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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Is the Trans shooter in Nashville Male or Female?

545 replies

Tradeup · 28/03/2023 04:53

The murderer who came in and killed 3 children and 3 adults is trans and called Audrey, I am confused as to their biological sex.

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Untitledsquatboulder · 29/03/2023 06:53

BellaAmorosa · 29/03/2023 00:31

Testosterone doesn't cause violence in anybody - it affects your mood and emotions. Your actions are entirely your responsibility.

It's does predispose you to aggression though.

borntobequiet · 29/03/2023 05:30

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 28/03/2023 23:42

I thought most of the feminist section didn't believe that testosterone causes violence? All the discussions I've read on, here say it's male socialisation.

Are we now saying it causes violence in women but not men?

I think you’ve been reading selectively, partially, or don’t understand what you’ve read. Others have already explained where and how you are mistaken, so I won’t.

WarriorN · 29/03/2023 05:12

There's either been 4 females or 8, of whom 50% are trans.

WarriorN · 29/03/2023 05:11

The database (of mass shootings in 50 years) covers 172 people involved in a mass shooting. Almost 98% of them were male, with the youngest aged 11 and the oldest 70.

If we consider the stats - 98% of shooters are male. Roughly 168 v 4.

Of course we don't know the % who are recorded as male when they're female.

If 4 have been trans men, either way it points to a high % of females identifying as trans who've committed these crimes.

It may not be the trans there key here. As the database says all have been in crisis prior to or at the point of the shooting. Doesn't excuse the crime.

We know mh is a huge factor / driver in identifying as trans.

We also know from increasing research that transitioning doesn't appear to help mh longer term. For some it increases.

This analysis matters because it's safeguarding for both victims of the crime and the individuals themselves.

Delphinium20 · 29/03/2023 03:14

Katypyee · 29/03/2023 02:30

Their gender assigned at birth and the gender they identify with are completely irrelevant. Why is their sex of any concern to you? Your concern should be more at the fact there is yet another mass school shooting, and the highest source of child death in the US is from gun crime.

To my knowledge, out of all the school shootings, this is the first trans person. Nobody harped on about all the other shooters being male.

It is tiresome how many people here seem focused on what was inside the shooter's pants, rather than the fact a shooting took place.

It's not. There have been at least 4 transmen who've committed shooting crimes and now 2 who have killed more than 4 people at a school.

Fukuraptor · 29/03/2023 03:13

Er.. feminists are very concerned about male violence and absolutely make a point of calling it out and discussing it. This murderer is female, and that is unusual and there was some confusion over reporting of the sex versus gender id of the individual. Of course it's going to be a topic of discussion on the Sex and Gender board, just as male incel behaviour was after the Plymouth attacks.

Her messages to her friend (poor woman) prior suggest that suicide (using the police as the weapon) was prominent in her thinking immediately prior to the attack. Or she wanted the friend to think so. Obviously it doesn't explain or excuse the premeditation and taking 6 innocent lives including children also.

It's heartbreaking.

We're all just trying to understand why it happened.

Katypyee · 29/03/2023 02:30

Their gender assigned at birth and the gender they identify with are completely irrelevant. Why is their sex of any concern to you? Your concern should be more at the fact there is yet another mass school shooting, and the highest source of child death in the US is from gun crime.

To my knowledge, out of all the school shootings, this is the first trans person. Nobody harped on about all the other shooters being male.

It is tiresome how many people here seem focused on what was inside the shooter's pants, rather than the fact a shooting took place.

TitterYeeNot · 29/03/2023 01:55

The red baseball cap was a nice touch.

What on earth is going on with school security over there?

BlackForestCake · 29/03/2023 01:50

It doesn't seem to be clear whether she was going by "Aiden" all the time or just some of the time. Perhaps that is one of the reasons.

Apparently – yet again – her conservative parents didn’t like her being gay. So a talented young woman was groomed into an insane death cult.

GerronBuzanDoThaWomwok · 29/03/2023 01:13

She was a woman who murdered adults and school children in cold blood.
She was shot dead my male police officers.

ItIsFiat · 29/03/2023 01:03

Usian · 29/03/2023 00:58

Politicians will say on TV, robotically, "thoughts and prayers, thoughts and prayers..." I can't imagine the gun problem ever going away in the US. Now that mental illness is treated with hormones and amputation instead of with therapy, I'm sure it will only get worse.

Prince Harry shows that the best treatment in the world doesn't work.

I don't think the answer is body mutilation either.

Usian · 29/03/2023 00:58

Politicians will say on TV, robotically, "thoughts and prayers, thoughts and prayers..." I can't imagine the gun problem ever going away in the US. Now that mental illness is treated with hormones and amputation instead of with therapy, I'm sure it will only get worse.

Mamanyt · 29/03/2023 00:50

SpinningTooFastIWantToGetOff · 28/03/2023 06:16

From the Guardian:

The shooter was named as Audrey Elizabeth Hale, 28, and from Nashville.
Drake said Hale was a former student at the school. He also said Hale identified as transgender.

That sounds like the murderer was male? Otherwise they are misgendering him? Also interesting use of 'identified as' transgender, but could just be reporting what was said.
Until journalist relearn the skill of reporting the facts, we can only speculate 🧐

Being in the USA, I've actually seen some video footage of this person in the hallways of the school. I think, and I am only guessing, that this is a female-to-male person, although I won't make any bets on it. The manner of moving is very female, although the overall physical appearance (from some distance) is male.

Usian · 29/03/2023 00:49

I'm in the US and it's interesting that when a trans-identifying male commits rape or murder, most of the media won't mention that the perp is not a biological woman. It's considered hateful to do so. But here we have a FtM and the media are all calling her a woman, most not mentioning at all the she identifies as a man.

Usian · 29/03/2023 00:45

Me too! I looked her up specifically because I thought, "that can't be a woman." I assumed she was a MtF.

TottyKnickers · 29/03/2023 00:37

DotAndCarryOne2 · 28/03/2023 23:20

Other way around.

Yep sorry. Completely confused

BellaAmorosa · 29/03/2023 00:32

@ScrollingLeaves
Not being able to cry. That is so sad.

BellaAmorosa · 29/03/2023 00:31

Testosterone doesn't cause violence in anybody - it affects your mood and emotions. Your actions are entirely your responsibility.

ScrollingLeaves · 29/03/2023 00:24

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · Yesterday 23:42
I thought most of the feminist section didn't believe that testosterone causes violence? All the discussions I've read on, here say it's male socialisation.

Are we now saying it causes violence in women but not men?

Men commit 98% of crimes for whatever reason, and according to studies so do transsexual men - they retain the same pattern if offending as ordinary men.
It cannot all be testosterone and men are often confident and assertive but not aggressive, but that crime rate for men cannot be all socialisation.

Transsexual females do not remain the same as ordinary women, they take on a more male offending pattern.

De transitioner Helena found testosterone made her feel very angry and she also became so psychotic she had to be hospitalised. She also said she couldn’t cry.
https://lacroicsz.substack.com/p/by-any-other-name?s=r

By Any Other Name

The story of my transition and detransition.

https://lacroicsz.substack.com/p/by-any-other-name?s=r

Signalbox · 28/03/2023 23:59

I thought most of the feminist section didn't believe that testosterone causes violence? All the discussions I've read on, here say it's male socialisation.

People have various views on here. We’re not a hive mind. Male socialisation is likely to have an influence on male patterns of behaviour but the idea that testosterone does not play a role would be strange. We know that hormones affect our behaviour and emotions so why would it be any different with testosterone?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 28/03/2023 23:58

You know what looks like dangerous extremism to me?

Apparently there is an attempt on Twitter to airbrush this out of existence, and people are being blocked for sharing even critically.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 28/03/2023 23:45

ItIsFiat · 28/03/2023 20:48

Who are the brownshirts again?

The families participating in the church and school including her parents are allowed their own world view and beliefs as was the shooter.

The shooter was 28, she could have gone off and live her best life believing whatever she liked.

Many families don't agree on politics, religion and all sorts.

You can't go around punching 70 year old women and throwing fluids at 5 foot 1 inch women or shooting the 9 year old daughter of your pastor and head teacher because they don't share your beliefs.

You have misunderstood what I was saying, and clearly haven’t looked at the quote history. If you had, you would have understood the comments I was responding to and why I felt the need to point out why it wasn’t acceptable to use dehumanising language such as ‘it’ to refer to the shooter. That does not mean I was supporting the actions of the shooter in any way - that’s what you seem to be implying. Neither was I suggesting that it’s in any way acceptable to use violence against those who don’t share your beliefs - none of the things I made reference to were mentioned for any other reason than to make the point that the motives behind the shootings were a lot more complex than that poster was suggesting. It doesn’t mean I support them. Since you have declined to explain your comments, I felt I should clarify.

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 28/03/2023 23:42

I thought most of the feminist section didn't believe that testosterone causes violence? All the discussions I've read on, here say it's male socialisation.

Are we now saying it causes violence in women but not men?

ScrollingLeaves · 28/03/2023 23:32

In this particular case it is a female being radicalised by similar methods
And possibly poisoned with testosterone in her female body to a point of rage, a suicidal state and psychosis.

PriamFarrl · 28/03/2023 23:31

I feel that we need to be aware of extremism from all sorts of directions.

“You are one of us, we like you even though you don’t get on with your family. Others don’t understand you but we do. Those other people are the ones stopping you being happy. They don’t like you. They don’t like the way you do things or what you believe. They want to stop you from living your life. You need to make sure that doesn’t happen”.

Thst could be said to someone who is a faith group extremist, right wing extremist, TRA, MRA and pretty much any other group. There are many people who sit there whispering poision into people’s ears.