Talk Guidelines and references to disability

Agree with the OP but the MN “hate speech” moderation basically boils down to “you can freely insult autistic or ND people on MN - so fill your intolerant boots”.

Most disagreeable arseholes are neurotypical btw. Suggesting autism just because someone is an arse is very flaccid thinking. You’ll never stop the righteous keyboards warriors, however, because well my husband has been a total cunt fir decades and turns out HE’s on the spectrum, which proves that any arseholery can be rebranded as a disability. 🙄

I agree with this too. It’s not an either/or.
But are more people more confident in self diagnosing because of places like this allowing ableist stereotyping comments to stand?

What else do we see on here? People self diagnosing. I’ve seen this so many times. Someone has just done the exact thing a few comments up!

I would argue that self diagnosing a ND condition is possibly as insulting as claiming someone’s ‘different’ behaviour is ASD / ADHD / OCD etc. Its as insulting as the transwoman who also identifies as physically disabled and goes around in a wheelchair even though he does not have a physical disability.

So you want to police people’s speech now?

It’s the implied meaning that any unreasonable or antisocial behaviour is because of an undiagnosed neurodiversity. You see it on here all the time. Which feeds into the stereotype that ND people act unreasonably. It’s ableist and harmful.

@gogohmm but how does saying "your neighbour maybe acting that way because of XYZ" help the OP.

It's a bit different if it's a relation of the OP, or genuine concern. But if it's a "neighbour won't say hello to me" sort of thread, autism or any other diagnosis shouldn't come into it. The could have ND, the may not have be ND, they maybe NT and not like the OP or just be a rude person. The armchair diagnosis on this sort of post just encourages stereotypes which are unhelpful.

@OneFrenchEgg

But the reason for <insert annoying behaviour> could be autism, dementia, bipolar or a plethora or other medical reasons- by highlighting this to a moaning poster, it could make them realise their anti social neighbour is doing things deliberately.

This isn't being disrespectful to those with these conditions, if anything it's highlighting how hard it can be to fit into our round pegged world when you are a square peg.

Yes I'm personally affected, dd is autistic (how she describes herself) dsd has adhd and exh is probably autistic but undiagnosed.

MN is a tiny snap shot into someone's world. It's also one side of a story. No one should be sitting in their armchair and diagnosing in the way that is commonly seen on here.

"My friend ha ghosted me!" Within a few comments "maybe they have autism!" Well maybe they do. Maybe they don't. It's not really relevant to the OP at all and not appropriate.

Hardly any of my friends in RL know I'm DN because frankly it's none of their business.

#cloak, not clock

Agreed, as I said on another thread, there is as very 'TRA No Debate' feel about questioning the diagnosis of disabilities, or questioning some disabilities in general. This site is so over-restricted, that it's not really a safe space for anyone to have a fair and open discussion about disabilities. I have to second and third guess everything I write on here (hard enough when I have ASD), because the censorship is so constrictive. It really is a No Debate situation. Mumsnet really needs to stop people reporting legitimate questions surrounding disabilities under the false clock of disablism, and ban those who repeatedly trouble-make like that.

I agree with this. Sadly in imposing restrictions may mean that people are inhibited to suggest something that may actually be happening. Something that's very prevalent with the GC and TRA debate at the moment. By limiting free speech silences people out of fear they could be accused of prejudice or discrimination.

Couldn't have said this better myself.

I was referring to a wide variety of conditions there as you know, including dementia.

Is it your position that the behaviour of people with those conditions is never upsetting, anti-social and difficult?

Or is it your position that their behaviour can be, but we must never say so?

I'm just asking you to stop reinforcing how awful the behaviour of ND people is for you

I have talked about the challenges of being in a relationship with someone with autism, where it wasn't diagnosed and how things may have been better if we had both known about the diagnosis and could have developed strategies to keep the relationship healthy.

In my world that is a constructive thing to say.

And if you start a thread about what people should not be allowed to say, then yes, they are probably going to start talking about those things.

No where did burgundyblues say the behaviour of ND people is awful. You are creating a false narrative by twisting what they said. They've never said anything remotely like that.

So now you're trying to dictate who can reply to you and how many times as well. And people still wonder why those like myself and burgundyblues are very concerned about the suffocating censorship on this site regarding disabilities. It doesn't stop at censoring how people talk about disabilities, clearly. It extends to who replies and how many times. If you don't want people replying to you and engaging you in a debate, then maybe a message forum where people communicate isn't for you.

I am clearly not telling you that you are a crap person to be around. If you actually read what I have actually written, repeatedly, I am saying that if there is more understanding of how behaviours manifest it becomes EASIER for people to get along. If someone had suggested to my H he had autism earlier in his life, and he got a diagnosis, and I knew he had autism and how that affected things from the start of our relationship, maybe things would not have got as bad as they did. But you need open discussion to be able to name these things to find ways to navigate them. And you can't do that with more censorship.

So can you please stop now?

I’m with you OP. Any other negative stereotypes are challenged but neurodiversity is a free for all. If my skin were any thicker it’d be concrete but reading some of these responses on threads make me so mad

Because in those support threads you still get people, following the thinking underlying your agenda here, saying ' Oh no, its not because of the autism your partner is like that, and you are all haters and we need to shut down this thread'. So yes, what you are saying is part of that movement.

And yes, people do need to be free to suggest behaviours may be caused by an actual condition of some sort, because conditions can manifest in behaviours that are difficult and upsetting for others. They may actually be right.

MORE understanding is needed of how behaviours can manifest, not less because ' shh, we mustn't talk of it or we'll be called names and haters.' MORE understanding, leads to early understanding, leads to be able to get along better.

All you can do is challenge and report op.

Good luck.

#stillbruisedfrommyattemptttoraisetheissue