MNHQ here: have you got strong feelings and personal experience about partners staying overnight on postnatal wards?

according to a nurse I spoke to there is a real problem with men insisting on having their sexual needs met on the ward

I sent my husband home the first night on the ward after my emcs. I had just been discharged from HDU. I had sepsis and was very unwell. Hadn't slept in 3 days. I received no pain relief. No antibiotics. Couldn't reach DD. Managed to drag myself up to stand and had a significant bleed. Despite calling and no staff member came near me. The husband of the patient in the next bay brought me DD, brought me some water and was very kind to me.

The following morning I got no breakfast, no antibiotics, no water and nobody cleaned my blood from the floor until DH came in.

I didn't let him leave the following night.

On these threads there are always comments about women being too precious to manage without their husbands. I'm not precious at all, I've spent 2 decades working in hospitals and know exactly what it's like. I think the care should be provided by the hospital. But if the midwives can't or won't provide care to unwell patients as nurses would on any other ward what are patients to do?

If a woman can't cope without her partner for a night or two , then they should be allowed to stay in a separate room but wards should be for recovering mums only. The last thing you want to worry about at night when you're bleeding, walking like John Wayne and trying to establish feeding is another woman's partner staring at you - because they do stare! It's human nature.

• not all hospitals have this set up in France, but a lot do

1. Father's should be allowed to stay with their partner and new baby.

1. There shouldn't be postnatal wards.

Where my friend gave birth in France there were individual rooms for every mother. These were literally double the width of the bed (so it could be wheeled in and out) with a chair, small table and the baby's cot. Between the corridor and bed there was a toilet and shower. It wasn't fancy, and the walls were thin, but there was privacy and dads could have those precious first days (yes, days) with their newborn too.

Where I gave birth they had the same "rooms" and then some bigger ones with sofa beds so the father could lie down to sleep. We paid extra and got one of those.

Dads have a RIGHT to be with their babies just as much as mothers who gave birth do. But, women who've given birth also have a right to privacy.

The question asked for this article is wrong. It's not whether fathers should be on the ward or not. It's why postnatal wards still exist in the first place when they impact the rights of the mother to privacy, the rights of the father to bond with his baby AND the rights of the baby to have both parents with him/her.

I'm a domestic abuse specialist who used to have an office in a hospital.

I've seen women who have been raped on a postnatal ward.
Beaten on a postnatal ward.

I've seen women who have had other woman's husbands/partners threaten them for making noises whilst they were in labour and threaten them because their baby was crying. Be ridiculed and humiliated by other women's husbands/partners because of breast feeding.

I've seen women pushed out of their own beds because the delicate husband/partner wants to sleep, have their food taken because he wants to eat.

I've heard women beg staff to enforce the rules about partner visiting hours because they wanted their own partner gone so they could at least try and get some rest in peace.

For a lot of women giving birth can be a trigger for leaving an abusive relationship if help is obtained on the ward the longer partners stay on it the less chance you have to make it safe for a disclosure and request for help to be made.

You may be ok with your husband/partner and you may think their behaviour is fine but not everybody else will and they shouldn't have to deal with it.

I wouldn't stay in a hospital that allowed it in a shared ward

@reikizen 's post sums up my feelings perfectly.

Absolutely no way should men be allowed on postnatal wards.

Oh yeah, totally appropriate to have strange men around when you're bleeding, lactating and struggling to walk around following delivery

I hid behind my curtains and prayed the visitors would hurry up and leave. I'm autistic and a sexual assault survivor so I felt very exposed and vulnerable, even behind curtains.

I gave birth at midnight following a traumatic 4 day induction ending in emcs. I was an exhausted and scared first time mum that could barely move. Yet my partner was told to leave just over an hour after the birth of my son. It was an awful experience - mainly due to midwives shouting if I dared press the buzzer for help.
What was more confusing was my partner was encouraged to stay the four days previous in a ward with vulnerable women in labour but was unable to stay to help care for his son. Private rooms should be given as standard to postnatal women.

I have really mixed experiences. I was on the ward from 20 weeks very frequently as I was so sick. The ward allowed partners and it was terrible for me. Women were being induced around me sometimes I was on a ward with newborns at times. People fought, watched tv at full volume and talked loudly and generally made it really hard for me to rest. Any rules that existed were ignored. Men weren't meant to use the women's bathrooms but did. The midwifes were to busy to police things or didn't have many options if people were not cooperative. What are they going to do get security to remove a woman's husband because he's noisy, while she's in pain as she's being induced? I think this is a problem on all wards but the amount of visitors and the need to build trust with women makes it worse on maternity wards. Some men made me feel unsafe and uncomfortable. I also think if you have strange men there all women will then want someone with them so they feel safe.

I was so sick after I had my baby however I could not possibly have cared for my baby and there were not enough staff to care for me or my baby. I was in for several days and it wasn't ideal for my husband with no shower and an uncomfortable chair but I really feel there was no other option. There simply was not the staff. Buzzers rang and were unanswered. I was expected to take my baby to neonatal for antibiotics when I could hardly get out of bed. Women frequently got help from the other women and visitors rather than staff if they were on there own. The reality is you really need private ensuite rooms. This would facilitate everyone's dignity and improve everyone's sleep. Let's be honest a curtain is not enough. Maternity is a very different situation than most wards. I know in some hospitals you can pay for this where I was it was not a possibility. Many women leave hospital before they should (I did as the situation is so unacceptable to them).

I was very lucky. I had bad stitches and faint episodes and was scared at being alone overnight when my baby cried but the midwives in the hospital were fantastic. They did come, even if it took a while and they helped.

Of course I'd love dh to have been there but no, I don't think it's fair to have them. I think separate wards should be used and the men not allowed to sleep, or private rooms.

Dh told me he was glad to go home. If he hadn't slept he could never have safely driven us home.

I don't think that the need some women have for their partners to be there should just be dismissed as due to inadequate staffing. It may be an issue for some, but for me at least I would have wanted my partner over 3 private nurses waiting on me and and foot. In those few days I needed my partner with me round the clock. That need was as tangible as another woman's need for privacy. There has to be a way that both needs can be met.

FWIW I would have been happy to pay for a private room but partners weren't allowed to stay on those either. But I don't think that partners being able to stay should be exclusive to those who can afford to pay.

My hospital had a policy of kicking the fathers out at night, and I really wish he'd been able to stay. I'd been in labour for days, was so dehydrated I was on a drip, and had had a C-section so I was unsteady on my feet anyway. I barely saw any HCPs overnight, there didn't seem to be much in the way of checks, and it took ages for anyone to answer the buzzer, if anyone did at all. On one occasion the buzzer was replaced on the wall behind me where I couldn't reach it. How I managed to keep myself and a newborn alive during that first night I have no idea, but I do remember thinking that it was extremely unsafe to basically be left to fend for myself in the way that I was. I doubt I would have cared much about trying to breastfeed or go to the loo through the night with men there - I didn't care that much through the day when I was trying to do those things.

The problem was partly down to staffing problems I'm sure, but there also seemed to be this idea that the mother isn't really a patient and should just get on with it, because after all you'd have to once you got home. Not being able to walk steadily, or being exhausted and in shock, wasn't deemed an acceptable excuse. In an ideal world perhaps everyone would be properly looked after by staff and there'd be no need for partners on postnatal wards. But back in the real world, where post-natal care is so ridiculously poor (and unsafe), having your DH there can make a massive difference.

Agree totally with assasinatedbeauty. I would have discharged myself rather than stay in a ward with strange men at a time when I was bleeding, barely able to move and establishing breastfeeding. It's a disgusting intrusion on women's spaces and a total subjugation of the needs of patients to those of the fit and well.

I had a horrendous birth with my beautiful baby girl she ended up being born through forceps. I ended up with 2nd degree tear etc etc (the usual!!) my DH stayed with me in a private room. He fed our baby (I didn't produce any milk) he changed her and did everything to start with til I could move! He slept in a chair at the side of my bed and I don't know what would have happened if he hadn't stayed. I think the partner should be allowed to stay in private rooms.

There were never enough staff on the ward to meet everyone's needs, so help from midwives was often hurried and took a long time to arrive.

that's where the problem is: inadequate staffing.
that and inadequate facilities.

I was lucky in that I was on a 2 bed room. The other lady's husband and parents and friends were there all the time. I'm so glad we got some peace at night when they had to go home. I could have really done with more privacy to try and establish breastfeeding. I wanted to try sitting up in bed but there was no curtain so had to sit up and sit off to one side to give my back to them and try to get DD to feed. I know I shouldn't have cared and just got on with it but I did care. Also my baby was taken away to intensive care after 2 days so after the strain of being on the other ward in another part of the hospital that took ages to walk to, I could have done without the constant party at the next bed.

Thank goodness there were no partners overnight. Must say the nurses and facilities were really good though.

I'm going to go against the majority and say I think they should be allowed to stay. I gave birth at 8pm and my husband was asked by staff to leave at midnight and was informed he couldn't return until midday. From when he left until when he returned the only person I saw was the lady who brought breakfast round. The staff were so busy with complicated cases that I was left alone for 12 hours. I had no idea what I was doing, I was exhausted, and anemic from blood loss. I needed my husband there because the staffing on the ward was inadequate. I had trouble bonding with my baby and ended up with PND, and I think those initial hours were a factor in this. I appreciate that some women would have coped, but I was not one and I'm angry that the person I needed most was not allowed to stay. My second labour was at a birth centre and he remained with me throughout and it was much better experience.

I'm in favour of it. I had a section with messed up anasthesia and needed oxygen etc I was barely functioning, catheterised and had no underwear on, just had a pad shoved between my legs. At one point my DH had gone to get food and DC was crying, midwife snapped at me that he needed changing and when I said I couldn't get up, she was really aggressive.
In an ideal world all women would have enough staff to suppprt them. As that's not going to happen they should be allowed their partners to stay. Agree that if partners are loud or otherwise obtrusive though they should be chucked out.

@AddToBasket, isn't it just simply that the second parent (usually male and the father) isn't a patient? Hospital wards are for patients, in this case mothers and babies. The needs and wants of visitors should come second to patient care. Any man who is put off parenting by going home for a couple of nights after the birth is very easily put off imo.

Absolutely not on a shared ward, it's completely unacceptable and I would rather discharge myself in an unfit state than stay overnight in the same space as up to 16 male strangers whilst in a vulnerable and incapacitated state. I find it incredible that this situation is actually allowed to happen in some hospitals.

In en-suite private rooms, no problem.

Thankfully the hospital where I had DS2 reversed their decision to allow partners to stay on the large postnatal ward. This was due to the feedback from women during the trial period which was overwhelmingly negative. The most frequent comment was that it made women feel more vulnerable and exposed, and was a significant issue for many women. The decision was reversed half way through my pregnancy and I was so relieved as I'd been psyching myself up to discharge myself if necessary.

I needed DH there. I absolutely had to have him with me after both c-sections.

FWIW, I think the Mummy as Primary Parent, Daddy Not So Good issues start in hospital. In the run up to the first birth most couples are emotionally 'in it together'. After the birth, if the father starts getting walled off by healthcare professionals from his own child, is it any wonder he might view parenthood as requiring less from him. Cue a million feminist threads...

'Men don't need washing facilities on site as they can leave at any point and go home to wash/eat.'

Yeah, they all live near the hospital, have easy transport access to it, no other duties to take care of. Talk to any midwife or maternity HCP and they can literally spin your head with what they've seen in the units they work in.

I would have given anything for my (female, if it makes any difference) partner to be able to stay with me. I was kept on delivery for more than 24 hours after the birth because I was still being nursed as a critical patient (eclampsia) and she was allowed to stay then, but when I was loved to the ward the following evening g and she had to leave it felt like a part of me was being ripped away. It felt so completely unnatural, and I think that that was one of the triggers of my subsequent PND. I think it needs to be an option for partners to stay.

After a horrendous four day induction I dreaded my partner leaving me in pain every night to deal with it myself. I was terrified of what was being done to me and what was happening. It was so unnatural and I was so scared. I couldn't have given a toss if there was a million other men there, I just wanted my partner.
After my little boy was born, on Christmas day, I was completely and utterly exhausted after 5 nights of no sleep on a ward of equally scared and in pain women. I would have given so much to have ANYONE stay with me. My partner, sister, mother. I wouldn't have cared. And I wouldn't have cared if other women had that support either. No one should be that scared alone. And I work in an NHS hospital.