Owen Jones guardian piece attacking Duffield

Same.

I have also stopped contributing to the letters page, to ‘Take Part’, to its photographic comps & pages, and other ‘reader initiatives’.

I’ve also had a couple of articles printed in it, but wouldn’t submit to them now. The Observer maybe; but not the shitrag Guardian.

I used to contribute to the Guardian, but after insulting garbage like this and Zoe Williams’s recent nonsense about transgender women prisoners having a hard time, they won’t be getting another penny from me.
Jill Tweedie must be turning in her grave.

@ArabeIIaScott that's a great point. By Owen's own reasoning, this should make him responsible for all the abuse Rosie Duffield receives whenever he writes something critical about her.

Except that, Rosie is an actual woman so Owen's misogynist logic puts all the blame on her in this situation too.

I’m in Norway. Self ID was snuck in under cover of darkness and MSM refuses to touch it with a barge pole. A man was sentenced to a £5k fine and jail time for getting into a spat with a tw and telling him “you’re delusional if you think anyone actually thinks you’re a little girl and not a larping bloke”. After that a feminist and a prominent lesbian made public “men cannot be lesbians/mothers” statements in order to goad these people into pressing charges against them too so more people could see what the hell was going on, and charges were pressed but the police, presumably smelling the oncoming shitshow, dropped them.

Our BBC, NRK, will run sob stories about TW doing sports with women (both immigrants, I’ve noticed - an American and a Thai) and how it’s soo important, with less emotionality afforded the opposing side. Anecdotally I know from parents of teens that trans “girls” change with female children. There was a kick off when one sissy porn trancel used female locker rooms and other women protested. Same massive pervert who made the shitty Terfenstein game where you can murder feminists. What a creep. Glad he’s nowhere near me!

We’re a small country with long traditions of leaving our neighbours the hell alone and respecting privacy, so it’s mostly politely not talked about. Feminists have tried finding out if men are housed in female jails and not been given proper replies. All in all we’re waiting for our Jessica Yaniv or Isla Bryson moment because most people have no idea. It sucks.

I'm not sure if it's the right place to do it, but I'm so grateful to Rosie for sticking up for women and so sorry about the hideous bullying she's received for it.

I wrote to her (I'm in her constituency) when she first stuck her head out. No idea if she got it as never received a reply. Either she was inundated with emails of support or her woke team hod such communications from her. Either way, I'm glad she's the voice of reason on her party.

I've no idea if I can vote for her. I was hoping she'd defect to conservative to be honest. She could do a lot of good in the party and I fear she's powerless in Labour. She's completely wedded to the working class roots of labour though so I doubt she would, but in my opinion that party no longer exists. Labour is very much the champagne socialist party now.

And yes, before someone comes on saying Tories aren't much better, I'm very aware of that. Doesn't excuse labour the appalling behaviour they seem to relish instead of proper opposition though.

Anyway, Rosie is awesome. Owen is a homophobic misogynistic twerp.

More sunlight. Thanks OJ I'm sure a man appropriating motherhood will be an eye opening moment for many.

Looked up how it’s going in Norway and found these threads. Seems not going so well for women and girls. As usual, MN FWR already on it several years ago, but that bit of research conveniently omitted or deemed unnecessary by OJ. Never let the truth get in the way of inconvenient truths.

More broadly, it is so disheartening that seemingly no left / centre left oriented organisation (such as The Guardian or the Labour Party) is prepared to speak up for women’s safety and biological reality when it’s an issue that surpasses political orientation.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3392465-Self-ID-isnt-working-in-Norway

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3392233-Self-ID-in-Norway-woman-sued-for-harassment-for-challenging-intact-male-in-changing-room

OJ having yet another woman hating emotionally charged blather? No surprise there then. What a mouthy little safe bubble he lives in.

Try talking that shit round Bootle, OJ. I'm sure that there are lots of women around here who will have a strong exchange of views with you re your gobshite faux intellectual drivel.

No chance of you ever being successfully elected to represent the people is there?

Whereas, Rosie Duffield is a hard working and gutsy MP who actually helps and represents her constituency, without fear or favour.

I wouldn't give him the clicks.
It's The Guardian's equivalent of a 'shock jock' - guaranteed to be sexist, wrong-headed and blame a woman for everything. Not to mention the raging hypocrisy of pretending woman is a nebulous term ... except when it comes to sexual partners and surrogacy.

He's missed off some inconvenient facts.

Would a "staunch ally" have brought in civil partnerships, or actual, equal rights for same-sex marriage?

Telling that he reaches for Tatchell as part of his "evidence", without including the furore about his letter to the Graun on sex with kids. Or the video. Or Tatchell's rant that self-ID is fine. Etc.

"Tories targeting the trans community as they did gay people in the 1980s"

They're not though are they? It's very telling that he chose not to evidence this. Trans people can marry at the same age as anyone else. They have protections in the equality act. Where does he see the similarity?

I disagree with him about Rosie Duffield's comment re: queer appropriation. According to Stonewall, both my DH and I are trans because neither of us have a gender identity. He looks like every other bloke, I look like every other woman. It would be insulting if we pretended that we were queer and had in any way faced any barriers or stigma in society. We are actually the privileged 'norm'/ majority.

A TW can never be a mother and, as above, for the privileged to appropriate the identity and experiences of the oppressed group is recognised as completely inappropriate in every other walk of life and should be recognised as such here. If the TW had said 'as a dad' and done exactly the same interview, it would have been a much more progressive interview - imagine showing a dad doing the washing and carrying the mental load for a family. That's where real change can happen.

Apparently so 🤷🏼‍♀️

Not participating in someone else's immersive fiction to your own detriment is cruel.

Yeah, no.

I think that the end game will be that only men can be mothers whilst mothers will be redefined as birthing parents

Seemingly men, NAMALT but enough in powerful positions, cannot stand women to have anything that they can’t and must appropriate anything and everything female related. True cuckoo’s in the nest.

Little twat.

Yes, CRUEL. Think of those poor men, pretending to be mothers 🤦‍♀️

Collective insanity is what this is.

Woman is cruel for not agreeing that a man can be a mother even though the word mother has a very specific legal meaning which excludes men.

'Duffield's tweet was cruel'

Because it's 'cruel' to say that men appropriating motherhood is utterly offensive to the majority of women?

OJ is such a waste of space, I don't give his misogynist outrage the clicks.

I think the reader's editor is aware of Owen Jones's misogyny but the guardian has long since stopped caring about women. Another columnist, Frances Ryan, said Duffield's tweet was cruel. They have a party line and they're sticking to it.

Also note that this extremely silly individual reacted with indignation and shouts of homophobia when it was suggested that as a gay man he should be welcoming of a potential sexual relationship with a man with a vagina.

However in the same bloody conversation he asserted the belief that homosexual women had no right to hold such boundaries against women with a penis.

Odious little twerp.

Jones' writing runs on manufacturing outrage about something-or-other. That's his entire 'angle' - incredulous outrage. In this article, it sounds like even he is tired of trying to work himself up to righteous fury.

Article 4,365, In which our hero attempts to write a laboured (forgive me) history of homophobia within Labour which doesn't quite take, brings us to the not-very-earth-shattering revelation that Rosie Duffield thinks men aren't women, and ends with a quite spectacular anti climax of 'Rosie Duffield done a TWEET'.

Those of us who are awake and have fought this have been excluded from the 'community'. LGBT+Whatever now means 'TQ+ compliant political lobby'. We are chased out of Pride for openly being homosexual, we are not permitted to have groups without T supervision and control, inevitably male, unless we operate underground.

You may be interested in seeing this first hand on another current thread where a male self identified lesbian is being the voice of lesbianism and harassing homosexual women into compliance that 'lesbian' is a mixed sex term that anyone of any sex and inclination can use (insert don't police how other people define themselves weasel here) and that you can in theory tell the large six foot angry male in front of you that you're sure they're lovely but you won't be having sex with them on an individual basis but you may not for example have and celebrate a sexuality that excludes all male people.

Because that would be gatekeeping your vagina and upsetting male people that your inner life, identity and sexual orientation is more important to you than their inner self and right to use you for validation.

If you have the answers to this, I and many other homosexuals are bloody desperate to hear them.

FGS. That article is so offensive I don’t know where to begin.