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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

My local library won't be stocking Graham Linehan's "Tough Crowd". Anyone else had the same response?

131 replies

OccultGnuNew · 19/10/2023 15:52

I've been reading the ongoing discussion on Graham Linehan's book and decided to follow the suggestion within the thread and asked my local library about getting it into stock. I filled out the online form a couple of weeks ago.

Today I had a phone call from the library saying they were very sorry but wouldn't be adding it to their catalogue.

When asked why the response was "our supplier has given it a low rating". I asked for further clarification on what it was being rated as "low" on, the person on the phone didn't know but a low rating meant it wouldn't be being procured for the library.

I said I was aware the author had engaged with some controversial topics and was that the reason for the low rating? Again the person didn't know. I also asked for an example of a book with a high rating and again - don't know - the rating system is applied by the supplier not the library and the library uses the ratings as a guide.

I don't think the person on the phone was being obstructive, they evidently did not know the ins and outs of the rating system and how it was applied and were just passing on the information.

The supplier our library uses is Askews. I'm in a town with a population of 200,000 that has around 15 libraries and I've seen some of the crap they keep on the shelves. Why this is being declined I'm not sure,

Has anyone else come across this?

OP posts:
socialdilemmawhattodo · 19/10/2023 18:17

I've just checked Kent County Council (county-wide library service) and there is 1 book on order via Canterbury Library. (Do you think Rosie D ordered it?)

Brokendaughter · 19/10/2023 18:12

rocknrollaa · 19/10/2023 17:06

People are being a bit hysterical talking about censorship.

Libraries don't stock every single book that is ever published - if only they had that kind of funding!

I haven't even heard of this book, it's got 95 reviews on Amazon, it's not exactly a massive bestseller.

It will be because of that, not because of its content.

If you want it then request it, if enough people request it then they'll get it.

This book is in the top 1,500 books on Amazon uk in both the Kindle & Hardcover sections, in the top 100 for each of the categories it is placed in (which are fairly mainstream categories that are hard to get into the top 100 ranking).

Based on current data from Amazon uk, it's selling an average of 800 books per month (may have been higher on the first few days & may go lower in the next few weeks so that's just a snapshot based on the figures right now) for ebook (so about 27 copies a day) & another almost 200 hardbacks a month (half dozen copies a day), so it might not be selling like a new JKR book, but it's a decent enough release.

It has been out for 7 days & already has more reviews than most books ever get.

Most traditionally published books sell several hundred to a few thousand copies in the first year across all formats & this book is on track to do that.

That's just looking at book sales from Amazon uk, it may be available on other amazon stores around the world (but I haven't looked) - this is published wide, so there will also be sales from other sources like Kobo, Apple, Booktopia etc..- other book stockists like Waterstones, plus any libraries who take it on & so on.

This is not doing badly at all for a book that is most definitely facing a tough crowd from an author who doesn't have an established fan base of book buyers from previous releases to lean on.

Rudderneck · 19/10/2023 18:03

Creepybookworm · 19/10/2023 17:46

Libraries don't only buy things they know will be popular. They buy things to tick boxes for inclusivity even though they hardly ever go out. It's not unusual for us to be discarding books after 5 years that have only been out once or twice.

Yup.

But it is also the case that libraries can't buy every book. So there are always decisions being made.

I think even though they have the numbers in front of them, a lot of librarians believe in some faith based way that all of these books go out a ton.

Looking at their website, it looks like they are basically set up for libraries to outsource as much as possible to them, including book selection. I have no doubt that some libraries would pretty much take that approach.

Creepybookworm · 19/10/2023 17:46

Libraries don't only buy things they know will be popular. They buy things to tick boxes for inclusivity even though they hardly ever go out. It's not unusual for us to be discarding books after 5 years that have only been out once or twice.

Georgyporky · 19/10/2023 17:42

My library is part of a very large group of Councils in the London and adjoining areas.

I reserved this recently, & only Staines library in SCC is acquiring a copy.

My library used to have the facility to request a purchase, but the "new, improved" website has dropped this.

senua · 19/10/2023 17:29

rocknrollaa · 19/10/2023 17:22

@senua @TheMarzipanDildo It's still extreme to jump to the conclusion that it's censorship based on the OP. Libraries are so underfunded now that they'll only get stuff they know is going to be popular.

I'll be in town tomorrow so I'll pop into the library and ask them to get it in. That should help in the 'popularity' stakes.
Fingers crossed! They got Helen Joyce's Trans at my request.Smile

rocknrollaa · 19/10/2023 17:22

@senua @TheMarzipanDildo It's still extreme to jump to the conclusion that it's censorship based on the OP. Libraries are so underfunded now that they'll only get stuff they know is going to be popular.

TheMarzipanDildo · 19/10/2023 17:19

rocknrollaa · 19/10/2023 17:06

People are being a bit hysterical talking about censorship.

Libraries don't stock every single book that is ever published - if only they had that kind of funding!

I haven't even heard of this book, it's got 95 reviews on Amazon, it's not exactly a massive bestseller.

It will be because of that, not because of its content.

If you want it then request it, if enough people request it then they'll get it.

I wouldn’t be so sure re. censorship. Could be part of the reason you’ve not heard of it! It was a bestseller.

senua · 19/10/2023 17:17

@rocknrollaa
I haven't even heard of this book, it's got 95 reviews on Amazon, it's not exactly a massive bestseller.
It will be because of that, not because of its content.
Erm, it was only published on 12th October. It will be because of that!

Creepybookworm · 19/10/2023 17:12

Also just checked and we are awaiting our copy in another library in the county. So I have reserved it!

tedgran · 19/10/2023 17:10

London Borough of Richmond has got two copies and seven reserves.

Creepybookworm · 19/10/2023 17:09

Just a word of caution regarding donation. I work in a library and if someone donates a book we cannot add it to our stock unless it is already on the catalogue. If it's not already at another library in the county we can only sell it (very cheaply). We also use Askews and we get a lots of books about trans issues and very few copies of anything gender critical. That's not Askews though that's the buyers who work in HQ for the library service.

rocknrollaa · 19/10/2023 17:06

People are being a bit hysterical talking about censorship.

Libraries don't stock every single book that is ever published - if only they had that kind of funding!

I haven't even heard of this book, it's got 95 reviews on Amazon, it's not exactly a massive bestseller.

It will be because of that, not because of its content.

If you want it then request it, if enough people request it then they'll get it.

RhinestoneCowgirl · 19/10/2023 17:06

I'm in ultra 'be kind' Bristol and just checked LibrariesWest - two copies 'being acquired by the library'. I've added my name to the reservation list.

Jellycats4life · 19/10/2023 17:05

IwantToRetire · 19/10/2023 16:42

Call me quaint and old fashioned but wasn't one of the ideas of having local libraries was to allow local people access to information, ideas, etc., that might not be that well known. ie on a point of principle have 1 copy of an obscure book.

And secondly isn't the whole point of having a librarian is to have someone with knowledge of books etc..

How or why would a "supplier" be dictating what people can or cant have acess to. It would make more sense, if it was about how many sales, but a library isn't a book shop FFS!!

Are Libraries just meant to stock the 10 most popular books and nothing else?

I would suggest contacting a local councillor, but I suppose none of them would support having GL's book.

This seems to be a good tactic:

Write to his publisher, Eye Books - they will want to know this, and are in a much better position to find out from Askews.

I suspect this is the natural consequence of library funding being slashed to the point of having virtually no qualified librarians left at the local authority. So many libraries now are run by low paid assistants and unpaid volunteers.

This would account for the supplier doing the decision making re. new acquisitions. In my day there was a library professional making those decisions 🙄

SirVixofVixHall · 19/10/2023 17:04

PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/10/2023 16:28

This is actually really disturbing.

Agree.
i ordered a copy via Amazon but have had a message saying it is “delayed” . What is that about ?

Abhannmor · 19/10/2023 17:04

That's great @ProudHag . Some libraries won't accept donations. Mine wouldn't accept a book about Irish place-names , for example. I had bought 2 copies in error.

IsabelleSE19 · 19/10/2023 17:02

Not stocked in my council area, and interestingly when I searched his name it came back with a 'fuzzy search' hit, meaning that his name is misspelled in their catalogue. Too paranoid to think that could be deliberate?

My local library won't be stocking Graham Linehan's "Tough Crowd".  Anyone else had the same response?
DangerFrog · 19/10/2023 17:00

I think my local library uses Askews too and they've got a copy on order (small library, 250k population, wouldn't expect them to have lots of copies).

I seem to remember having a discussion about Askews ratings with a staff member before and it's not a barrier to purchasing. Purchasing staff may use it as part of their decision making process but the final decision rests with them.

GrouchyKiwi · 19/10/2023 16:57

I looked up my LA's library catalogue and it wasn't there so I have requested it (this is for the entirety of a Scottish Council Area, so not just one town).

TeaGinandFags · 19/10/2023 16:53

PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/10/2023 16:28

This is actually really disturbing.

This is censorship.

Email the library reminding them that they are a public service and you would like to borrow a copy of the book. They won't be as dismissive as they are on the phone.

Ask them explicitly if they are actively censoring books. They will enjoy answering that question. If you have no joy, consult with your local councillor and tell lies abput your connections to the local rag.

Good luck. Tell us how you get on.

Newlittlerescue · 19/10/2023 16:45

Kent Libraries: one copy, five reserves

ifIwerenotanandroid · 19/10/2023 16:42

Odd that it would have a low rating when it was/is a bestseller.

IwantToRetire · 19/10/2023 16:42

Call me quaint and old fashioned but wasn't one of the ideas of having local libraries was to allow local people access to information, ideas, etc., that might not be that well known. ie on a point of principle have 1 copy of an obscure book.

And secondly isn't the whole point of having a librarian is to have someone with knowledge of books etc..

How or why would a "supplier" be dictating what people can or cant have acess to. It would make more sense, if it was about how many sales, but a library isn't a book shop FFS!!

Are Libraries just meant to stock the 10 most popular books and nothing else?

I would suggest contacting a local councillor, but I suppose none of them would support having GL's book.

This seems to be a good tactic:

Write to his publisher, Eye Books - they will want to know this, and are in a much better position to find out from Askews.

Mochudubh · 19/10/2023 16:35

I can't log in to my library account just now as I don't have my number on me but I checked the catalogue and not one single copy.

I shall be putting in a request.