“Racism” towards the Irish on here

That is absolutely one of the best pieces of mansplaining oops did I just assume MichaelMumsnet's gender

I agree with inappropriate rather than offensive.

The impression given is that Mumsnet HQ has taken a collective eye roll at our complaints, shook their head and sighed and said, ‘ the Irish, complaining again!’

Is it worth adding that we have invited them to remove BTP from the guidelines, because ‘etymological types’ no longer consider it offensive.

Will you post on “site stuff” or craicnet?

My God, what a ridiculous response from Michael. Deliberately focussing on one small part of the problem in order to deflect from the bigger picture.

Why the stubbornness MNHQ? Is it so hard to admit you got this wrong, apologise sincerely and assure us that you're taking action? All you're doing with these pathetic responses is digging yourselves deeper into the hole.

Stop defending the indefensible.

Also I don't personally find the phrase "hugely offensive". I do think it is wildly inappropriate in guidelines about what's offensive and not though. I just don't want the language in any statement we make to be over the top and then take away from the validity of the complaint.

However, unlike Mumsnet, I am open to being schooled on what ppl find offensive or not. I do also appreciate you actually making the effort to write something suitable. X

I wouldn’t put beyond the Pale first istandwithposie only because the issue is so much bigger.

Agreed. I think we need to frame the wider issue and then use the beyond the pale issue as an example in action.

Oh I forgot to add the relevant part of the equality act!

Ok, I have put this together. I will email it to HQ and I will also start a thread for anyone who agrees to sign their username to it. I will also post it on as many threads as I can and anyone else who wishes to do so should too. This is first draft so if anyone has anything to add or change go ahead. In it is a link to this thread and a link to the talk guidelines.

“Mumsnet HQ have asserted their intention to knowingly continue to use racially offensive language in their talk guidelines. The phrase “beyond the pale” dates back to the 14th century, when the part of Ireland that was under English rule was delineated by a boundary made of such stakes or fences, and known as the English Pale. To travel outside of that boundary, beyond the pale, was to leave behind all the rules and institutions of English society, which the English modestly considered synonymous with civilization itself. The phrase is rooted in the oppression of the Irish people by the English ruling classes and is hugely offensive to Irish people. In refusing to remove this phrase from their talk guidelines Mumsnet HQ are deliberately and knowingly operating in breach of The Equality Act 2010 which states that. We are asking Mumsnet HQ to apologise for the offense caused by their use of this deeply offensive phrase and to remove it from their talk guidelines.

Furthermore, in the anticipation of increased anti Irish sentiment in the U.K. as a result of Brexit negotiations and implementation we are asking that all staff at Mumsnet HQ undergo training to create an understanding of the complexities of the Anglo-Irish relationship with the aim that all staff will recognise both subtle and blatant anti Irish posts and threads as soon as they are made aware of them. We ask that talk guidelines are applied consistently across the forum for all protected characteristics and that racist posts towards or about Irish people are removed immediately.”

If @mnhq doesn’t acknowledge my complaints for anti Irish racism, does this mean they won’t show on the spreadsheet (I assume) they have for racist reports and outcomes?

Yep. This is exactly what I expected, it is always their response to Irish people pointing out how entirely fucking offensive the prevailing attitude on this site is. Nothing gets done, we will be dismissed time and again.

Why is it, lads, that we continue to use this site and, in doing so, allow them to generate advertising revenue from our registration whilst slapping us down every time we raise these issues? Because it is EVERY time.

I'm scoffing at this thread still not making it into the trending section of the homepage.

Exactly @Giantbanger

I'm astounded by the mods response to this ! I'd never noticed 'beyond the pale' in the talk guidelines but even after it's been pointed out, their just going to leave it there 🙄

**listened to

Wouldn't want to give credence to the thick Irish stereotype.

Me too

#misefreisin

Can't you see how people become radicalised? When you're not being listened too and your complaints are ignored, it makes you want to SCREAM.

I’ve reported it too.

MN response just demonstrates exactly what we've been saying. If an Irish person tells you something offends them then it offends them and you don't get to tell them they shouldn't be offended!

I have also reported Michael's post for being deliberately inflammatory to Irish posters.

I’ve also just reported his post as deliberately inflammatory

I feel @Giantbanger has pointed out something uncomfortable and true here. She's been very polite and open to discussion with Mumsnet to illuminate them on why decisions they've made can be offensive and cause upset. I would have expected Mumsnet to engage in a discussion to understand why so many of us agree and then evaluate whether the mods need more guidance on this in order to make better decisions.

Just take the feedback!!!