Dd ran away to be with trans lover and refuses to return

@Moomoola I have a great relationship with DH but he isn’t good with some emotions, talking about them, or recognizing them in others. All our kids have got frustrated with him at times during their teens and thought he didn’t love them or care about them; but as they have got older they have recognized that he shows love in very different ways than me, but ways that are so important.

First they have recognized that he loves them, he does tell them and does respond to times they reach out to him and he is usually very calm and good natured. They have grown to understand how his love is shown by his actions, his commitment to his family, and how he is extremely hard working and provides everything we all need. Like many men he is very concerned about their safety. Recently I woke up as he was getting out of bed and getting dressed. I asked him where he was going and he said our DD 22 had just called him as she went out for the night in the middle of the city and her car wouldn’t start and it was 2am. She is at the local Uni and doesn’t live at home (we are in the suburbs of a big city in the USA). He didn’t think twice about getting out of bed and going straight out to help her. He doesn’t complain but always does what needs to be done at a very practical level. He is a constant problem solver.

He also has a lot of interests and hobbies. So recently our eldest has started pottery classes with him and now they spend a lot of time making stuff on their potters wheels (he bought her one for Christmas to put in her dorm room at Uni) and he fires it all in a kiln in the garage.

Our 16 yr old son took up the electric guitar recently (which my husband plays) and they practice together. All 3 kids will go to the gym and work out with their dad at different times.

My point is that love can look different in different people and we show our love in different ways. I don’t agree with people being hard on your DH as my husband would react in the same way, he would be agitated and worried about her safety and who she was with and I could definitely see my calm DH get very stressed and anxious worried about a DD who had left, didn’t want to see us and could potentially take serious opposite-sex hormones. Men in general can get very physically protective, they want to know they loved ones are safe and sound and want to do what they can to make that happen.

Maybe talk to your DD about the ways your DH loves her and the family in ways that are different than you and how sometimes we can do the wrong thing in our attempts to care for others. It’s hard for all parents when our kids are moving from childhood to be independent adults, but I have found with my own DH anyway that he is particularly concerned about the physical safety of our two DDs (22 & 19). I don’t think that’s a bad quality and I know they have grown to appreciate that their dad really cares about them and of course he can physically protect them in ways I just can’t (he is 6’1” for a start while I am 5’5”).

I’m having lots of fun with topical name changes at present! Not an anonymity thing tho as I suspect my writing style and overshares are somewhat obvious 😆

MN seems to have a new function that makes it much easier to stick to one name per thread without having to manually correct to a previous name (which is easy to forget when typing on the go) so that’s v. useful!

Fab posts TheClogLady.
**Good to see you back (in a name I recognise).

Oh! And you can ask DD and X for advice on chivvying your DS out of his room - they will feel flattered and grown up to be asked and you will be acknowledging that their identities (teenagers who identify as on the transmasc spectrum) are closer to teenage boy than yours is (middle aged mum!)

By answering questions about your DS withdrawal and possible things to entice him out with, they may well accidentally give away things that they themselves are influenced by/thinking about/would like to experience.

Go in sideways!

You can bop her on the head at some future point in time, when your relationship is re established!
She’ll probably realise she deserves a bop herself one day (not until 24/25 tho).

Whatever the reason for X being present, just say yes.
If you say no it will give your DD an excuse to cancel the meet up and give X the opportunity to paint you as the bad guy again.
It’s possible that X’s behaviour up til now is driven by X genuinely believing you and DH are a pair of evil, controlling, transphobes rather than a family negotiating some difficult times after illness/bereavement and that coinciding with your DD’s hitting the often-difficult teenage years.

If it were me I would try and act like I was meeting my DC’s romantic interest in completely normal circumstances- a warm smile, a handshake, a hot chocolate at Costa and cake in a paper bag to take home.
Show X and your DD that you are a fully-rounded, caring human (not a Disney villain!) who loves both your DC and wants the best for them as they move towards their adult lives.

You could even thank X for giving your DD the confidence to get a part time job!

If X feels like X can trust you, X may well become less vigilant for perceived slights and signs of transphobia and relax enough that DD will feel able to see you more freely (and perhaps eventually, to move back home whilst continuing to date X).

If you refuse to meet X then you will just creat an adversarial situation where your DD is forced to choose between you and as X and X’s home currently seems like the safe option, it’s likely you’ll be the one who is rejected.

Maybe this whole thing is a massive misunderstanding caused by everyone’s projected emotional baggage and your DD feeling excluded while you’ve been busy with grief and your DH has been hiding at work?

X has no doubt been getting the same ‘your parents are boomers who hate you and are ruining your life’ messaging from the internet as your DD has - that X’s parents have managed to negotiate this phenomenon and keep their teen in the house might be more to do with them not having the really big life disruption events that your family has had?

I’m sure my DsD’s Gender stuff really took off as a result of her little sister’s cancer - the family was looking the other way and she felt alienated and lonely, this coincided with puberty and suddenly looking like a woman and getting cat called and she disappeared inside the trans identity as a combo of protective shell & maladaptive expression of her need for connection with her dad.

Seems to me that your daughter needs her fam (who have been dealing with some massive, earth shattering, unavoidable situations) and pushing you away is a similar protective shell. She doesn’t risk rejection/not getting her emotional needs met if she runs off and shelters inside another family’s life, a family who hasn’t got a grieving mum and a workaholic dad.

Apologies if that feels like an overstep - I’m not a professional and much of what I say here is a projection of my own experiences, so do keep that in mind.

Rooting for you!

This all sounds so positive!

Having a complex relationship with one’s father doesn’t mean the chap is actually an abuser - especially if the complications are revealed as part of the inevitable teenage struggle towards independence.

(same for complex relationships with mothers although that’s not my wheelhouse)

The teenage years are the beginning of seeing our parents as full human beings, with positive and negative traits (and their own childhood emotional baggage) rather than just ‘Mum’ & ‘Dad’ archetypes.

In relationships where mum has done quite a lot of swan work (paddling away under the surface of family life whilst keeping things looking quite serene on top) it probably feels quite shocking when we get the first glimpses of dad as a real person.
In time, with more context, we likely come around to seeing the positives again.
My own dad was quite absent via work, but 30 years later, I can appreciate that part of him (working class boy who left school at 14 and made something of himself) even if there were many years in between where I felt very resentful that he had never once been to a parents evening, a school play or one of my dance competitions.
Funnily enough, as a young child I often imagined he would pay me more attention if I were a boy who played competitive football, rather than a girl who could dance.

Now I can see that his relentless work schedule not only paid for all those dance lessons but meant my mum had time to take me/sew on endless shoe ribbons.

Bit of a shallow example really, but an illustration of the child-teen-adult take on the same situation.

FWIW:
My emotionally absent, workaholic father facilitated a life for us that was so much better than his own poverty stricken, post war childhood with way too many siblings to fit in a 3 bed council house, a habitual criminal dad (in and out of prison) and a mother who went blind young via untreated diabetes. He never really had a chance to learn proper emotional/nurturing skills.

Each generation wants something different for their own future, for their own eventual families, but we inevitably carry some of it forward even when we don’t want to! Luckily it does water down somewhat.

(I admit, I am myself am always attracted to working class men who excel in their careers! Despite knowing full-well that all that commitment to work makes them less available for family life 😬🤦‍♀️)

Have you had any more family therapy sessions yet? I really hope your DH can approach it in an open minded way - hopefully you, he and your two DC will have a long and happy future relationship after getting beyond this bump in the road, regardless of whether the trans thing sticks or not.

Good news that DD agreed to meet!

Not meaning to pile on your DH - my own father could be difficult but wasn't abusive, and he was open to trying to trying to understand and change. Sometimes it takes people time to get their heads round it.

Use your own judgment about what to say to DD. You're doing really well! And my guess is that the more calm and firm you can sound about it to DH, the less pushback you'll get. He must be so scrared too. XX

🌷💯🍵

I'm a pretty strong feminist, with a lot of radical feminism values, yet 'LTB' isn't realistic nor always fair (all men have some forms of socialized bs patriarchal behavior and a separatist all-woman island isn't all that practical!) and it's not like we don't love men in our lives!

It's a lot healthier to point out to your DH when he's controlling and tell him how this undermines what he wants - which is to get DD back. If you LTB, he's still her dad, still your DS dad, his dynamic w/ DD isn't going to change if you change your marriage. Of course, if he really is abusive, I'm the first to shout LTB...but I'm not sure if I'm getting that vibe from you. Your DH could certainly use some therapy now, if just to help him control his emotions.

Do you have any cool pictures of you when you were young? Maybe show DD these? She might have fun seeing you all hip and youthful! My DD (18) loves this but DD 13 is more like 'meh' (she's too young).

For the longest time I thought I was the only one that had a crazy family, then over time it gradually dawned on me that's actually normal.

And I think it's important to be honest but also let her know NO family is perfect - that was one thing I really pulled from the professional counselors like Ayad and O'Malley - that young people often think their problems are so unique and unknowable, which further alienates them from loved ones. That's why trans is so seductive-there's always one more step in transitioning that will bring you closer to a euphoria which is elusive-but it's a false path because you aren't addressing your core issues, you use trans as an escape. Maybe your daughter fears growing up, fears an imperfect marriage as a woman and being with glitter family and being trans is an escape from the reality that life isn't a perfect path forward and we may be more like our moms than we want (heartbreaking but normal emotion at this age). Maybe you can tell her how life and relationships are a balance of good, neutral, bad and her path can be her own but it should be hers and not what her GF wants. And how you and your DH only want her health and happiness. She will have to recognize on her own the GF's lifestyle isn't healthy for her.

Great update!

I'm so happy DD is willing to meet you!

As to DH, you're right, no one is perfect and I don't know for sure how his behavior impacts your DD but I do know that sometimes teens exaggerate their parents reactions but also parents can have blind spots. The best you can do is keep telling your DD you love her and miss her. Again, it's the gender ideology that's harms families. 20 years ago your daughter might have struggled as a lot a young people always have but she'd not have the risk of irreversible hormone and surgical damage.

Also, just watched Affirmation Generation- a new film about ROGD kids. Lots of insights from detransisters that I think will help you understand what her mind might be going through. Stella O'Malley and Sasha Ayad have long segments with lots of professional advice.

Talk about it anywhere that feels right - have this thread moved if you like, or post the link go the new one here if you want us to come over there.

We’re all rooting for you - hopefully the family counsellor can get through to your DH and help him to understand and adjust his own behaviour.
In the meantime, it’s great that you’ve got that avenue of communications open.
I would imagine most 17 year olds feel like their dad is either too controlling or too disinterested- sometimes both in one package. Let your DD know that you know your future role is a supportive one rather than a dictating one - get her to think back to learning to ride a bike - she’s pedalling like mad but it’s not quite time for mum & dad to let go of the back of the saddle yet, and of course you are worried that if you let go before she’s ready she’ll fall down and get hurt.
Tell her that you know that soon she’ll be off cycling far faster than you can run, but if you both keep communicating you are far more likely to let go at the right moment, rather than too soon, if not soon enough.

if you could work together you'd be better and also create a happier place for your ds

@balzamico makes a very good point. And "working together" is an important goal for family therapy and I wouldn't let DH wriggle out of it. Yes he's busy at work but what is he so busy for? For himself? Or to support his family who are having a crisis and need something apart from money from him right now?

I can't help but think that your dh is part of the problem here. Has he done any of the reading and research you have? All of his suggestions seem to be quite extreme and angry not to mention that they also seem like they'd push your dd further away.
I totally understand he's stressed but he's taking it out in you while not making the situation any better, if you could work together you'd be better and also create a happier place for your ds