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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

NHS nurse on my facebook just changed her profile picture to this

240 replies

welcometothepartyyy · 05/10/2023 22:24

Inappropriate, much?

NHS nurse on my facebook just changed her profile picture to this
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Signalbox · 07/10/2023 10:17

Mary1234567 · 07/10/2023 08:08

Bring a Tory is not one of the protected characteristics under the equality act

Political opinion would fall under the PC of belief.

Mary1234567 · 07/10/2023 08:08

Bring a Tory is not one of the protected characteristics under the equality act

Mary1234567 · 07/10/2023 08:00

The post doesn’t say she would rather treat a trans person than a Tory. It says share a ward with.

Mary1234567 · 07/10/2023 07:59

How do you know that? The OP maybe just knows she’s a nurse from her personal knowledge of this woman, not necessarily that she has a profile identifying herself as a nurse. And the post says ‘share’ a ward which to me doesn’t allude to being a nurse

Mary1234567 · 07/10/2023 07:56

But does she identify herself as nhs staff on her profile?

napody · 07/10/2023 07:32

crunchermuncher · 07/10/2023 03:08

No they aren't! Same as people in many organisations.

I used to be an NHS administrator and would have been disciplined over a post like this.

Publicly criticising your employer on sm is never a good idea (and is actively forbidden my post ecology contexts)- why is this so difficult for some people to grasp?

'Your employer' lol.
That would be very handy for conservatives wouldn't it, if public sector workers, who are the ones at the front line of enacting services with no budget, were forbidden from commenting.

If you actually read the SM policies upthread you'll see that it would be a real reach to apply it to criticising government. And if you did, it'd be a huge infringement of freedom of speech for a large swathe of the population.

And the oroginal post although misguided was nothing to do with 'refusing to treat' someone; that's a misinterpretation which has been corrected on this thread many times and is still popping back up.

crunchermuncher · 07/10/2023 03:09

(^^ Was a response to 'nurses are allowed to make political posts' upthread).

crunchermuncher · 07/10/2023 03:08

No they aren't! Same as people in many organisations.

I used to be an NHS administrator and would have been disciplined over a post like this.

Publicly criticising your employer on sm is never a good idea (and is actively forbidden my post ecology contexts)- why is this so difficult for some people to grasp?

GrannyRose15 · 07/10/2023 02:24

Stephannee · 06/10/2023 12:00

Complaining about the mentioned Nurse may involve her being spoken to and potentially having a polite request to take down her post, but I guarantee it will not change her views. All that will be achieved will be pissing her off and she may double down and support trans people even more, even if she can't post it on her FB.

How can she support trans people even more? That doesn’t make sense. But there again that isn’t the main problem with the post. It is the implied discrimination against those with political views opposed to her own that is the most worrying part.

Ofcourseshecan · 06/10/2023 23:30

Passepartoute · 06/10/2023 09:14

You do know that nurses have no say on who is admitted where as a patient?

You really want men totally barred from women's wards? That's going to make staffing a bit awkward, to say nothing of visiting times.

Where did I write that nurses decide who is admitted, or that I want male staff and visitors barred?

I wrote about a nurse expressing hostility, and about male intruders, in which I include men claiming to be women and occupying beds in women’s wards.

literalviolence · 06/10/2023 23:28

Stephannee · 06/10/2023 14:41

So how come it's not ok for a nurse to post in support of trans people in her own time, but it's perfectly ok for a social worker (rachel maede) to post negatively of trans people?

I support trans people and will happily share my hospital ward with a transman. This is not a post of support though is it? It's an anti GC, anti evidence, anti Tory, anti women post.

Topofthemountain · 06/10/2023 15:35

Virtual signalling rubbish. They prove their trans allyship whilst also proving that they are so much better than a Tory.

What they are actually saying is that they would prefer to be in a bed next to Karen White, then 95 year old Doris. Like hell they would.

Signalbox · 06/10/2023 15:14

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 06/10/2023 13:40

Agree its shocking so many people think the post is ok. It really isn't.

I don’t think it’s ok. I do think you’d be a total twat to report her to her employer for it.

I also wonder what fantasy land some posters live in, if they think a regulator (the NMC in her case)is going to pull her up on it. All the regulators are totally captured. She’d probably get a pat on the back.

I also wonder what fantasy land some posters live in, if they think a regulator (the NMC in her case)is going to pull her up on it. All the regulators are totally captured. She’d probably get a pat on the back.

I think you are right that the NMC wouldn't be interested in this post.

Whilst it would be impossible to rule out the fact that the NMC are Stonewall Diversity Champions having some influence, I really doubt they would give it the time of day regardless. The costs and time involved for the sake of one ill-advised SM breach (if a breach has even occurred) would be way out of proportion.

It's not as if the regulators are ignoring SM abusive behaviour entirely such as in the case of the Charming Dr Harrop where there is actual bullying and targeted harassment taking place.

NMC's online guidance...

https://www.nmc.org.uk/globalassets/sitedocuments/nmc-publications/social-media-guidance.pdf

https://www.nmc.org.uk/globalassets/sitedocuments/nmc-publications/social-media-guidance.pdf

Floisme · 06/10/2023 15:03

Confront her, challenge her, unfriend her, avoid her - I don't care about any of that. It's the support for the idea of reporting her to her employer that leaves me Shock

RedToothBrush · 06/10/2023 14:42

I'd report her if I otherwise thought she was a knobber. But then why would I have her as a friend on Facebook if that was the case.

Tbh if she's off transing her child and shouting about the virtues of Mermaids, she'd be long gone (and yes true if a family member too) more than likely because there's not a cat in hell's chance I wouldn't have confronted her over it.

Stephannee · 06/10/2023 14:41

So how come it's not ok for a nurse to post in support of trans people in her own time, but it's perfectly ok for a social worker (rachel maede) to post negatively of trans people?

Floisme · 06/10/2023 14:38

I don’t think it’s ok. I do think you’d be a total twat to report her to her employer for it.

Agreed.

I guess I fundamentally disagree with the idea that saying something stupid in a personal capacity on social media brings your profession into disrepute.

I believe that, as far as possible, a professional person should be as entitled as anyone else to behave like a nob once away from the workplace.

I'm sure there are grey areas and, if she was expressing such a view in the workplace or in any kind of professional capacity, then I would regard it differently. But it doesn't sound like that's the case.

Quoting NHS England policies at me does not change that view, although it might make me thankful I don't work for them.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 06/10/2023 13:40

Agree its shocking so many people think the post is ok. It really isn't.

I don’t think it’s ok. I do think you’d be a total twat to report her to her employer for it.

I also wonder what fantasy land some posters live in, if they think a regulator (the NMC in her case)is going to pull her up on it. All the regulators are totally captured. She’d probably get a pat on the back.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 06/10/2023 13:35

About 0.1% (if that) of the total NHS workforce work for NHS England.

ReeseWitherfork · 06/10/2023 13:26

RedToothBrush · 06/10/2023 11:23

So NOONE has actually bothered to google the words

"NHS SOCIAL MEDIA POLICY" then?

Top hit:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/publication/social-media-and-attributed-digital-content-policy/
This is dated as being last updated 2018.
I think this is the current one as its linked from this main page:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/contact-us/pub-scheme/pol-proc/

This links to a document:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/social-media-policy.pdf
Document from 2013 last updated 2017.

Amongst the points it lists are the following:

  • Don’t use social media in any way to attack or abuse colleagues;
  • Respect your audience. Don't use personal insults, obscenities, or engage in any conduct that would not be acceptable in the workplace. You should also show proper consideration for others' privacy and for topics that may be considered objectionable or inflammatory, such as politics and religion;
  • Be aware of your association with NHS England when using online social networks. If you identify yourself, or are identifiable, as an employee of the organisation, ensure your profile and related content is consistent with how you wish to present yourself to colleagues and stakeholders. Be aware that you may be identified as an employee by any public use of your NHSmail email address;
  • Don't pick fights, be the first to correct your own mistakes, and don't change previous posts without indicating that you have done so;
  • Don’t use social media to ‘”whistleblow” without already having raised concerns through the proper channels. All staff should be aware that the Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998 gives legal protection to employees who wish to whistleblow any concerns

Its in clear breach of social media policy.

There is one. It does exist. And it covers the whole NHS in England. Contrary to what numerous posters on this thread have said.

“NHS England” is a organisation in itself and staff working within the NHS don’t (necessarily) work for “NHS England”. All a bit moot as you’ve also posted the RCN guidelines which are relevant here. Just thought I’d make the point that we still don’t know what the nurse’s employers social media policy is because we don’t know who her employer is. Within my NHS organisation, we can post whatever we like but have to state somewhere that they’re our views and not of our employer.

RedToothBrush · 06/10/2023 12:15

Stephannee · 06/10/2023 12:00

Complaining about the mentioned Nurse may involve her being spoken to and potentially having a polite request to take down her post, but I guarantee it will not change her views. All that will be achieved will be pissing her off and she may double down and support trans people even more, even if she can't post it on her FB.

Tbf if what the OP says is true about the nurse's daughter and the nurse being a supporter of Mermaids, she isn't going to be gently persuaded of any other position anyway.

But she won't be as likely to upset others or bring the NHS /nursing into disrepute again and she may not risk losing her job.

StarlightLime · 06/10/2023 12:13

Stephannee · 06/10/2023 12:00

Complaining about the mentioned Nurse may involve her being spoken to and potentially having a polite request to take down her post, but I guarantee it will not change her views. All that will be achieved will be pissing her off and she may double down and support trans people even more, even if she can't post it on her FB.

She might support trans people even more, out of sheer divilment?
Can you actually hear yourself?

Stephannee · 06/10/2023 12:00

Complaining about the mentioned Nurse may involve her being spoken to and potentially having a polite request to take down her post, but I guarantee it will not change her views. All that will be achieved will be pissing her off and she may double down and support trans people even more, even if she can't post it on her FB.

RedToothBrush · 06/10/2023 11:58

Agree its shocking so many people think the post is ok. It really isn't.

To doubly demonstrate the point:

Here is the RCN policy (dated 2019):
https://www.rcn.org.uk/Professional-Development/PDFs/social-media-policy

Accounts
Whether you have a personal, work or RCN account, this should be managed appropriately, with care taken to ensure the content posted is suitable for the account and complies with applicable policies.
Your privacy
Social networking platforms are in the public domain and while it is advisable to familiarise yourself and appropriately use any privacy settings it is not always possible to be sure what is being viewed, shared or archived, even if material is posted on a closed profile or group. There can be no reasonable expectation that posts will remain private and will not be passed on to other people, intentionally or otherwise. Material published online may have the potential to be available publicly, indefinitely.

Point one. This nurse has stuck it on FB. The OP hasn't identified the person involved, but could have quite easily on here. That in itself is relevant though. This nurse could have been in a LOT more shit.

Conduct
Users have the right to freedom of thought, opinion and expression and can use social media as a means of communicating these but remember that the same standard of behaviour is expected of you online as it is offline.

Consider your use of language and phrasing, and whether you would be happy for the comments, photographs or videos you have posted, commented on or shared to be seen by fellow members, colleagues, your manager, patients or members of the public.

Users should not post messages, status updates or links to material or content, which is deemed to be inappropriate by the RCN or brings your patients, profession, employer or regulator into disrepute. This content includes: pornography, racial or religious slurs, genderspecific comments, information encouraging criminal skills or terrorism or materials relating to cults, gambling or illegal drugs.

Inappropriate content or material also covers any text, images or other media that would reasonably offend someone on the basis of race, age, sex, religion or belief, disability, sexual orientation, gender reassignment, marriage or civil partnership, pregnancy and maternity or any other characteristic protected by law. If your employer has a social media policy you may want to review this to see if it provides any further guidance.

Point two. If seen by anyone who is gender critical in any way (or just is supportive of single sex accomodation for any number of reasons rather than identifies as GC) or is a Tory or has voted Tory, its problematic cos its definitely trying to offend. It is NOT raising a point on policy in any constructive way. Its just an attack and it seeks to be confrontational.

Indeed:

Trolling
Remember to remain appropriate, respectful and polite, even when disagreeing with others. You are bound to come across posts with which you don’t agree and, by the same token, may yourself post things with which others take issue. This is of course never justification for poor conduct. In internet slang terms a "troll" is a person who posts something inflammatory, digressive, extraneous or off-topic online, not to engage you in their point of view, but simply in order to provoke an emotional response.

The nurse's post meets the definition of trolling and is explicitly outlawed as such.

Its outright not acceptable.

The nurse IS in breech of NHS and RCN social media policy.

They really should be reported by someone, but I completely get why they aren't. The nurse doesn't need a disciplinary but does need a refresher in what social media policy is.

It DOES matter because it undermines trust and public confidence in the NHS and ask questions about whether all patients will be treated equally to the best professional standards. This nurse potentially wouldn't.

Social Media Policy | Royal College of Nursing

RCN social media policy

https://www.rcn.org.uk/Professional-Development/PDFs/social-media-policy

Mamma2017 · 06/10/2023 11:42

RedToothBrush · 06/10/2023 11:23

So NOONE has actually bothered to google the words

"NHS SOCIAL MEDIA POLICY" then?

Top hit:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/publication/social-media-and-attributed-digital-content-policy/
This is dated as being last updated 2018.
I think this is the current one as its linked from this main page:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/contact-us/pub-scheme/pol-proc/

This links to a document:
https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/social-media-policy.pdf
Document from 2013 last updated 2017.

Amongst the points it lists are the following:

  • Don’t use social media in any way to attack or abuse colleagues;
  • Respect your audience. Don't use personal insults, obscenities, or engage in any conduct that would not be acceptable in the workplace. You should also show proper consideration for others' privacy and for topics that may be considered objectionable or inflammatory, such as politics and religion;
  • Be aware of your association with NHS England when using online social networks. If you identify yourself, or are identifiable, as an employee of the organisation, ensure your profile and related content is consistent with how you wish to present yourself to colleagues and stakeholders. Be aware that you may be identified as an employee by any public use of your NHSmail email address;
  • Don't pick fights, be the first to correct your own mistakes, and don't change previous posts without indicating that you have done so;
  • Don’t use social media to ‘”whistleblow” without already having raised concerns through the proper channels. All staff should be aware that the Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998 gives legal protection to employees who wish to whistleblow any concerns

Its in clear breach of social media policy.

There is one. It does exist. And it covers the whole NHS in England. Contrary to what numerous posters on this thread have said.

Yep I did, posted upthread. Shocked that so many on here who don’t even work for the NHS think that the nurse’s post was ok and not against policy.