what on earht are you all doing wih tis suiceide stuff

well good for you that you can deal with it that way madamez.

I meant that I agreed with JAC's post of 20:36, not the subsequent one which I think would be impossible (if laudable)

tiredlady-i very much doubt there is a psychiatrist on call 24/7 where i live,as there is only one psychiatrist in the town and i dont think he does that many hours.his waiting list has been closed for a long time as it was more than a 3 year wait to see him.

i have atually told my CPN about MN and another site i use,and 'post on internet forum' is one of the options in my relapse prevention plan.

'debating on MN' is also down as a potential trigger

The tone of this thread made me so angry at the start and I'm so glad to find there have now been so many posts with a more compassionate attitude since then. It has reaffirmed my faith in MN as a caring community.

I just hope that the debate that's happening here, and some of the more heartless comments, don't make people feel that MN is not the place where they can get support in their parenting. As I read this thread I was browsing the others in active convos and the very first one I read was a mum saying she was so low that she even felt suicidal because of the behaviour of her toddler. She got some fantastic practical responses to help her. This is surely what MN, at core, is for.

But she could easily have read this thread before posting and felt that some people would rather she took her problems elsewhere.

JAC: Frankly, I think if that's going to be done then it needs to be a team of people (you can't expect one individual to do it 24/7) with professional experience or at least some sort of training, and they should be paid and given professional support.
ANd I don;t think that's either feasible for MN, nor do I think (and I don't mean this harshly) that it is justified - basically as there is not going to be enough, er, work for such a team of people to merit their wages.

Foxinsocks:, erm, I do know. Not only am I getting on a bit (in my 40s) so have had more time to have a variety of experiences, but for some reason I have always attracted the more volatile as friends. SO I have done my share of patching up cuts and making the judgement call as to whether or not to dial 999. It isn't fun at the time and whether or not black humour becomes the best response later depends on the individuals concerned and the outcome. But I stand by what I said, that we all do the best we can and most of the time there's an OK conclusion, and when the end result is that someone dies: well people did their best and can do no more. And we are all, ultimately, going to die one day.

jac - agree absolutely.

I was just responding to madamez, not commenting on the threads. I think I probably said enough on that yesterday .

I have not seen enough of these threads to make an accurate judgement. But what I have seen does not lead me to believe that they are being used by people who are acutely suicidal.Distressed and unhappy people - yes. Attention seeking people - possibly/probably. Acutely suicidal people- I've not seen it.

It sounds as though there are more people in favour of the threads remaining, so maybe they should stay.

I think these threads are damaging and unhealthy, but people have the right to do damaging and unhealthy things in a democracy

s'alright

sorry berolina. This thread has been moving too fast.

I don't think that was me, spicemonster, although I made a related point.

It can be very harrowing I agree. But I don't think you can pull threads where people have posted that they feel suicidal. For all the reasons posted yesterday and I don't see the need to rehash the same arguments again.

I agree with madamez - I've dealt with some pretty fucking hairy situations in my time and I don't take personal responsibility for anyone else's stuff. Other people might not feel like that but that's where a note from MN might help. I don't think you can sanction against people getting emotionally involved in other people's lives. In the same way as you wouldn't tell someone to not get involved RL with someone who was being abused by their partner. Their decision.

people tend to forget the nature of this particular board as well.

it doesn't work like 9 out of 10 out there, with regards to moderatation and the like.

and that's the beauty of it for most of us.

it can be bloody harrowing though madamez, dealing with a suicidal person in real life as an untrained individual. And it can have long lasting effects for that person.

We don't need to judge. We can offer a shoulder (and the essential helpline/agency phone numbers) or walk away.

SOmething that seems to be being missed out on here is that sometimes people who are not properly trained (and not that smart, either) find themselves having to deal with a suicidal person. And most of them do the best they can. (many many years ago I had a particularly volatile crew of friends and there were one or two incidents of people driving madly round houseing estates looking for Someone who had fucked off in hysterics with a bellyful of pills and a carving knife). WHile I do agree that longterm help for the mentally ill should be sought from a properly trained professional, I do sometimes worry about the dreadful passivity I see in a lot of people, the 'it's not my job, what if I get it wrong, ask an expert etc'. Experts fuck up sometimes too.
There are no guarantees, of course there aren't, everyone's just bludnering through the best they can.
But finally, posting anything including suicidal stuff (or ways to help the suicidal) on an internet forum means running the risk of responses that are flippant, unkind or idiotic, as well.

Its this 'attention seeking' vs 'really serious' debate aswell that would say to me all suicide threat threads need to be pulled asap and the poster referred to help elsewhere. Who are we, nameless posters on a parenting website to make that judgement about whats serious and whats not, what poses a risk and what doesn't???

The potential for harm to all involved is hideous.

Its this 'attention seeking' vs 'really serious' debate aswell that would say to me all suicide threat threads need to be pulled asap and the poster referred to help elsewhere. Who are we, nameless posters on a parenting website to make that judgement about whats serious and whats not, what poses a risk and what doesn't???

The potential for harm to all involved is hideous.