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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

This is what happens when you include `"non-binary" at a womens conference

58 replies

KnittedCardi · 05/10/2023 15:07

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12595177/women-tech-conference-overrun-nonbinary-men.html

Basically hordes of men claiming to be non-binary pushed aside women at a tech conference, specifically set up to help recruit women as under-represented in tech.

Fury as women in tech conference is overrun with 'nonbinary' men

Furious female jobseekers have slammed the Grace Hoper Celebration of Women in Computing conference after a number of men gatecrashed the event, seemingly by identifying as 'nonbinary.'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12595177/women-tech-conference-overrun-nonbinary-men.html

OP posts:
DifficultBloodyWoman · 06/10/2023 10:51

GCAcademic · 05/10/2023 15:16

This was acknowledged by Cullen White, the Chief Impact Officer of AnitaB.org, which hosts the conference, as he took to the stage to address the audience at the end of the event, saying: 'Simply put, some of you lied about your gender identity when you registered.'

How does he know they lied? I mean, it’s not like gender identity is an objective, verifiable, material thing, is it? If you open up events to those with identities which are not defined by anything tangible, you have to accept that people are whatever they tell you they are.

I think he made reference to their CVs not matching the registration form.

Either way - sex not gender!

FictionalCharacter · 05/10/2023 19:31

This is predictably what “people are who they say they are” and No Debate leads to.
One day, the young women who fell for this will wake up. When they personally have been hugely disadvantaged by this ideology, and it’s too late to prevent the damage to their careers and earning power. It’s a new addition to the glass ceiling.

GCAcademic · 05/10/2023 18:09

People are very happy to support these ideologies and policies until it starts to affect them personally.

Exactly. It’s the very definition of a luxury belief. Until you need, e.g. a job, a place in a refuge, etc..

SpicyMoth · 05/10/2023 17:36

Why were any of them surprised this happened...?

PaperWalkAndTalk · 05/10/2023 17:13

People are very happy to support these ideologies and policies until it starts to affect them personally.

Many of the job seekers there will believe TWAW and non-binary, but then reality hits and they see that they are losing out. They can happily support men in women's spaces because they never think men are going to enter their spaces (like a female tech conference).

I've heard many women who believe TWAW until their husband suddenly decided that he was a woman.

The trouble with this ideology is that no one truly believes in it, but they will go to great lengths to pretend that they do. That's why they're now struggling to tell the truth over how they know a non-binary person is male.

PikachuChickenRice · 05/10/2023 16:47

lliij8 · 05/10/2023 16:11

They need to be a bit clearer in the marketing. It's for women and non binary people, but only those nonbinary people who are specifically disadvantaged in tech because their physical appearance will make people think they are women and so will be on the receiving end of similar discrimination.

Ahh, but these blokes could have just as easily claimed to be women. And we all know that TWAW, right?! (Repeat after me or be cancelled, witch.)

It would of course be transphobic to expect trans women to resemble women in any way, because being a woman is all about one's feminine inner essence... apparently.

I am really sorry for the women who missed out on interviews and jobs, but I am so glad that the true believers are starting to figure it all out.

I'm finding all this absolutely hilarious - the CV's we get from Grace Hopper are usually crap. Graduates or boot campers when we have graduate programs already.
I'm a female dev myself and have faced my fair share of sexism etc but it doesn't help that 99% of people in these 'women in tech' things are in non-technical roles. Most role models for technical women are not there, they are too busy contributing to open source, speaking at vendor conferences, etc.
I have no idea why Janelle Monáe Robinson for example is a keynote speaker she's a singer!

Rachel Kroll, Cornelia Huck, Julie Ralph these are true role models - there are also people like the woman who had a film degree and went on to work for GitHub, I forgot her name but she gave quite a few great technical talks always at proper conferences and never 'women in tech'.
I can never find any people like me at these women only conferences and other technical women where I work feel the same so we stay away. As @RealityFan alluded to these places are filled with touch-feely identity politics proponents. Is it any wonder that this happened?

Something that's actually GOOD:

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ColdEvenings · 05/10/2023 16:21

I mean! Who would have guessed!!

FantasticElasticBand · 05/10/2023 16:19

Tsk, tsk everyone <wags finger>

Acceptance without question

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 05/10/2023 16:17

I did wonder that! It was getting a lot of attention on X/Twitter, though.

IcakethereforeIam · 05/10/2023 16:14

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g your thread probably flagged it for the DM.

lliij8 · 05/10/2023 16:11

They need to be a bit clearer in the marketing. It's for women and non binary people, but only those nonbinary people who are specifically disadvantaged in tech because their physical appearance will make people think they are women and so will be on the receiving end of similar discrimination.

Ahh, but these blokes could have just as easily claimed to be women. And we all know that TWAW, right?! (Repeat after me or be cancelled, witch.)

It would of course be transphobic to expect trans women to resemble women in any way, because being a woman is all about one's feminine inner essence... apparently.

I am really sorry for the women who missed out on interviews and jobs, but I am so glad that the true believers are starting to figure it all out.

TastesLikeStrawberriesOnASummerEvening · 05/10/2023 15:48

DD studying a science subject at Uni is all over TWAW.
What are the Unis doing to our kids?

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 05/10/2023 15:47

XX women only,,please.

RubyTrees · 05/10/2023 15:45

dementedpixie · 05/10/2023 15:40

Less.of the cis!

Open to those born female regardless of how they identify?

"Born female" should be the only requirement.

LiesDoNotBecomeUs · 05/10/2023 15:45

If they include males - then it is no longer a women's conference?

KnittedCardi · 05/10/2023 15:44

dementedpixie · 05/10/2023 15:40

Less.of the cis!

Open to those born female regardless of how they identify?

Agreed - I hate that word..... but you know, have to cover all bases.

OP posts:
dementedpixie · 05/10/2023 15:40

Less.of the cis!

Open to those born female regardless of how they identify?

KnittedCardi · 05/10/2023 15:39

I fundamentally disagree with the "not a woman" stance and think this attitude upholds and confirms sexist stereotypes by conceding the word woman to effectively only apply to those who embrace the stereotype

I disagree. That's bullshit. Who says "woman" has a stereotype? Would that be men?

OP posts:
KnittedCardi · 05/10/2023 15:36

KnittedCardi · 05/10/2023 15:34

Something along the lines of "cis women and natal born non-binary women" blah blah blah

Ooooppppss - there's me falling into the trap too, so let's add "natal born WOMEN, who also identify as non-binary". Better?

OP posts:
KnittedCardi · 05/10/2023 15:34

Datun · 05/10/2023 15:30

Deffo. Idiots.

Something along the lines of "cis women and natal born non-binary women" blah blah blah

OP posts:
OlizraWiteomQua · 05/10/2023 15:33

They need to be a bit clearer in the marketing. It's for women and non binary people, but only those nonbinary people who are specifically disadvantaged in tech because their physical appearance will make people think they are women and so will be on the receiving end of similar discrimination. But not for those nonbinary people whose physical appearance will make people think they are men, because they aren't being discriminated against.

The leaflets may need a smaller font size to fit that in.

It's important that a conference like this includes a space for the female-born people whose utter rejection of sexist stereotypes has led them to self-declare as "not a woman" so I wouldn't want the conference to be "women only". I fundamentally disagree with the "not a woman" stance and think this attitude upholds and confirms sexist stereotypes by conceding the word woman to effectively only apply to those who embrace the stereotype. I find that idea repellant but I respect their right to hold it and think that conferences like this should make sure they aren't excluded.

Igmum · 05/10/2023 15:31

Definitely never happens.

It's interesting to see people who are probably full-on TWAW tying themselves in knots to suggest that these are the wrong type of NBs. If you support self identification then they aren't. Good to see people being pissed off and speaking against it.

Datun · 05/10/2023 15:30

LizzieSiddal · 05/10/2023 15:29

I wonder if next year, they’ll have to identify what kind of non binary people the conference is for? Hmm

Deffo. Idiots.

CaveMum · 05/10/2023 15:30

But of course just because men would lie to get into a job conference it in no way means that men would lie to gain access to women's changing rooms/toilets/etc....