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MN - too lenient on hate speech at present

106 replies

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 08:15

Yesterday Amnesty International launched an urgent research campaign into the rise in hate speech Yesterday the UN High Comissioner urged Britain to urgently stop hate crimes

People need to call it out when they see hate speech on mn. There has been plenty recently. It can take courage when so many supporters then pile on though, but you don't need to get into an argument. A simple statement rejecting what they say, without quoting them, is enough. Just simply not saying anything then waiting several hours for mn to delete it adds power to their voice. People always need to report things to mn.

I am concerned that mn are not dealing with things quickly enough at the moment. They must be swamped with reports. I think that an option to report for hate speech should be an explicit available reason and those reports should be red flagged as urgent. The more hate speech that is seen, the more that it tacitly gives others the go ahead to say the same.

I've seen examples of a post being deleted, but the poster not being banned - despite them having said something that is so irrefutably xenophobic, that nobody could interpret it otherwise - and this concerns me. All that teaches them to do is to learn to moderate their language, so that they can get their messages across more subtly. This allows an insiduous tolerance of hate speech to creep across the boards.

It is important to allow freedom of discussion. It is wrong to allow xenophobia, racism and hate to proliferate. It's a difficult one to reconcile, but the balance needs to shift.

MN you could also help by cooperating with amnesty international in recording and reporting incidents to them.

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OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 22:06

well said samcro and I'm sorry that you have been battling this sort of shit for so long.

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Samcro · 29/06/2016 21:41

I was abit hmm about this, purely because people have been fighting to get disablism stamped out on her for so long. And its still not sorted,
Thats me being honest.
But my eyes have just been opened.
A thread is started, and they hide behind a complaint about things being too pc.
They then use not only rasicm but disablism as a example
So can I bump this and say please mn hq stamp out the hatred,
Add a button along with the the spam one
Give us the option to report hate
Be it racist or disablist.
Give it priority and make this a safe place for parents.

TheDrsDocMartens · 29/06/2016 20:38

I have reported racist posts this week. Very blatant racism that could not be taken as a (bad taste) joke.

I agree with hate crime posts being prioritised.

Queenbean · 29/06/2016 18:36

I personally haven't noticed hate speech more so recently, although I have deliberately been sticking to lighter threads. MNHQ seem to be quite on the ball about deleting things.

What I have seen is certain posters being vocal about issues and pushing their own agenda on to fairly ordinary threads. Any criticism of this is met with "now you're being xxxxist".

ThenLaterWhenItGotDark · 29/06/2016 13:18

I agree with Tara.

Open any thread to do with the referendum and there will be hate speech on it.

People are hiding behind keyboard anonymity and they are hiding precisely behind the fact that "AI probably have better things to do" Hmm

Can you manage to see where expressing one's own opinion in a freedom of speech kinda way and hate speech might become a teensy weensy bit intertwined WellErr?

MaddyHatter · 29/06/2016 12:13

There absolutely should be an option for posts to be be flagged specifically for Hate speech, like the spam button.

At least then MNHQ can possibly prioritise those over the usual 'bun fight' post reports!

WellErr I don't understand why you're so adamant on getting OYBBK to repeat examples of something that has since been deleted for breaking the TG.

Is it so hard to take it at face value that she is talking about some abominable instances of direct Racism/Xenophobia?

TaraCarter · 29/06/2016 11:42

If you haven't seen racism on MN, you're either:
A) new,
B) spending too much time in RL instead of on MN, Wink
C) posting it.

I agree that there needs to be an option to flag posts as hate speech. There is an option to flag as spam, so it should be workable to add another itty-bitty box.

Let's really not go down the "freedom of speech" cul-de-sac. We don't have complete freedom of speech or expression in public life, and we certainly don't on a privately-owned website.

Samcro · 29/06/2016 09:57

there should be an extra button, for things like disablism and hate speech.
they should then be prioritised.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 09:09

well done Beyond :)

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BeyondTellingEveryoneRealFacts · 29/06/2016 09:02

I reported a few racist posts over the weekend, every one was deleted eventually so obviously mnhq agreed that they were hate speech...

BeyondTellingEveryoneRealFacts · 29/06/2016 09:01

I've already suggested a third (law breaking, hate speech etc) option on reporting that has a higher priority on the disabilism thread :)

EdithWeston · 29/06/2016 08:51

There have been two long threads already this month, about disablism and about ageist, plus the one about SN.

So MNHQ must have a good idea of what members think (or rather that section of the membership which posted on them).

WellErrr · 29/06/2016 08:48

I think that if you've noticed enough of this to start this thread you should be at least able to back it up with ONE example.

I hate censorship, when it caters to the most easily offended person.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 08:46

WellErr, precisely why I won't be drawn, else we will all be endlessly debating what constitutes hate speech. I think using mn guidelines
"We're all for freedom of speech. That said, we'll remove posts we consider to contain personal attacks, to break the law and/or to be obscene, racist, sexist, disablist, ageist, homophobic or transphobic, once they are brought to our attention. We will also delete any posts that we think are just seriously unpleasant (please note that any subsequent posts repeating the words in the deleted post may be deleted, too)." provides a sensible framework, as it's all one we have agreed to by posting here.

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Kummerspeck · 29/06/2016 08:43

Maybe I've just been lucky but I have not seen any outright racist posts. I've seen one or two that the poster felt was freedom of expression but others thought were xenophobic which were quite rightly "discussed robustly" as MN towers would say and I think that is the right way to deal with it. It educates and informs that poster and others (I include myself in this as I live in a very white middle class area so, while I know how kind and nice people would respond to something, I do not always have the awareness, experience or knowledge that others have) and think deleting and reporting to AI is absolutely the wrong way to go

I have, however, seen some really nasty posts about older people, Northerners, people without degrees and a general intolerance of people with different opinions, some of which I feel should have been deleted. I don't want MN to get into this idea of free speech as long as you are saying what we agree with but think we all need to think where the lines of what is acceptable lie

user1465823522 · 29/06/2016 08:43

I think you are running the risk of hysteria over this.

WellErrr · 29/06/2016 08:43

But your view of hate speech may differ to mine. Is it 'gays are fucking disgusting and should be shot' or 'I don't think young people/old people should be allowed to vote?'

(None of the above are my views, obviously)

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 08:41

I'm not going to get drawn down that line Grin if you haven't seen them, you've been reading happier threads than me!

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WellErrr · 29/06/2016 08:38

I don't generally see hate speech on mumsnet so even paraphrased examples?

WellErrr · 29/06/2016 08:38

Examples?

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 08:36

user, not for them to look into - they are conducting urgent research into the rise of hate speech and are collating data. The internet is precisely where vile ideas grow and take hold.

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OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 08:35

over the last few days I have seen outright, indisputable hate speech. I won't link and they were eventually zapped, but it took several hours.

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user1465823522 · 29/06/2016 08:35

I'm not suggesting reporting every single post to AI, but to collate reports and cooperate in the same way that AI are asking local councils to do so, could be helpful. (though I've not actually asked AI - I think mn approach them)

don't you think that AI have better things to do with their time that look into anonymous postings on a website?

Booksandcrocheting · 29/06/2016 08:34

I think a separate reporting category for hate crime would be a excellent idea, for all the hate crime categories.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/06/2016 08:33

I'm not suggesting reporting every single post to AI, but to collate reports and cooperate in the same way that AI are asking local councils to do so, could be helpful. (though I've not actually asked AI - I think mn approach them)

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