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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

JKRowling. Prepared to go to prison for women's rights.

165 replies

Cismyfatarse · 18/10/2023 20:34

Share token here:

JK Rowling: I’ll happily go to prison for women’s rights

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32d91356-6d9b-11ee-b5d7-5487922f056f?shareToken=f1594da48d0791b9d9a9e2a6cd8965c2. Hopefully this works for everyone. She really is a Queen.

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SidewaysOtter · 26/10/2023 14:58

RedToothBrush · 26/10/2023 14:05

Cos they aren't very good at research or thinking.

They haven't been encouraged to think. Parrot the rhetoric you're given, toe the line and be a good little gender ideologist. To do otherwise is to be cast out for heresy.

HiddenLegoOuch · 26/10/2023 14:30

Or reading.

RedToothBrush · 26/10/2023 14:05

SinnerBoy · 26/10/2023 05:56

Why do so many TRAs post so many links which don't say what they say they said? Are they actually Fifth Columnists?

Cos they aren't very good at research or thinking.

Waitwhat23 · 26/10/2023 14:02

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 26/10/2023 13:24

In TRA land:

  • Free speech is transphobic.
  • Acknowledging reality is transphobic.
  • Asserting that sex is important is transphobic.

"Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two makes four. If that is granted, all else follows." 1984, George Orwell.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." 1984, George Orwell.

I've always thought that the tune of the Lego Movie song 'Everything is Awesome' could be very easily be made into a song called 'Everything's Transphobic'.

Hmm....

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 26/10/2023 13:24

SidewaysOtter · 26/10/2023 12:17

So, @Stephannee, if you believe JKR said she'd go to prison if "transphobia was made a hate crime" and what JKR actually said is above, which of the following things do you think are a) transphobia or b) a hate crime and why:

  • compelled speech;
  • forced denial of reality; or
  • the importance of [biological] sex?

In TRA land:

  • Free speech is transphobic.
  • Acknowledging reality is transphobic.
  • Asserting that sex is important is transphobic.

"Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two makes four. If that is granted, all else follows." 1984, George Orwell.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." 1984, George Orwell.

MargotBamborough · 26/10/2023 13:07

SidewaysOtter · 26/10/2023 12:17

So, @Stephannee, if you believe JKR said she'd go to prison if "transphobia was made a hate crime" and what JKR actually said is above, which of the following things do you think are a) transphobia or b) a hate crime and why:

  • compelled speech;
  • forced denial of reality; or
  • the importance of [biological] sex?

I think the answer is obvious.

Stephannee thinks objecting to these things is transphobia.

SidewaysOtter · 26/10/2023 12:17

OneMorePlant · 26/10/2023 03:40

I'll just post a link to that tweet here for dear Stephannee and save everyone some time. Not quite what she claimed JK Rowling said. I'm sure it's an honest mistake. 😁

"I'll happily do two years if the alternative is compelled speech and forced denial of the reality and importance of sex. Bring on the court case, I say. It'll be more fun than I've ever had on a red carpet."

https://twitter.com/jkrowling/status/1714378231753617583

Edited

So, @Stephannee, if you believe JKR said she'd go to prison if "transphobia was made a hate crime" and what JKR actually said is above, which of the following things do you think are a) transphobia or b) a hate crime and why:

  • compelled speech;
  • forced denial of reality; or
  • the importance of [biological] sex?
Datun · 26/10/2023 08:24

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 23:30

She said she would go to prison if transphobia was made a hate crime.

Not the same as what you said is it?

Do you ever actually read things yourself? Or just parrot what someone else tells you.

GramCracker · 26/10/2023 06:57

I think we should do this.

Put everyone in prison together, save taxpayers' money by closing the petting zoos and girly jails (or turn them into nail bars?).

Leave them to it, let all the prisoners sort it out between themselves and see what happens.

We'd have to make sure they stay in there lol. What the fuck could possibly go wrong? Sounds great - I'd vote labour on this alone. #keirrocks

Why don't trans(women) care about women's rights? Surely they would if they truly believed they were a woman?

SinnerBoy · 26/10/2023 05:58

ManuelBensonsLeftBoot· 20/10/2023 08:08

so when I catch DH and DSs cuddling the cats or fussing the dog they are trying to come out to me as trans?

Maybe bank robbers?

If transw are so keen not to be in mens' prisons, why don't they campaign for a specialist trans unit?

SinnerBoy · 26/10/2023 05:56

Why do so many TRAs post so many links which don't say what they say they said? Are they actually Fifth Columnists?

OneMorePlant · 26/10/2023 03:40

I'll just post a link to that tweet here for dear Stephannee and save everyone some time. Not quite what she claimed JK Rowling said. I'm sure it's an honest mistake. 😁

"I'll happily do two years if the alternative is compelled speech and forced denial of the reality and importance of sex. Bring on the court case, I say. It'll be more fun than I've ever had on a red carpet."

https://twitter.com/jkrowling/status/1714378231753617583

ManuelBensonsLeftBoot · 25/10/2023 23:51

teawamutu · 25/10/2023 23:45

Please supply the direct quote where she says exactly that. I'm sure you have it.

We know that the people who accuse JKR are always able to produce the receipts.

teawamutu · 25/10/2023 23:45

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 23:30

She said she would go to prison if transphobia was made a hate crime.

Not the same as what you said is it?

Please supply the direct quote where she says exactly that. I'm sure you have it.

Stephannee · 25/10/2023 23:30

Cismyfatarse · 18/10/2023 20:34

Share token here:

JK Rowling: I’ll happily go to prison for women’s rights

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32d91356-6d9b-11ee-b5d7-5487922f056f?shareToken=f1594da48d0791b9d9a9e2a6cd8965c2. Hopefully this works for everyone. She really is a Queen.

She said she would go to prison if transphobia was made a hate crime.

Not the same as what you said is it?

SidewaysOtter · 25/10/2023 23:23

AlphaTransWoman · 25/10/2023 22:28

But how are we supposed to run the country if everyone who isn't a TRA is in jail?

Never mind that, perhaps you could answer the many questions to you posed above regarding the emotional needs of transwomen compared to the emotional needs of adult human females.

Or do you not have an answer?

ManuelBensonsLeftBoot · 25/10/2023 22:39

How the hell do you prove which 'dead naming' and wrong pronouns are deliberate and which are just people being a bit crap? In our wider circle of people who we have known for about 30 years we have one person who transitioned about 5 years ago and one person who changed their first name for none gender woo reasons about 10 years ago. To this day DH calls them both Old name, shit sorry erm um New name about 75% of the time. There is no malice, his brain just supplies the name he was using for the first 20+ years.

AlphaTransWoman · 25/10/2023 22:28

But how are we supposed to run the country if everyone who isn't a TRA is in jail?

AutumnCrow · 25/10/2023 22:17

Winnading · 25/10/2023 22:04

This is a hill I will die on alongside you all and jk, and whilst I'm in that prison can I get all my many ailments fixed, new knees, ankles, a brain, etc? If so I'm gonna be the first to break this law just so I no longer have to wait on the NHS.

We would be exempt from council tax as well.

Winnading · 25/10/2023 22:04

AutumnCrow · 20/10/2023 07:18

If everyone’s as physically buggered as me, it’ll need its own age-related massive hospital wing and a bank of wheelchairs, a decent gynae ward, a sensory impairment service, skin cancer unit, and dietician.

And I’d insist on the jail time, not a suspended sentence, so I can set up my own advice service in the library and win over the top dog with my usefulness.

This is a hill I will die on alongside you all and jk, and whilst I'm in that prison can I get all my many ailments fixed, new knees, ankles, a brain, etc? If so I'm gonna be the first to break this law just so I no longer have to wait on the NHS.

RhannionKPSS · 25/10/2023 21:09

I firmly believe that if Labour choose Eddie Izzard as a candidate , for anywhere, it will be a clear sign that they don’t give a shiny shit about women’s rights and it will peak many, many more people.
I won’t be voting for them, and not one person in my circle, especially the women will vote for them. Most will spoil their votes.

AutumnCrow · 25/10/2023 16:28

Froodwithatowel · 20/10/2023 12:35

What emotional needs do TW have that are different to the emotional needs of other male people but similar to female people?

Since when were decisions on the sex based prison estate organised around emotional needs?

I'm sorry, this is delusional. TW prisoners may very well be vulnerable and have particular needs, and absolutely those needs should be met, properly, thoroughly. And the needs of male prisoners with MH issues, which is an appalling problem, and the needs of gay male prisoners, and the needs of elderly male prisoners, talk to someone who works in the prison system and they will talk at you for a long time, often with a lot of care and concern, for the many very vulnerable men they support. Privacy, dignity and safety should be a basic human right for everyone, male and female.

No male need ever requires the use of female people's bodies as a resource. Because lets be honest about this, it isn't the space that's wanted. That expensive special wing in a women's prison was created for TW prisoners who did not risk assess (at the time) as safe enough to inflict on women to meet the wish to be on the female estate. It was never used, because it was not about the space it was about the right to physical access to women's bodies. The TW and their lawyers and this political lobby kicked off until those TW got access to women prisoners. And that probably played a large part, along with the one in pink leggings, in pushing the government to say, right, no male offenders with intact genitals and/or a history of sexual or violent crime. And as it turns out - that pretty much ruled out all of them.

And yes, it is that ugly in being about a male right to women's bodies, because no other part of these women is of any interest. Not their feelings, their emotional needs, their sense of self, their beliefs and identities, their wishes for their best lives and authentic selves, their definition of sexuality - no, it's about how their physical body meets the need of the male, whether it's as a prop in the room to 'be with other women' or in the case of White at al, to make use of for getting the sexual abuse jollies buzz.

I don't draw a line between where it's 'ok' to use women and where it becomes 'oh that's getting a bit grim now' - it's all using women's bodies, that can never be acceptable. And there's a pattern in all of this. In the refusal to permit women accessible female only spaces or health care or rape crisis service or escape from a life threatening relationship in along side accessible mixed sex 'womens' ones, which we'd all be fine with - in the refusal to permit women to be homosexual openly and proudly and say 'my personal choice is no male of any identity'. All of it is about anger where a woman wishes to control access to her body preventing use in a way that a male person feels they have special entitlement to. I'm done with the abuse of this agenda towards women and I am absolutely done with special pleading.

Edited

Thanks for this really good long post @Froodwithatowel - it really gets to the heart of why 'goodwill' (i.e. female socialised acquiescence) is draining away.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 16:19

I think more than anywhere the U.K. has exposed the nature of it to the world, because our media isn't entirely captured and is international, and there has been so much pushback, mostly from women, here, and the response by TRAs to that is always very enlightening.

MargotBamborough · 25/10/2023 16:15

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 16:07

Prosecute that.

I firmly believe they would then move on to prosecution of anything not sufficiently respectful and validating. Because it isn't about "gender", it's about control.

They won't win.

People are already fed up with this bullshit.

I think in other countries which have fully embraced gender ideology they were a bit cleverer about it. They quietly changed the laws, captured the younger generations and then started being truly objectionable.

In the UK, well, I think on a basic level British people are mostly decent but have quite low tolerance for nonsense, and the trans rights lobby have also gone in too hard and too fast with their demands, at a point where they have not yet secured the changes in legislation they are seeking.

Now the public is becoming increasingly aware of issues like Isla Bryson, and increasingly naffed off with being told to declare their pronouns, I think any major changes in legislation of this nature have the potential to make things really kick off. I hope so, anyway.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/10/2023 16:07

Prosecute that.

I firmly believe they would then move on to prosecution of anything not sufficiently respectful and validating. Because it isn't about "gender", it's about control.