Not sure where to ask about this awful terrible baby advice you have published?

Is a y this from the experience of grandparents who liked to 'wind' the baby for me after breastfeeds. Lots of patting and rubbing and then looking thoroughly pleased with themselves and saying "he/she needed that". I knew that when they weren't there we didn't do it and there was no difference

Did the great militant baby dictator write this? I did do routine but nothing even close to this level of insanity.

I 'winded' my breastfed baby at first because it was what you were supposed to do. One time when I didn't he just fell asleep so never bothered with it subsequently. I think winding is largely a cultural thing - if you rub a baby's back you might get a burp, but doesn't mean they can't doo it themselves if need be.

All my DC were bottle fed, went straight on to a routine feed and all slept through from about 3 weeks old, it does work for some - surely no ones stupid enough to think it's a one peg fits all holes?

If your baby is a few weeks old you may need to leave him to have a shout for a bit longer. Sometimes he might take twenty minutes or so to settle. If you know that he is well fed and tired it is better to leave him to settle on his own.

Does the woman not realise that sometimes babies cry for other reasons than needing food? If I'd left my DC to cry for 20 minutes when they were a few weeks old, they would have worked themselves up into hysteria by the end of it.

And you can amend it to say it's not for the early weeks/not for breastfed babies/highlight the SIDS advice but it is clear from that telegraph article that the author thinks it is for the early weeks and doesn't really care about the SIDS guidelines

No one is objecting to routines on this thread at all or saying that this doesn't work. People are cross about new mums being given advice which is against SIDS advice and which could really cause problems with breatfeeding as well as make anyone who has a baby which doesn't fit with this way of doing things feel like a failure.
Really disappointing mumsnet

Fucking hell! That telegraph article is so irresponsible! There is a huge amount of evidence based research going in to the SIDS guidelines. People are free to ignore that if they want to and I totally get that people might want to weigh up the risks and do what feels best to them BUT I think it's completely different to get paid to advise other women to ignore this advice and in such a prescriptive 'this is the only way you will sleep' way.

It's bollocks.
Shame on mn
Totally agree with everyone mrsdv said!

And it's not just the feeding advice, either! This, for example:

"Babies need to be swaddled and tucked down in their cot or pram to have their daytime naps, as well as at night. This will help them to self-settle, which is so important for them to learn from a young age. Babies who are rocked, nursed or carried around every time they need to sleep will very quickly get into this habit."

I had a baby who would not nap unless held. Would. Not. Screamed and screamed and screamed and screamed. And yet I kept on trying to make her nap in her cot - partly because of advice like this (and the bloody Baby Whisperer!) which I'd read. Advice like this doesn't say "all babies are different", it says "your baby NEEDS to be doing this, and if they're not it's because you've got them into the wrong habit." And that is pretty shit advice, when you're already exhausted, feel like you're failing, and can't work out why your baby isn't doing what it's 'supposed' to be doing.

Mumsnet (the site and the forums) were a great resource for me back then. They were really good at helpful, balanced advice that said all babies are different, get by the best you can, there are lots of things to try and there is no One Right Way. Which is why it's so disappointing to see MN now putting out advice like this.

Well, the advice is perhaps a little out of step with current methods but it's hardly 'dangerous.' Some of you just like to get all hysterical

I can confirm - as the parent of an 18 year old and a 9 year old - that whether you wake them for a feed/swaddle them/ leave them without milk for three hours/ whatever .. it's all the same in the long run. I'd personally find something more worthwhile to get in a flap about. Advice changes all the time, just do what feels right for you

This article very much goes against current NHS advice against swaddling and demand feeding for bf and ff babies.

"If your baby is a few weeks old you may need to leave him to have a shout for a bit longer. Sometimes he might take twenty minutes or so to settle. If you know that he is well fed and tired it is better to leave him to settle on his own."

This kind of thing makes me go cold.

Wtf mumsnet??

Also, a baby cannot self settle to sleep, it's either CIO or you help them

Well that's not necessarily true. My baby self-settled to sleep when she was very little (under 4 months) and didn't cry to settle. She just lay on her blanket (nap time - blanket on the floor where I could see her) and fiddled with a muslin cloth until she fell asleep, no tears at all and no help from me.

"Here a suggestion for one way of doing this" is one thing.

"Here is the way you should do this, and if you don't do this your baby won't sleep" is a very different thing.

Plenty of newborns, especially breastfed ones, need to be fed more often than 3-4 hourly. This doesn't mean they are "snacking" and won't sleep until you space out their feedings, which is what the article says.

Sorry didn't see you added the word breast fed. I can't comment as I couldn't breast feed. The article does not state breast feed every 3 hours it states feed and does say about all babies being different.

For some.... Not for others. Some people myself included have done this. Us on advice from the hospital.

"Put your breastfed newborn on a 3/4-hourly feeding schedule if you want it to sleep at night " is bad advice, yes.

There have been a lot of comments stating its bad and cruel advice.

Saying the article is written badly, it is too prescriptive but the advice is not bad.

FWIW I do not see water in that bottle....it is almost empty with milk at the bottom but the photos are just grabbed from some photo library and nothing to do with Waddilove. There is also a note saying

NB: All babies are different and you shouldn't implement a strict feeding routine before your baby is ready. NHS guidelines on breastfeeding and bottle feeding are well worth a read.

so not sure why everyone is quite so agitated. Waddilove and Ford do not actually advocate waking babies fully at night, just enough to feed and with lights low etc so there is a differentiation between night and day. I think article is a bit simplified.
For those saying breast fed babies don't need winding. I breast fed my 3 for 12 months and they all needed winding after every feed.