34

aswarmofmidges · 25/10/2023 12:24

Are people really against lgbt rights in the uk?

Which particular rights ?

Only the "right" for male people to be housed in women's prisons, compete in women's sports or use women's toilets and changing rooms if they still have a penis, as far as I can tell.

None of which concerns LGB people.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 12:31

I'm fairly convinced from their posts that Stephannee is no spring chicken themselves, so good luck with that.

aswarmofmidges · 25/10/2023 12:24

Are people really against lgbt rights in the uk?

Which particular rights ?

Wearingmybluejumper · 25/10/2023 12:23

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 11:42

I don't have the link handy but I saw an interesting article that first states over half of the population are against LGBT rights. But then it breaks it down by age which shows the vast majority are middle-aged and elderly, with all the younger generations supportive and becoming more and more supportive each generation.

Which means in just one more generation there will be a huge change.

Aside from the fact that your post is terribly ageist and implies that you just need to wait for us old codgers to cark it I doubt it is accurate. In Australia the plebiscite was decidedly infavour of marriage equality By around 60 % of the population.

aswarmofmidges · 25/10/2023 12:22

Gender critical may well be the default in a few more generations

Gender restrictive is so old school - encouraging people to change their bodies to fit gender expectations is horrific and the current approach to transgender will be seen to be a sticking plaster attempt on a flawed society

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 11:58

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 11:52

Everyone's opinion matters. My point is times are changing even though there still seems like there's a long way to go. The next generation will be different, go forward two generations and the forecast appears to say the "gender critical" movement just won't exist at all except a couple of lonely voices here and there. The UK and Ireland may one day catch up with the rest of W and Central Europe.

What percentage of the LGB-Alliance are actually LGB again? Oh yeah, 7%.

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If everyone's opinion matters, why is the opinion that women don't have penises, which is not only an opinion shared by the vast majority of people but also not an opinion at all and actually a fact, so roundly dismissed by people like you?

LGB Alliance is around 80% LGB, according to the best data they have on their membership.