Jack Monroe thread deletion

Well, I have just been over there and it all seemed quite civil. Kudos to JM though as that takes guts. Wish it was in the feminism topic rather than in the news though.

The TayTo ones arent cruel, we arent saying anything more than whats in the papers. And being ridiculous.
We ❤️ them and Lulu

There are, incidentally, a number of threads on the Feminism boards that are far closer to 'hate speech' than the content of that particular discussion about trans issues (eg 'I'm starting to hate all men'). Double standards?

These strike me as weasel words;

we find it more sustainable to operate under broad principles of mutual respect and courtesy, rather than specifying what users can and can’t say on any given topic

Ultimately, we think one of the real strengths of MN is that it allows users to have robust disagreements about difficult topics, but without hate speech, and without comments that are just plain mean

Rather like the attempts by some MPs to silence dissent, 'offence' and 'hate speech' are used as catch-all terms to silence disagreement.

Genuine abuse is abhorrent, but 'being mean' is a fact of life and often a facet of 'robust disagreements'.

Also respect Jack for posting!

Am going to read the AMA thread now but having read the OP kudos and I hope the critics have the grace and courage of their convictions to indeed respect whilst debating with JM.
Sadly I do not think Taylor or Tim will ever do an AMA on here but I live in hope. Tim, How many pairs of grey suede shoes do you own and what is your favourite biscuit will not exactly be cutting edge but you never know.

MNHQ - as others have asked, could you clarify why this thread was deleted and others, which are "mean" about more famous individuals, are allowed to stand? Surely you should have a consistent policy.

Otherwise it is pretty clear that the deletion measure is actually a smokescreen and what you really wanted to do was shut down the discussion about trans issues.

Agreed King - I was starting to think I'd imagined her post!

Respect to Jack for personally stopping by to comment, barely noticed by subsequent posters weirdly.

in which not whereby.

FFS, are we really going to have a debate along the lines of "We've got away with being foul about X, so we should be allowed to be foul about Y" - notwithstanding that Y has known mental health issues?

Discussions around here on trans issues inevitably become aggressive. When that merges with personal attacks, it's definitely time for the thread to go.

I did not see the JM thread so do not know how vitriolic or personal it got.
I would say, however, that we LOVE Taytay and Tim on our Sleb twaddle threads. We might be taking the piss out of his shoes but we have had four threads whereby none of us have had a cross word. Call me out for being a hypocrite if you like but there is a huge difference between questioning JMs parenting and questioning THs capsule wardrobe. Love and bunny hugs xx

The phrase Subhuman fucktoilet was not used against JM personally. It was used to describe all women

By a woman, describing in (admittedly exaggerated terms) how society views women

Jack is here answering questions

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/in_the_news/2693127-Im-Jack-Monroe-Ask-me-anything

Not that I class JM as a celebrity.

What the hell? I've seen far worse aimed at other "celebs" and they don't get deleted! 😮

I will clarify. The phrase Subhuman fucktoilet was not used against JM personally. It was used to describe all women.

Who is Jack Munroe anyway?

Just to clarify - I think both, the thread on black loves matter and yesterday's thread on JM should have been deleted. I am starting to agree with other posters on other threads about MNHQs the double standards of letting racist and disabilist threads stand to 'educate'. The time when such things were possible have long since gone as the site has grown.

Aren't there much more important things in life that whatsher/hisnames view on what she/he should be called? Does she/he know what is happening in the world? (and hell, what do I call her/him?)

Well, as I said, I do see it is a bit of judgment call, lore. And I wasn't on the thread, so I'm just commenting on my perception of MN's explanation.

I dislike the KM threads too. Never seen one I didn't think was deletion-worthy, really.

As to misogyny - no, this really is an issue. Monroe has had a lot of comments about appearance, parenting, etc., which I never see made of men. This doesn't mean there's no issue of internalised misogyny, because I think there is. But, equally, I would say Theresa May can display an awful lot of internalised misogyny - and yet, I would still expect MN to be a place that recognises the context for that internalised misogyny, and condemns it. You don't have to agree with someone 100%, to understand that they're facing a lot of shit. IMO.

I think reporting for "aggressive use of cis" is entirely justified. Plenty of us consider it to be an offensive & misogynist term.

I am not surprised, there is a very vocal trans hating group on here, its for the best! Poor JM, I cant even imagine what was being written

something else that worries me - if there is now an issue about creating such narrow stereotypes, at some point "woman" is going to exclude me not just because I don't wear dresses or make up but because I have not, and will never, have children.

Women have fought for years for so many things and I feel like it's all about to vanish rapidly.