Please can we have a Trans topic?

I think, in general, it would be good for there to be a supportive somewhere on MN for trans issues to be discussed without becoming an endless stream of black and white repetitions of the same old anti-trans rhetoric.

Ideally it would be good if the whole of MN was open and able to talk about these things, but I really don't see that ever happening. I don't know whether it's the majority of MN posters, or just the most verbose/most impassioned, who so vehemently disagree with all things trans. Either way, I avoid as many of the trans threads as possible because they just leave me feeling so sad and angry.

Maybe what is needed is a distinction between threads debating it on a theoretical level/using examples of high profile cases/personal opinions, and the infinitely more complicated cases where a MNer is posting with a real life issue where they/their child/their partner/whoever is struggling with trans issues and they want advice rather than a massive bunfight over whether transwomen are women, because in their situation that's the last thing they want to be facing. But that's something we as a community should be able to self-censor rather than looking for a new area within the forum.

Please DON'T let's have a trans topic.

As someone pointed out in another thread, trans' stories are mainstream now. The media doesn't seem to feel a need to siphon them off into a niche somewhere - the 'first female soldier' , a 'trans' child and Caitlyn Jenner's womanly thoughts are all deserving of laying before us as 'News' so I don't see why the issues should be shoved off in a sub-forum just because some people don't like to see any opinions on the whole trans thing except wholehearted approval.

Maybe we should have a separate topic for people who enjoy whining about what and where other people choose to post? I'm getting bored with this sort of thread.

That's what 'site stuff' is for, isn't it?

Maybe we should have a separate topic for people who enjoy whining about what and where other people choose to post? I'm getting bored with this sort of thread.

All of those are of much more general interest, and don't attract the level of vitriol against a very small and vulnerable area of society.*

How can the problem simultaneously be that these issues don't interest most people and that too many people are posting about them?

is it that people are trying to shut debates down or are they just bored - which is the impression I got with the EU Ref?

The main reason I don't want a separate topic is that I had no idea what was going on till so many threads were running. If you'd asked me two years ago, I'd have said a trans person was someone who had medical treatment to change sex. Now I know that's not what it "means" any more and it's only thanks to MN that I know.

I think it's horrifying that other women are trying to shut these debates down. It's bloody shameful behaviour. By all means disagree, but attempting to shut them down is just spineless cowardice

people start threads on disability, health and politics all over the place. Quite right too.

As for the suggestion that the subject is too important: is it really more important than feminism, disability, health, politics and the EU?

The trans issues affects ALL of these areas. The way it's going, a man can say he's a woman and claim a job that's intended for a woman, demand to be permitted to stay on a female ward, be the 'voice' for females in politics, etc. To say the trans issue is no more important than feminism? Ha! If it wasn't for strong feminists fighting for females this would never be talked about. Women will not roll over like good puppies and play dead, while men claim female spaces.

People weren't actively trying to shut down debate on Brexit.

Threads about trans issues and women's rights are not about vitriol. Frustration maybe, but not vitriol. They may look one sided, but it's difficult for them to represent a range of views when one 'side' seems unable to present their point of view in a clear and logical way.

Pragmatically, many people feel that open debate is not being allowed to discuss issues that harm women.
People are not going to post in a topic if they feel that it has been created to shut down debate, and MN will find it very difficult to keep moving threads against poster's wishes.

Brexit primarily affects the population of the UK. The current TA agenda impacts on women in many different countries. That's a very parochial POV.

After all, Brexit affects a hell of a lot more people

How on earth did you work that out? I'd rather have a separate topic for people trying to silence women.

SpecialSnowflake

Surely it would be transphobic to insist that any posts in trans topics are segregated?

And no. Not until we have a topic for MILs, parking, weddings, back to school....

All of those are of much more general interest, and don't attract the level of vitriol against a very small and vulnerable area of society. Yes, I know MiLs attract vitriol, but they don't fit the other parameters.

As for the suggestion that the subject is too important: is it really more important than feminism, disability, health, politics and the EU? Don't we have an equal need to raise awareness of disability and SEN?

Yes, pleeeeeaaase. We've had around ten threads this week alone. When we had that number after Brexit MN opened up a separate topic. Surely it's no different? After all, Brexit affects a hell of a lot more people.

you can hide individual threads though

in fairness, many topics go across a range of boards

I think it's really important to raise awareness of this as well

btw I actually got told off by a poster for using the term "brexit" because they considered it such a nonsense. This was a while ago obviously!! - but it's a good example of how something can be quite close to affecting people and they don't know.

I dont think there should be a seperate trans topic

Would agree with others that most threads are concerned with the erosion of womens rights

No. Most of the threads are about the erosion of women's and children's rights.

The 'safe space' mentality is so wrong - places where you never hear challenging opinions are extremely dangerous. (and also a particularly nasty case of the appropriation of a term vital to womens rights - physical 'safe spaces' for people who have suffered or may suffer actual harm - women's refuges etc)

HQ already said no. They said they only consider new topics when those actually involved in the talking decide they want one - not to segregate a topic of conversation away from the rest of the boards.

Sorry :)

There is an astonishing level of misogyny on Mumsnet.

Yeah, I hate offensive threads where people who are wrong just call other people cunts!

Disagree, this issue has huge implications for women and shouldn't be hidden away.