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MNHQ

Should Mumsnet be going to Baby Show ? We need your views

207 replies

carriemumsnet · 02/10/2008 14:22

Hi all

Reposting this here from the Baby Show volunteers thread to make sure we get widest response....

Basically we've had a great response to our appeal for help running a stall at the Baby Show. But now something has come up and, as usual, we want you to contribute to our decision. We've had an email from a mumsnetter saying that Clarion, the Baby Show organisers, also organise arms fairs and questioning whether, in that case, Mumsnet should be associated with them.

I don't think any of us are pro arms, but you could argue that Clarion aren't manufacturing or selling arms, they're just the organisers of a fair.

If we attend the Baby Show we have the chance to introduce Mumsnet (a good thing we hope you'll agree ) to several thousand mums-to-be who will then find out, for example, why lots of Mumsnetters boycott Nestle as well as the truth about fruit shoots and Greggs sausage rolls.

Or we pull out now. It's another one of those 'where do you draw the line?' discussions and we're torn. What do you think?

MNHQ

OP posts:
Jux · 03/10/2008 11:56

NO. You are supporting people who support people who sells guns and bombs which kill people. Legitimate or not. (and half the legitimate dealers deal illicitly anyway - read Private Eye)

madlentileater · 03/10/2008 11:43

this definitely does not answer my comcerns!!!
no body ever suggested it was an arms fair speciifcally tagreted at terrorists and oppressive regimes.
abiding by 'strictest govt guidelines' does not reassure me in the slightest.
'defence and security industry' is just that- an industry, whose highest motivation is profit, therefore they will sell wherever they can.
Don't go. If you look at te Campaign Against the Arms Trade ws, (www.caat.org.uk/campaigns/armsfairs/reedelsevier.php) you will see all the people- academics, HCPs, Joseph Rowntree trust who have objected to these fairs.
Don't go!

zippitippitoes · 03/10/2008 11:41

his response is as you would expect

i am still of opinion no

QuintessentialShadow · 03/10/2008 11:37

By Carmenere on Thu 02-Oct-08 14:40:16

Well not going will make feck all difference to the arms trade but going will make lots of difference to mothers lives so i think go*.

MNHQ
GeraldineMumsnet · 03/10/2008 11:29

Hi, we got in touch with Clarion after we had the original email from the mum querying why MN was thinking of going to the Baby Show. Here's their response:

Dear Carolyn

I wanted to write to you since you recently received a misleading and inflammatory email with regard to our business. I am concerned that this may have alarmed you, and wanted to take this opportunity to personally set the record straight and allay the concerns you have expressed.

As part of Clarion Events? ongoing development, we publicly announced the acquisition of three defence and security exhibitions in May and the acquisition of a further two last month. The email you received inaccurately describes these as ?arms fairs?; in fact, these are trade exhibitions which enjoy full UK and international Government support and which serve only the legitimate global defence industry. Exhibitors, including many leading British companies, must adhere to the highest regulatory standards, not just complying with, but also exceeding domestic and international law.

The email you received implies that the legitimate defence industry contributes to the illegal trade in weapons and human rights around the world - this is not the case. The UK places the strictest controls on the export of defence equipment and services and has led the way in the adoption of the EU Code of Conduct on arms exports.

Clarion Events has been creating and developing high quality exhibitions and events in a wide range of diverse sectors for more than 30 years, from retail to cars and from fine art to energy. Doing so in a well regulated, world class environment is our primary aim and we apply the same very high standards, rigour, experience, skill and care to organising all of our events.

We do not believe that public opinion is opposed to the defence and security industry. Whilst we respect everyone?s right to an opinion we, as you would expect, considered our decision to run events for this sector very carefully and we remain entirely secure with this.

We do believe that visitors and exhibitors at The Baby Show will continue to judge us on the standard of the event and the significant benefits everyone receives as a result of participating. Visitor bookings for the Earls Court show are already ahead of last year. We are looking forward to another very successful event.

I hope my letter answers any concerns you might have and hope that we will work together at this upcoming Baby Show and in the future.

If you do have any further questions however, please feel free to contact me.

Yours sincerely

Matt Miller
Show Manager
The Baby Shows

priceyp · 03/10/2008 11:10

TMMJ: "pull out and do press release about WHY.
going would be dodgy for several reasons.

  1. connections with arms dealers
  2. would attract too many huns."

I read that and got confused about why we don't want to attract 2nd World War germans.

I agree with all who have posted to say don't go. There are better ways to drum up website hits and registrations. No one will give it much of a look, they're after freebies and "I want one of those" stalls.

MrsBadger · 02/10/2008 21:46

Don't go

tis shame the attendees will miss out but there it is - I suspect your ideal target audience is otherwhere anyway.

also a shame if MN lose advertising revenoo they may otherwise have scooped but agree there is virtue in not being easily bought.

(I do wonder about the disparity between The Ideal MNer from a) our point of view and b) the advertisers' point of view sometimes. Would they like more bottle-using, Pampers-buying Boden-wearers who alreayd buy the stuff in the ads? Or more bfing clothbottomed scruffs so they can convert them? )

whomovedmychocolate · 02/10/2008 21:25

Don't go. If I have to boycott Mumsnet I'll have to talk to my DH and divorce is fucking expensive!

onebatmother · 02/10/2008 21:19

I would pay a lot to see Swedes selling propane and propane accessories at the petrochemicals fair. She'd have to leave the cheroots at home, for starters. And don't they still man the stalls topless there?

Bewilderbeast · 02/10/2008 20:58

to put my two penn'oth worth in I don't think you should go. For reasons already eloquently expressed by others on this thread

lulumama · 02/10/2008 20:45

sorry flame ! !

onebatmother · 02/10/2008 20:43
  1. whole point of baby show is to sell, sell, sell anxious first-parents things that they don't need and can't afford - thus commercialization of infancy/childhood.
  1. Arms fairs very, very different from Armed Forces. Proven, time and time again, to go over The Line - thus ethical insupportable. Solution: what Threadie said.
  1. TACKY. Tackytackytackytackytackytacky! For god's sakes women, if torture doesn't stop you in your tracks, surely the vulgarity quotient will?
fanjolina · 02/10/2008 20:39

Don't go.

And tbh, I'm not sure how many expectant mums would be tempted by MN at a show like that - they will all be gushing over huge 3-wheel pushchairs, cot bumpers and matching babygrows and booties.

whooosh · 02/10/2008 20:35

So how many PFTM's will be interested ind a "chat " site.

All everyone eants at a babyshoe (IMHO) os freebies and shopping-generally PFB nonsens (she says with experience).

I personally fell the allocated funds could be better spent/targetted at online users.....

Twiglett · 02/10/2008 20:33

My other comments would be

to do a trade show properly you need a great eye-catching Point of Sale piece .. you can't just whack a couple of laptops down and have a bit of signage really

to have people representing your brand is farkin' dangerous if you ask me .. yes I'm sure all the volunteers are lovely and wonderful but they are individuals and the point of MN is the melting pot .. you're putting all your eggs in an unknown basket. And making the personality of the site the personality of those mners who are happy to attend and do it .. Danger Will Robinson, Danger!

oh and the fact that we don't want any more proles (did I mention that one)

TotalChaos · 02/10/2008 20:32

Agree with Threadie and Riven.

Peachy · 02/10/2008 20:32

'Plus no disabled facilities? At a babyfair?'

thats pretty shocking!

There seems to be far more reasons to not go than go imo

themildmannneredjanitor · 02/10/2008 20:32

pull out and do press release about WHY.
going would be dodgy for several reasons.

  1. connections with arms dealers
  2. would attract too many huns.
VictorianSqualor · 02/10/2008 20:32

lol, Squonk.

IAteDavinaForDinner · 02/10/2008 20:31

I agree that it would be best to pull out - the publicity you could achieve if you were smart about it (which I have no doubts you will be) would be excellent and would pique the interest of both sponsors/advertisers and new users. It's an excellent publicity slant - to be seen taking an ethical stance these days is going to attract interest, especially since you can push the idea that your thousands of users (that's us ) asked you not to go.

Anyway, it's just like NetMums in a shed, innit? Pfffffrt, I'd rather stay here and argue about parking spaces.

Flamebat · 02/10/2008 20:26

NOTW ?

Lulu - Read that 3 times to work out what Cay Jones (in my reading voice) were...

Twiglett · 02/10/2008 20:25

god you're going to bring more proles to the site?

I can't stand it

Mothercare was bad enough

I do have a view on this tbh .. I'm not sure MN is going to benefit that greatly from a trade show unless it's the trade you're wooing for sponsorship and product placement and basic money .. in which case go ahead .. but going to drum up posters ain't the right objective if you ask me

InvisiblePsychomum · 02/10/2008 20:25

I say yes, for the same reasons as flame and MRM

plus, we can reach out to more people by being there and hoping to get them joining up, and then we can educate them on MN.

fryalot · 02/10/2008 20:23

I am in two several minds about this:

one the one hand... if you boycott every major company that has dealings that we don't agree with, we won't be buying anything

but... we know that they deal in arms and that's a very very bad thing

but... reaching all those mums to be can't possibly be a bad thing, some of them may need our help (cue theme tune to The A Team)

but... if there is a way to let them know we're here without going, then that is surely the bestest of all solutions.

so... don't go, but sell the story of why you're not going to the NOTW or Take a Break.

lulumama · 02/10/2008 20:19

pull out and get the publicity about why you are not going

MN is not run of the mill or a site that goes with the herd.

we have cojones !

or summat

anyway, i agree with what all the other clever people said about why you should not go

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