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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Literally putting words in JKR's mouth.

88 replies

Pudmyboy · 21/10/2023 19:34

https://unherd.com/?post_type=thepost&p=488325
Article in Unheard, JKR being 'interviewed' on her views on her views an Australian trans artist taking the part of JKR with 'cis' person taking the part of the 'trans' interviewer.......I cannot believe this is not slanderous! Or libelous if it's written for all to see......can this really go unchallenged by any legal or ethical avenue?

New play features 'interview' with JK Rowling over her trans views

This week, Melbourne Fringe will host An Evening with JK. For just $28 a head, theatregoers will finally be able to hear how “one of the world’s most celebrated authors become one of the most hated,” as JK Rowling sits down for an “exclusive, hard-hitt...

https://unherd.com/?p=488325&post_type=thepost

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Emotionalsupportviper · 15/03/2024 20:24

TheGreatATuin · 21/10/2023 20:41

It looks like an extremely long version of the old twitter response of 'oh so what you're actually saying is...' and then an army of strawmen come marching in.
If Scott bothered to put JKRs actual words on stage (and iirc her terf wars essay was 3000 words plus so plenty of material) and then used that as a 'debate', then it might be interesting, but what's the point in this?

Indeed.

But I am struck by this:

"In an interview with The Age, Scott said: “If we all stay quiet until it’s safe to talk about it, it’s going to just become more and more unsafe to talk about. I have to say something now — I think everyone has to say something now”

Scott is right. We women all stayed quiet (though we were "being kind") thinking it would be safe, and look where it got us. The TRAs aren't going to fall for their own tactic.

Putting words into JKR's mouth is not only deeply underhand, but shows that they haven't got any real ones they can use against her. We've never made up anything implying they have said it (in fairness, we haven't had to - they have said plenty)

And agree re: "gotten". What an appalling abuse of the English language.

Wantthisfriend · 15/03/2024 19:56

Pudmyboy · 21/10/2023 20:15

I love this, I am wishing for a crowd outside the theatre dressed as Anne Piper Scott all wearing 'Woman: Adult Human Female' t-shirts and holding up 'I ❤️JKR' placards!

I'm game if you are! Prints tshirt with glee...

Pudmyboy · 27/10/2023 19:11

MassiveWordSalad · 26/10/2023 11:08

The 'personal concern for children' that JKR, a woman, mother, survivor of domestic abuse and founder of Lumos (children's charity) and Beira's Place (sexual violence support service for women) espouses is actually just transphobia 😨

Did he actually read that review back to himself??

Brilliant!

OP posts:
ApocalipstickNow · 27/10/2023 18:07

I’d just make sure that every time I had a knobhead background character in my books I’d call them Scott.

Froodwithatowel · 27/10/2023 17:58

Oh bring that on..... glorious, glorious sunshine all over the national press. I am so sick of people with their alternative reality fantasy worlds stamping their feet, the answer is blunt, blunt facts and proof. You cannot make a fantasist get back in touch with the ground, but you can make sure that the real world realises what's going on and maintains firm boundaries.

snurtifier · 27/10/2023 14:08

Call me cynical but I wonder if this whole exercise is deliberately intended to provoke JKR to take legal action, so that they can then say 'Wah! We are the real victims of cancel culture!'

ARockIsASlowSlowCooledOffFlameAndACradle · 27/10/2023 13:48

Reminds me of the vidoes I used to watch at youth group where some beardy preacher would script and act the part of a Wiccan, an atheist and a new ager.

PingoDome · 26/10/2023 17:09

'A beloved children’s author who is now so ubiquitous that she exists as a kind of shorthand for feminism, the woes of cancel culture, a personal concern for children.'

There we go, shorter, better, and still the reviewer's own words. That's obviously what he-him meant, after all.

MassiveWordSalad · 26/10/2023 11:08

The 'personal concern for children' that JKR, a woman, mother, survivor of domestic abuse and founder of Lumos (children's charity) and Beira's Place (sexual violence support service for women) espouses is actually just transphobia 😨

Did he actually read that review back to himself??

MassiveWordSalad · 26/10/2023 11:03

I've said it before and will probably say it again, but that review really brought it home again that people who buy into this ideology really don't care about women.

It simply doesn't compute that women have needs specific to their biology and that we have had to fight against misogyny since the dawn of patriarchy. They don't see us as people with the right or capacity to speak for ourselves, do they? They don't see the irony of whining 'transphobia!' at a class of people who have never reached the standing the men have. It just blows my mind. They acknowledge feminism exists, but if it doesn't include men then we're doing it wrong 🤯

JanesLittleGirl · 24/10/2023 20:32

No matter how much you polish a turd, it is still a turd.

Datun · 24/10/2023 19:28

Even a dyed in the wool TRA couldn't quite pull off an enthusiastic review.

This 🤣

Very damning !

MargotBamborough · 24/10/2023 15:07

As if JKR has "gender euphoria", I mean, FGS really.

PermanentTemporary · 24/10/2023 15:02

'Jk's gender euphoria while using a male pen name'?

I actually would quite like to see it, just to see if it's as bad as the reviewer makes it sound. It does sound exactly like the pretend conversations I have in my head when I'm imagining I'm Secretary of State for Health and being interviewed on Today. TL:DR - I'm amazing in those interviews and Nick Robinson and indeed the nation falls back in admiration at my powerful intellect.

Froodwithatowel · 24/10/2023 14:16

And tomorrow I shall be identifying as Stonewall. And sorting out their messaging.

Froodwithatowel · 24/10/2023 14:15

SoundTheSirens · 23/10/2023 12:46

So basically this is "wah wah wah, we can't get the real JK Rowling to change her [completely sensible and reasonable] words no matter how much our supporters cry and stamp their feet and wave placards and send her death threats, so we're going to pretend she meant what she would have needed to have said to justify in our eyes the absolute shit-load of unrelenting abuse TRAs have unleashed upon her."

Yup.

I will wait with interest, JK's lawyers must have really entertaining careers and I wonder what new resources she will set up with the compensation when she's sued the arse off this twit?

On the plus side, I think here's our answer. We just all identify as the Labour Party. We'll do all the speeches, we'll deliver the manifesto, and we'll turn Labour sane and electable overnight. Cos if we speak for them, that'll make it all real, right?

Thelnebriati · 24/10/2023 13:42

If they can't cow you they'll say things about you. And then blame you for it.
Abusers are the same everywhere, its like they have a handbook.

MargotBamborough · 24/10/2023 13:26

SamW98 · 24/10/2023 13:17

From that review

A once beloved children’s author who is now so ubiquitous with hate that she exists as a kind of shorthand for a worldwide backlash against trans people. What makes her transphobia so insidious is that it’s packaged as something else: feminism, the woes of cancel culture, a personal concern for children

They seriously believe this shit they wrote do they?

Edited

I think they just see everything through the prism of "trans rights".

We see it all the time in the mainstream media. Every time JKR says something about women's rights, it is reported as her "views on trans rights", often with an adjective such as "controversial" even though nothing she says is actually all that controversial.

It's as though they can't understand how someone can take a view on something like women's rights or child safeguarding, which has an impact on some of the things trans people want, without putting what trans people want front and centre, as the primary consideration.

If you say, as I think most people would, if pushed, "Yes I agree that trans people should have equal rights and be protected from transphobic hate, but I don't agree that they are more important than women or children, and when someone's wish to be seen as their preferred gender has a negative impact on women or children I think the women or children's needs should be prioritised", they cannot cope.

IcakethereforeIam · 24/10/2023 13:19

Yup, 'concern for children' is actually transphobic hate!

SamW98 · 24/10/2023 13:17

IcakethereforeIam · 24/10/2023 10:35

Here's a Time Out review by Guy Webster (he/him), a Melbourne Arts faculty academic

https://www.timeout.com/melbourne/theatre/an-evening-with-jk

The only review I could find.

From that review

A once beloved children’s author who is now so ubiquitous with hate that she exists as a kind of shorthand for a worldwide backlash against trans people. What makes her transphobia so insidious is that it’s packaged as something else: feminism, the woes of cancel culture, a personal concern for children

They seriously believe this shit they wrote do they?

Tinysoxxx · 24/10/2023 13:08

It sounds nasty and threatening to incite hatred/ violence to be honest. But it’s difficult without knowing if it’s a neutral review.

Guy Webster, the guy reviewing states: ‘My doctorate theorises the aesthetic function of the fear experience for early 20th century authors associated with the modernist movement.’

So he’s studying the fear experience. It would be interesting for him to study authors’ real fear experiences associated with the trans ideology movement. How many have the very unaesthetic fear of losing their livelihoods as hate and threats are piled on them for the mere mention of women’s rights.

MargotBamborough · 24/10/2023 11:08

IcakethereforeIam · 24/10/2023 10:35

Here's a Time Out review by Guy Webster (he/him), a Melbourne Arts faculty academic

https://www.timeout.com/melbourne/theatre/an-evening-with-jk

The only review I could find.

It sounds absolutely dire.

Even a dyed in the wool TRA couldn't quite pull off an enthusiastic review.

PermanentTemporary · 23/10/2023 22:24

OK having watched a few clips I don't think they're at the level of talent where any kind of breakthrough of understanding would be involved. Just wants to say how much more amazing a person they are than people with real achievements.

PermanentTemporary · 23/10/2023 22:09

I would love to know if there's even a moment of understanding that broke through for the author as they wrote it. Did they manage to do that? Writing is supposed to be painful and revelatory for the writer, after all.

I can't imagine it being illegal but I somehow doubt there was any breakthrough of connection. Missed opportunity.

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