Request to remove the word 'debate' from ' Feminism: Sex & gender debate'

Good point, Errol, I hadn't considered the intersection of the word 'discussion' with the transwidow support thread. Was just thinking of it being a better word than debate.

Those rules were actually originally titled 'guidelines for the discussion of trans rights', as if women discussing what womanhood is (in law and in life) don't have their own stake in that discussion. Following an OP pointing this out and several pages of others agreeing with the concern that this grossly misrepresented the position of feminists [i.e we are not non-trans people discussing 'trans rights', we are women discussion women's rights and they agreed to change it to 'discussions of sex and gender'.

Apologies, I had forgotten that unfortunate original framing.

The FWR rules are titled, "Mumsnet moderation principles for discussions around gender identity and sex"

Agree. If you must hide it away in its own section, Feminism: Sex & Gender is a more appropriate title.

Not a feminism board poster (you'll usually find me on Baby Sleep or Parenting boards. I agree. The topic is Feminism: Sex & Gender. There's no need for "Debate".

I agree too, we don't have the word debate on any other board title, it's limiting and unnecessary.

'Debate' and the trans widows thread being there, implies there's debate about their situation.

Which is gaslighty.

And is attracting harassment and "debate" around them.

I agree

I agree.
Surely sex and gender issues can be discussed, debated, chatted about, highlighted, focussed upon, supported and so forth.
The word debate is a value-laden term.

Agree.

I'm not correcting that post for the sake of it, btw, I just think that the fact that the default lens that MNHQ viewed the discussion under was 'trans rights', is relevant to how the discussion is framed as a 'debate' in the new section.

I agree and would ask that "debate" is removed asap.

As pp have pointed out, theses threads are useful for practical support and advice, not as a space to debate.

I agree, 'debate' sets the wrong tone entirely.

Rowantrees
The FWR chat special rules were originally titled "sex and gender" and MNHQ agreed to change them to more accurately reflect the issues which are the balancing of sex and gender identity (not gender).

Those rules were actually originally titled 'guidelines for the discussion of trans rights', as if women discussing what womanhood is (in law and in life) don't have their own stake in that discussion. Following an OP pointing this out and several pages of others agreeing with the concern that this grossly misrepresented the position of feminists [i.e we are not non-trans people discussing 'trans rights', we are women discussion women's rights and they agreed to change it to 'discussions of sex and gender'.

Agree that it shouldn't be debate, and should be 'gender identity' not 'gender'.

Agree with both points.

Agree that it shouldn't be debate, and should be 'gender identity' not 'gender'.

A feminist thread about 'gender and sex' would suggest a debate about whether issues faced are about our sex or about gender. It's not what the board is about at all, it's about TRA.

Agree

I agree

I agree. Discussion would be better if they need a word there

Agree. It's like having a board called "FWR debate", like there's another side to be considered - should women have rights? Do they have too many rights?" should women have the vote? Should women own property? It seems women's rights are going backwards.

I agree with this.

I agree. The word "debate" is superfluous. Nearly all mumsnet threads involve discussion and debate.

I'm surprised that it is not, "sex and gender identity".
The FWR chat special rules were originally titled "sex and gender" and MNHQ agreed to change them to more accurately reflect the issues which are the balancing of sex and gender identity (not gender).

This is made clear in the recent Maya Forstater ETA ruling where it is established that both a belief and lack of belief in gender identity is protected.

I like this suggestion. “Feminism: Sex and Gender” covers all the different kinds of threads Errol has pointed out.

“Debate” runs the risk of excluding women who are interested in the topic but too intimidated to leap into a board that seems to promise conflict.

Even apart from the trans widows, the threads (new and inherited from the previous board) aren't all 'debate'.

There are support threads and ones seeking advice. Items from the news or journals, other types of information - some of these may generate debate, others won't.
'Debate' alone in the title is misleading, and liable to cause problems.

Agree