Pride Month: Workplace have asked for anonymous feedback on "how can we be more inclusive?"

I bet it wasn't really anonymous. Nothing is.

❤️🙌🏼

Gender identity can take many forms.

For some men, it’s a special internal feeling that makes them feel they have the right to invade women’s spaces.

For some young women, it’s an intense feeling of dissatisfaction at having been born female and treated as a second class citizen, and groped and ogled, to the point where it’s worth considering mastectomy to stop it happening.

For other men, it’s a desperate feeling of wishing they had been born the opposite sex created when they were tiny children, too young to understand that their parents did not love them unconditionally, but disapproved of their behaviour, which was considered effeminate and therefore bad.

For some teenagers, it’s a feeling of rebellion, against society and their mothers in particular.

It would be lovely if anyone posting on here knew what gender identity was and could explain it to me.

What compelled speech? Genuinely do not know what you are on about.

It’s all part of the same judging others by inconsequential details.

Nobody has a gender. It’s nonsense. We all have a sex. Some people are deeply uncomfortable with theirs, probably due to bullying in childhood. From this misconception, a whole medical industry has been spawned.

@HadalyEve
There's nothing extreme about rejecting compelled speech. It's virtually a duty to do so.
Disagree? From now on I expect you to say "transwomen are not women" at the start of every post to show how inclusive and supportive you are of GC women like me.

There seems to be this argument that knowing people's pronouns is vital, but no-one will draw any conclusions about anyone's sex or gender based on them because it could refer to either and it's no-one's business which.

Kindly, the not knowing if you have a gender or what gender is, is struggling with gender. I think you need counselling not to tell the truth, but to be guided into an understanding of the concept of gender and how that presents within your identity. I believe you are telling the truth that you don’t know what gender is or whether you have a gender.

You do not need to do any gender self exploration to decide on pronouns as they can be by sex. I’m sure you are aware of your sex? Good. Then just use the pronouns for your sex. No one minds.

Well, yes it is your business if people think things about you but that cannot be helped.

You misread me. It's people thinking I am telling them, with my words, something I am not, due to the lack of clarity of what gender is and how it is distinguished from sex. Not them concluding something from my appearance.

If you are struggling with gender, I would kindly suggest some counselling so you can make these decisions for yourself.

Ah, you pulled this one on me before. I'm not struggling with gender. Again, I don't know if I have one, or what it is, because no-one will explain to me how to identify it. The few that do try get mixed up and confuse it with sex.

The fact that you believe someone might need counselling to truthfully answer a question suggests that maybe the question isn't as straightforward as you keep saying?

You said I should decide what my pronouns are. Given my situation, what are my choices? You seem to be saying it's sex as default if you have any uncertainties, right?

Hmmm and how does wearing a badge work in this day and age of Zoom meetings with no camera to reduce the carbon footprint? That’s so last century.

Asking pronouns is a declaration that you have a belief in gender ideology and you are ascertaining whether the others in the room are followers (or at least, will capitulate). There’s no practical requirement whatsoever. I’m in my fifties and have survived my entire life without once having to engage in such a performative act of piety.

The level of obsession with this pseudo religion is fascinating, but I hope it soon passes into history, when we will look back on this bizarre, but brief phenomenon and wonder what it was all about and how so many people were dragged in.

‘Everyone should be referred to with the pronouns they prefer for themself, but no one can know what you prefer if the OP gets her way and they are stopped from even asking.’

They could wear a badge with their pronouns on , if they were not those which a half blind goldfish could identify at twenty paces, but some ‘special’ ones. Lots of people seem to wear lanyards and badges at work now , so it wouldn’t be difficult to incorporate it into your ‘identification’. People who don’t care or just rely on other people to distinguish their ‘ sex based ‘ sic pronouns wouldn't have bother with that attachment.

I bet you are going to say that that isn’t inclusive, though, as the people who couldn’t give a fig might prove to be in the majority , and the minority might feel ‘hurt’. But think, people could change their pronouns as often as they wanted, just by changing the colour code. That would be a privilege. And loads of fun.

If you are struggling with gender, I would kindly suggest some counselling so you can make these decisions for yourself.

Well, yes it is your business if people think things about you but that cannot be helped. People will think things about you based on how you are dressed, your accent, your race, your behaviour. There is no avoiding this I’m afraid.

I’m not insisting anything of the sort, OP has said
I also said I was happy to work alongside, love and respect trans and non-binary colleagues, including the use of their preferred pronouns, the same as I do with religious colleagues despite being an atheist.

So my comments are in regards to OP as she is happy to be inclusive shd address trans individuals by their preferred pronouns.

The fact you do not respect transpeople and refuse to use their preferred pronouns is an extreme view.

Nobody has pronouns. People have names. In English, third person pronouns are sex-based, not a matter of personal choice and the concept of preferred pronouns is just a way of compelling compliance to an ideology and asserting power over other people. You are insisting that they lie or effectively profess belief in the existence of GI and it's overriding importance.

Nobody can choose what they are.
If anyone wants to go along with the pretence that a person is the opposite sex to what they are, or sexless, in social situations - out of kindness or love for that particular person - that's fine. Forcing or encouraging employees to do it in a work environment is oppressive and authoritarian.

@Bornin1989
Cracking response to the survey, by the way!

I have never understood the pronouns thing as surely if you are referring to someone in the room you would say their name not She or He or They as that would be rude and would only refer to them by She/He/They if they weren’t there

If they aren’t there then they aren’t going to hear what anyone says about them anyway.

You decide.

But what are my choices? It's she or nothing, isn't it, unless I want a discussion about something pretty personal? So if I'm undecided I have to say I am a woman, which some people will take to mean I have a specific gender identity, which might be incorrect.

It’s no one’s business if your pronouns are by sex or by gender.

It's my business as to what someone will think I am telling them about myself. The fact they are asking face-to-face suggests they don't think my pronouns are related to my sex. There is a massive risk of misinformation here, which makes me uneasy.

If they are not out, they will simply respond identically to anyone who isn’t trans. It’s their choice.

Eh? What does 'anyone who isn't trans' respond to pronouns? There isn't one answer, surely - could be he or she?

You decide. It’s no one’s business if your pronouns are by sex or by gender. As I say, the voluntary option to share pronouns isn’t forcing anything on anyone.

You can prefer she/her because that is your sex. It’s not a problem for some to prefer pronouns by sex and some by gender.

So if my sex-pronouns are 'she/her' and my 'gender pronouns' are 'to be decided', which should I 'prefer'? Is the unknown one (which will always be gender) secondary by default?

How do I know what I'm telling someone about myself? Do you believe that people who use gender pronouns will know I'm talking about my sex, or vice-versa?

That doesn’t sound very nice, it’s almost as if it would be most helpful for colleagues to know up front if a person wants certain pronouns? Such as the ability to ask what pronouns they prefer at the introductions phase at the start of a meeting?

Oh wait, the OP wants that banned. So she’d rather the minefield method of finding out pronouns, seems very unprofessional and reactive instead of proactive.

Presumably, if someone is trans and out, they will request pronouns to show that. If they are not out, they will simply respond identically to anyone who isn’t trans. It’s their choice.