Page 19 | Can MNHQ set up a new discussion category called Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC)

PlanetLuna · 2023-04-04T13:59:27+00:00

MN, will you please create a talk group/category of Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC)? MN appears to currently have only 2 feminism categories: Feminism: chat Feminism: sex & gender discussions But the Feminism: sex & gender category on MN is predominantly GC, with its emphasis on trans exclusion ideology. Feminists who do not subscribe to those beliefs are often unwelcome and treated with derision and hostility in discussions. Certainly not always as some GC posters do enjoy open, intellectual discussions but often enough that engagement can be toxic & intimidating all around. It is almost impossible for non-GC feminists to find inclusive/non-GC feminist discussions, and we have to wade through unpleasant (for us) GC threads while attempting to do so. GC feminism dominates on UK parenting sites in particular. However, inclusive/non-GC feminism is extremely popular around the world (especially in places like the US, NZ, and AU) and in the UK among younger feminists and those who do not see trans rights as a threat to women & girls’ safety. Many UK feminists are non-GC but may feel silenced on MN. The addition of another category will help open up and improve MN discussions while reducing the toxicity and hostility that many feminists on both sides experience in discussions. So I propose the following feminism discussion categories: Feminism: chat (general) Feminism: sex & gender discussions (GC) Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC) {mention:MNHQ}

AskMeMore · 04/04/2023 18:14

@TheShellBeach Plenty of women disagree.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 04/04/2023 18:13

EmotionalSupportHyena · 04/04/2023 18:12

Would it look like this?

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DS1 actually did interpretive dance in school this term. I was delgihted. this far he has declined to perform his dance for me. apparently it was about racism

PinkyU · 04/04/2023 18:13

The irony of a woman saying “I’m looking for a safe space to speak” and being ripped to shreds 🙄

Happylittlechicken · 04/04/2023 18:13

AskMeMore · 04/04/2023 18:11

@Happylittlechicken Why that snidy comment?

It wasn’t snide. I was saying, if that’s what you want to discuss, start a thread. I’m sure you’ll get a good debate on it. Why did you think I was being snarky?

TheShellBeach · 04/04/2023 18:13

AskMeMore · 04/04/2023 18:09

OP I do not agree with your views, but I agree the feminist board is highly toxic to anyone who does not agree with the dominant viewpoint. The only woman accepted are those who are gender critical, very supportive of Posie Parker and who think the trans issue is the most important issue facing women.

Currently, the trans issue IS the most important issue facing women.

Helleofabore · 04/04/2023 18:12

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:06

And completely agree with poster above that there needs to be much more robust discussion about the CG overlaps with far right groups - like PA in UK and Proud Boys in US - and anti-feminist/anti-abortion groups, especially amongst the hordes of GC men on twitter. There's definitely a threat to women's bodily autonomy looming and it isn't from trans people!

OK. Start that thread. However, can the OP who starts it not use misinformation and misrepresentations to make their point please. Can it be factual, and can the OP check those facts from original sources rather than simply flinging around labels that they are repeating from else where?

That might end up a good discussion.

Hepwo · 04/04/2023 18:12

lechiffre55 · 04/04/2023 15:35

There always the place where they farm kiwis. I'm sure you'll have a great time there.

The burn ❤️‍🔥

RoseslnTheHospital · 04/04/2023 18:12

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:06

And completely agree with poster above that there needs to be much more robust discussion about the CG overlaps with far right groups - like PA in UK and Proud Boys in US - and anti-feminist/anti-abortion groups, especially amongst the hordes of GC men on twitter. There's definitely a threat to women's bodily autonomy looming and it isn't from trans people!

What "GC" men are you talking about? I see plenty of men who are socially conservative and/or religious who recognise the existence of biological sex but who are also in support of gender. As in they hold that there are gendered roles for women and men, and that only women and men should have those gendered roles.

EmotionalSupportHyena · 04/04/2023 18:12

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 04/04/2023 18:10

if I did an interpretive dance to represent 'be the change you want to see' would that help?

Show quote history

Would it look like this?

Dance Dancing GIF by What We Do in the Shadows

AskMeMore · 04/04/2023 18:11

@Happylittlechicken Why that snidy comment?

Original poster

PlanetLuna · 04/04/2023 18:11

TheShellBeach · 04/04/2023 18:00

OP, I promise not to derail any threads you care to start on Feminism Chat.
Happy now?

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😂

OP posts:

EmotionalSupportHyena · 04/04/2023 18:10

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:06

And completely agree with poster above that there needs to be much more robust discussion about the CG overlaps with far right groups - like PA in UK and Proud Boys in US - and anti-feminist/anti-abortion groups, especially amongst the hordes of GC men on twitter. There's definitely a threat to women's bodily autonomy looming and it isn't from trans people!

Would a robust discussion about this topic be possible on a board where No GC opinion is permitted?

I’d imagine you could have a pretty feeble discussion, but not a ‘robust’ one?

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 04/04/2023 18:10

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:09

And seriously, thank you OP for raising this. Sorry for deluge of comments you're getting. Sex and gender in the context of feminism has sooooo many more facets than the GC angle that need discussion.

if I did an interpretive dance to represent 'be the change you want to see' would that help?

Happylittlechicken · 04/04/2023 18:10

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:06

And completely agree with poster above that there needs to be much more robust discussion about the CG overlaps with far right groups - like PA in UK and Proud Boys in US - and anti-feminist/anti-abortion groups, especially amongst the hordes of GC men on twitter. There's definitely a threat to women's bodily autonomy looming and it isn't from trans people!

Oooh go on. Can we have a thread about that? You start. It’ll be good

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:09

And seriously, thank you OP for raising this. Sorry for deluge of comments you're getting. Sex and gender in the context of feminism has sooooo many more facets than the GC angle that need discussion.

AskMeMore · 04/04/2023 18:09

OP I do not agree with your views, but I agree the feminist board is highly toxic to anyone who does not agree with the dominant viewpoint. The only woman accepted are those who are gender critical, very supportive of Posie Parker and who think the trans issue is the most important issue facing women.

Queenofscones · 04/04/2023 18:09

I occasionally go over the Feminism Chat to see what I might me missing and end up reporting several of the threads because they are very clearly about Sex and Gender and should be in here!

IncompleteSenten · 04/04/2023 18:09

You can post your opinions. If you want to enter into a discussion about an issue as important as this then you're going to have people disagree with you and you with them and that's ok. You don't need protecting from that. You're an adult. What are you scared of?

Musomama1 · 04/04/2023 18:08

Here we go, another ' inclusion ' guilt trip for women.

Helleofabore · 04/04/2023 18:08

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 04/04/2023 18:08

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:06

And completely agree with poster above that there needs to be much more robust discussion about the CG overlaps with far right groups - like PA in UK and Proud Boys in US - and anti-feminist/anti-abortion groups, especially amongst the hordes of GC men on twitter. There's definitely a threat to women's bodily autonomy looming and it isn't from trans people!

lady - do it

bring your debating shoes though

Labraradabrador · 04/04/2023 18:08

onegirlandherdog · 04/04/2023 18:06

And completely agree with poster above that there needs to be much more robust discussion about the CG overlaps with far right groups - like PA in UK and Proud Boys in US - and anti-feminist/anti-abortion groups, especially amongst the hordes of GC men on twitter. There's definitely a threat to women's bodily autonomy looming and it isn't from trans people!

👏 well said

Hepwo · 04/04/2023 18:07

sweetcreams · 04/04/2023 15:20

Keep the two existing spaces and create a new section:

Femalism: Kellie-Jay Keen stan chat

where her followers can post gifs and Carl Benjamin/Matt Walsh/alt-right links to their heart's content.

I was right!

Queenofscones · 04/04/2023 18:07

Crikeyisthatthetime · 04/04/2023 17:41

Hold on, why restrict this idea to the feminist forum? Can't we create a new category in Style and beauty for people who aren't interested in bags? I'd like to post about fashion and stuff without ever having to encounter handbags, shoulder bags or (urgh) totes. And maybe one that doesn't mention clothes, for days when getting dressed is a challenge.
Oh, and a gardening subsection that doesn't include South facing gardens. Mine is North facing, and the many mentions of sun loving plants can all be a bit too much.

This is exactly where the demigender, aromantic-pixie-girl-unique-and-wonderful-self BS kicked off on TikTok isn't it? Girls (mainly girls) refining and defining their GI to create safe little bubbles where no one challenged them and they were safe from encountering handbags.

This article by Jonathan Heidt on why the mental health of liberal girls has suffered so massively will cast light:
https://www.thefp.com/p/why-the-mental-health-of-liberal

Of course it's a shock to find that Mumsnetters don't agree with them.

Why the Mental Health of Liberal Girls Sank First and Fastest

We are a decade into the largest epidemic of adolescent mental illness ever recorded. It’s time we started treating social media like automobiles and firearms.

https://www.thefp.com/p/why-the-mental-health-of-liberal

stopthepigeon · 04/04/2023 18:07

StellaAndCrow · 04/04/2023 18:02

Still laughing/puzzling at "inclusive (non-GC)"

A loaded question is a question that contains an accusation or unjustified assumption...