MNHQ here: have you got strong feelings and personal experience about partners staying overnight on postnatal wards?

If the broadsheet writer wants to do a good piece on this, they should start by thinking very carefully about how they frame the piece and how the headline leads it.

Frankly I'm sick to death of articles on maternity which put women in the position of being ungrateful and demanding from the word go and then write the piece to justify the opposite - but the point has already been made loud and clear in the headline.

And frankly I don't trust even good 'reputable broadsheets' on this as they ALL have a poor record on this score.

Happy to discuss why in private and bore to tears on the whys on this, but not inclined to have my name put to anything despite my very strong feelings on the subject.

That in itself should be something that this journalist should think about hard.

I had a private room and DH was allowed to stay. This was because it was important to my mental health and this was arranged with the hospital.

This was the reason I decided to travel 45 mins to a hospital that was not my local hospital.

My local hospital would not have been able to accommodate my mental health issues - they simply have so few private rooms that you couldn't make arrangements of this nature.

This isn't about whether partners should be able to stay or not. Its more a question of how hospitals are failing to provide appropriate mental health support to women in a maternity setting. Inadequate staffing in its own right is a contributor to this.

In my case, and due to the nature of my issues my partner was the only person able to provide this support.

I think this is all about asking the wrong questions about why women want partners to stay and ends up blaming women for somehow not sucking up the system and the justification used is lack of money.

The problem with that argument is - for a variety of reasons - its ultimately a false economy that ends up costing us more both socially and economically.

If you go to Europe, private rooms are far more standard - as is the ability for partners to stay. Our mindset in this country towards this, is incredibly backward thinking with no ambition and a politically driven downward set of expectations of what women should and should not be almost 'allowed' to have as part of their maternity care.

In this country most women do not even have the option of the choice of going private, even if they can afford private maternity care, because there are not private maternity facilities across the country.

We are at the mercy of a culture that has no political will to recognise the issues within maternity care, much less improve them. Often this culture is led by women who support this bollocks about there being no money.

It would be enormously helpful if voices like MN actually focused on the right things and asked the right questions rather than following these political arcs that don't get to the heart of why women want partners in the first place: there are really good reasons why they do and these are the issues that should be addressed not framing it purely as a single issue without a background of complex problems that is driving the whole thing.

Thank you Lexie :) Unfortunately I live in the South East!

I very much wanted my husband to stay, that was one of the worst parts of being on the shared ward for 5 days. BUT if the midwives hadve been able to correctly support us (ie. There were enough of them and they were nice) then I don't think it would have been as much of a problem.

Posted too soon... I don't think that men should be allowed to stay on the wards. I would have hated to have random men walking around when I was pumping and bleeding.

I had my second baby in a public hospital in Australia. I had my own room (no wards) but dads were not allowed to stay. DH couldn't anyway as we had another DC at home. I looked forward to them leaving at night so I could sleep. The wonderful midwives helped me with everything so I didn't need DH to be there.

Not rom experience, but I have read people say that men on the wards sleeping in chairs and snoring have kept them awake more than all the babies on the wards.

New mums need as much sleep to recover as possible x

What can I say.

I knew there was a possibility I would need my partner there and ensured that I was in a hospital which allowed partners to stay overnight.

I have family members who wear a Hijab, They likewise carried out their own research and ensured their chosen hospital didn't allow partners to stay overnight as it meant they would not only need to ensure it was in place during visiting hours but 24/7. One was able to pay for a private room and done so. (This was for religious purposes and is clearly not the only reason for not wanting men on the wards 24/7)

Had there been a rule which stated the only way a partner could stay overnight would be if it was a private room then I would have paid for one.
I understand there are some ladies who for a multitude of reasons will not have a partner who can assist them.
As said my partner was there to assist his family. That is all.

If there are partners who attend the ward, stay overnight and subsequently cause trouble/harm or cause a lady to feel uncomfortable it is wholly unacceptable and should be dealt with accordingly. I am fortunate to not have been witness to or on the receiving end of this. Reading some of these posts; I can see that some ladies have been in very uncomfortable situations/ intimidating even. This is wholly unacceptable!

I needed assistance and my husband was the only one to provide it to me. My husband provided me with this assistance as there was no staff member to do this.

Should I have refused his help? I don't know any person who has been in a vulnerable position who would refuse the help of a loved one.

I wish there was enough staff to fulfil the needs of the ladies admitted to the wards; but unfortunately there isn't. This is something which clearly needs to be addressed sooner rather than later, but in the mean time there are ladies who genuinely need assistance and it is their loved ones who provide this.

I have always and will always follow the rules. If I need to pay for a private room to have my husband present then I will do so. I am not by any means wealthy; but I do research when necessary and would put money away each month to ensure that I can cover this. (I'm aware there will be some ladies who may not be in a position to do so).

Until there is a system in place which provides enough staff members who can and will provide ladies with the assistance they need, I will continue to attend (when necessary) a hospital which allows my husband to stay overnight.

@CherriesInTheSnow I live in Wirral (NW England) and my hospital is Arrowe Park x

My DH has never been allowed to stay and
I'm ok with that. The kick out time was around 10pm and he could come back from around 9am. I managed fine each time, even when I'd been put straight into the ward on my own after giving birth late at night. Most women are ok on their own with proper midwife support if needed.

More People could potentially mean more stress on midwives and less support for women whose partners have to stay home with older kids.

A post natal ward is noisy and crammed enough without extra people and I have felt very vulnerable after each birth. I wouldn't have coped with having partners on the ward as well over night. Some partners I encountered in my 3 times on postnatal were incredibly loud, rude and sometimes intimidating. I wouldn't have coped with that overnight.

I am aware that I am lucky however and would like to see better plans in place for women who have had very traumatic Births and really need the extra support overnight. I feel they should be put into a private room where a partner could stay or kept longer in the labour ward where a partner could stay.

Could I ask something - what are the other facilities in your hospital like, for non-maternity patients? Also massive wards with stretched nurses, or are they better? I remember a friend of mine was having a minor abdominal surgery not too long after giving birth by CS. Said it was like night and day - with surgery nurses were running around, making her comfortable, bringing her everything so she didn't have to move etc. With CS she was told to man up and take care of her child.

I'm wondering if this is an isolated incident, or more of a pattern where women giving birth are not treated as well as other patients?

It's a hard one - I've had two sections under general anaesthetic so was pretty useless afterwards and needed a lot of help to lift baby etc. I was in a ward with 4 beds so it was noisy with or without partners - mums and babies arrived from delivery suite at all hours, midwives were in doing obs and giving medications, and one particularly needy bloody annoying mum kept shouting for pain relief at regular intervals (and also shouted down her phone to the entire contents of her contact list for 20 out of 24 hours of the day.

In some ways I feel that partners couldn't make it much worse in terms of disturbance, plus I think that they might be more inclined to advocate for peace and quiet. Equally, when I was crying whilst enduring my fourth failed attempt at re-catheterisation I really didn't want more people than women who had recently experienced similar indignities listening.

The need for privacy meant that I kept my curtains closed and the desire for peace meant that I went home earlier than I should've...and I can't help but think that had I stayed and been hiding away behind curtains the outcome might have been worse when I couldn't breathe on day 3 (severe chest infection post - anaesthetic plus very anaemic) - 999 call from home (DH was with ) with paramedics arriving in 7 min compared to midwives who often took 30 min to respond. That's not a criticism of them, btw - they are heroes just shamefully under resourced.

On both occasions; had my husband not been with me, I don't know what I would have done.

I have every sympathy for women putting up with terrible levels of care on PN wards and don't blame you for wanting somebody there to assist when the professionals aren't doing it. But partners staying 24/7 won't fix that problem. What about women who don't have partners or whose partners can't be there? They get equally shit care, except now they also have to put up with sharing an already hot, noisy and crowded ward with a bunch of blokes they don't know as well. We can't fix it for some women at the expense of others.

Partners are there solely to assist, not to make others feel uncomfortable.

Your partner. Sadly, not everybody's partner is a lovely man.

Yes Private and Ward!

I believe partners should be allowed to stay overnight.
I have had 2 emergency C-sections and will be having a planned C-section in 7 days time.
My 2nd C-section included a blood transfusion 2 days after the birth.

On both occasions; had my husband not been with me, I don't know what I would have done. The MW were lovely but clearly very busy. I needed assistance getting to the toilet. I could not bend in the slightest to change my clothing. Showering on the first day was extremely painful and to do it alone was in my circumstances quite dangerous a flannel wash (which is what was suggested) was not adequate.

My husband helped me to shower (I did not expect a MW to assist me with this).
When I needed to lean over to pick up baby for feeding; I would have been waiting a very long time like some other mothers on the ward for someone to assist me with safely picking up baby and positioning myself on the bed. My husband assisted me with this.

Without my husband being there, I honestly don't know what I would have done. My husband; like me stayed within my cubicle.

To be honest it would have been quite uncomfortable for him as he slept in the chair as I was unable to sleep on my side in order to share the single bed with him.
He didn't complain, because he is there for his family.
Partners are there solely to assist, not to make others feel uncomfortable.
I would not give birth in a hospital which didn't allow partners to stay overnight.

I strongly feel that partners do not need to stay at night.
Only in exceptional cases like bereavement or if the mother has disabilities and the midwives cannot assist in the way she needs.

I think partners should be able to visit in the day for long periods. If it is night time they should go home to sleep (except on labour ward!). This is enough for women who are very vulnerable and recovering.

This was me on one of the best but scariest night of my life, with my epidural wearing off but still cant stand, recent haemorrhage so midwives have to keep checking my pad to measure blood loss, catheterised, exhausted, relieved baby ok, I move to postnatal ward at 1am.
I have to call to get help to get baby to feed it. It is dimly lit, I feel emotional and need help getting baby latched on, I need reassurance as to what has happened (from a midwife not my husband) when baby does a thick clear spew, and there is a healthy man lying in the space between me and the next bed sleeping/dosing / mooching around?

Even if he is the nicest man in the world, I don't want him to be there.

What we need is more postnatal midwives/ care assistants / breastfeeding supporters at night. Not more male relatives.

Sorry meant to say she was a hijab wearer.

To add another perspective - my friend's daughter happened to be in the same ward as me when I gave birth. We got chatting, she had had a stressful birth (epidural gone the wrong way, she had a constant headache, couldn't lie down etc.) She mentioned that it was an additional stress having to keep putting on her headscarf because men kept coming in and out of the ward. Not a massive issue in the scheme of things, but worth mentioning to add to the concerns about privacy.

Ah cherries I see we have cleared up the open curtain thing. Cool.

I would hate to think that everyone had a idea of me flashing my boobs in a provocative manner and then complaining about it. Having a catheter, stitches and sweating like a racehorse did not make me feel alluring.

In any case, the man was a fault, the fucker. (can you tell I'm still angry?)

oh dear... Cherries you do seem to have taken my post to heart. It was not in response to you. It was in response to Poppet, hence the use of the word 'poppet'. I wouldn't use that word on another poster unless they used it themselves as it could be seen as condescending.

But anyway, to address your comment:
'You expose your breasts in full view of a hospital ward and at the same time complain about someone seeing your breasts?'

The midwives refused to let me close the curtains, I had a catheter and was attached to monitors, so I couldn't have closed them even in if I wanted to, unless I used the Force.

So, I had two choices:

1. try to feed my new born baby (remember, first time mother, no clue as to do it) and put up with pervy guy staring at my nipples, even though I was trying to cover them
2. not feed my baby

Anyone go with number 2?

Support on the ward was minimal, the chap was there after hours as he was aggressive and the midwives wouldn't chuck him out. Imagine in there had been more than one man like that in the ward, because it was officially sanctioned.

And as for everyone who says "my fiancé would not make anyone uncomfortable etc etc. ' I bet there is no one on here who would say: "I really want my DP to be in the ward. He is a bit of a pervert, but I'm sure he'll be fine."

I apologise, but to misquote Margaret Atwood (kudos to LittleKiwi for the Aunt Lydia reference btw)
"Better (for women with supportive partners) does not mean better for everyone."

By this I mean, I would have loved my DH to have been there, he would have made things 1,000 times better. It would have meant so much to us as a family. And yes, in a private room, I think it's a no brainer.

However, I am willing to pay the price of my husband not being there to protect other women. To protect them from harm, from harassment , from not wanting male strangers in a room with them as they try to recover from a physically, emotional, and mentally draining experience.

My wants should not be met at the expense of those far more vulnerable than me.

Overnight stays only in private rooms. When I had my son partners could only stay if they were the patients carer and in that situation were given a private room (as elsewhere in the hospital). Visiting hours were 10 - 8 for partner or other named person only with a hour in pm and evening for other visitors.
I know the maternity unit is soon changing to single rooms and when that happens, partners will be allowed to stay.

Men DO get to share these precious moments of life, they just don't get to spend the small hours snoring away.

Honestly, it's just a romantic notion of this perfect bubble and entitlement to it. He's just seen you shit yourself and your vagina stretch to push a human out. It's not pretty, it's not dignified and it most certainly isn't romantic.

He might not even want to be there! I certainly didn't and I was the one giving birth.

No one is saying men aren't welcome or is excluding them from the process but, for the love of God, let women have a few hours peace without your husband or anyone else's.

2 out of 3 of mine were born in the middle of the night, we stayed on delivery suite for ages, dh cuddling dc and having precious moments, he came down with me and got me settled etc and then finally went home about 5 am, I had had an epidural with dc1, and I don't think he left until I had walked to the loo for myself.
Our wards had partners and kids visiting from about 8 am to 8pm, and I foudn that hard too, just no privacy anywhere, and then from 2-4 the whole world descended on everyone.

I think it's unnecessary and I don't like it...

I'll soon have my 4th (c section - 3 nights minimum in hospital) and I love the time in hospital with my newborn. Dh can come during visiting hours! He can help once I get home!!

But also why should the father have to miss out on the first precious hours of their child's life?

Most hospitals will keep women in the labour ward or recovery suite for the first hours, where partners can stay.

Once you're on a shared postnatal ward, though - the men aren't patients. The women who've just given birth are. The hospital needs to put the patients first, because it's a hospital and that's its job.

"We will have to agree to disagree BertrandRussell"

I will never agree that men should take precedence over women-particularly when it comes to matters of pregnancy and birth. I find it deeply depressing that so many women think they should,