Can we have a proper 'woo' topic?

It's almost never an actual debate because facts, reality, and theory support non-woo and the other side has nothing to support their convictions.

Take the latest angel feather thread that prompted Indigo to start this thread asking MNHQ for a woo topic: Some people see white feathers and think they might be put there by their angels. Others say "But those are bird feathers, that fell off birds. Why would you think it's from an angel?". This doesn't turn into an actual debate because the other side can't present anything real to defend their convictions.

Would you rather people be prevented from pointing out that bird feathers come from birds?

gamerchick "People can chat amongst themselves about invisible gods that don't exist unmolested so why can't we talk about what we believe in?"

They can't though. Have you ever read one? Even a thread that is quite clearly meant to be a serious discussion of something with like-minded individuals will always get posts from people referencing 'Invisible friends' and 'Spaghetti monsters' and telling us that we are all obviously in need of an emotional crutch if we choose to believe in any form of deity.

I do like the idea of 'the Unexplained' having an area to itself. But that won't mean that people won't make a bee-line for it to tell you exactly what they think of your belief in x, y, or z.

Because it's never an actual debate, it's a pile on. The 'non woo-ers' tend to get a little over excited and frankly take it rather personally when others have different beliefs to them.
A debate is good, sharing opinions is good but I've seen it turn bloody nasty on some threads because some posters can't resist getting personal.
A dedicated topic while not banning debate and discussion would allow people to just talk without having sincerely held beliefs and experiences ridiculed.

The thing I really don't get though is that the woo-ers (seem to) want a place free from dissent and debate. That does not exist on MN - not on FWR, not in Religion, not in AIBU.

Why should woo be treated differently? What is wrong with having the woo discussions where they are, and ignoring or engaging with the dissenters?

*it's

I don't really need to add anything more to this thread. Not a making my point for me all by itself.

I'm not a psychologist and haven't followed research since graduating. I'm aware of the mindfulness research because I practice Buddhist meditation but of course I don't put that in the woo category ;) Certainly nothing like that would have been covered on my cognitive science focussed degree course.

Neuroscience is a vast topic and most of it is extremely dry. I don't think a little bit of research into parapsychology esque topics makes neuroscience connected to woo any more than psychology is. Sounds like you just want to shoe horn in the word "science".

"People can chat amongst themselves about invisible gods that don't exist unmolested"

Have you ever been on a religion thread? They get lots of "molestation". (Strange choice of word to describe dissent and debate).

Picking up on some things a couple of posters have mentioned, there is no such thing as a proposition such as 'angels exist' (or whatever) being true for some people but not for others. A claim is either true or not true and I don't understand why people are shying away from public discussion if they really care about whether their beliefs are true.
If it is being proposed that 'woo' has a separate thread - in which the kind of discussion which occurs in the philosophy section is discouraged, belief in woo is accepted without questioning and 'woo believers' are generally protected from the objections of those who don't ascribe to the same irrational beliefs- then I question the integrity of some people's epistemic enquiry.
I understand that some people aren't so bothered by whether their beliefs and experiences are objectively true and may want somewhere to discuss the subjective, spiritual side without others dismissing their experiences entirely but please don't disguise it as truth or knowledge as it is neither.
Critical discussion and an environment where debate is encouraged is in my eyes is much more valuable to all parties than a complete separation of woo from criticism.
By all means have a separate woo topic but also have a separate religion topic and separate topics for different philosophical approaches and everyone can just believe more or less what they already believe and not feel threatened by people who don't see things the same way.

There's also research going on in the areas of out of body experiences, near death experiences and whether psychic phenomena are related to altered brain states like depression. I did a psychology degree too.

Would the topic be science focused? If not, I'd avoid the word "neuroscience".

If you did a psychology degree, Tabby, you must be aware of recent volte-faces on transcendental meditation, mindfulness and optimism.

A representative sample from googling "current research topics in neuroscience":

interstitial cells of cajal and the autonomic nervous system

enabling technologies for very large-scale synaptic electronics

mechanisms of neuronal migration during corticogenesis

I'm guessing that's not what you have in mind?

I didn't know neuroscience had been adopted as a term by the woo - when I did my psychology degree it was all about visual perception and consciousness - hardly appealing to the paranormally inclined I would have thought.

gamerchick, you can talk, but why should people not debate what you say?

Are religion and woo out of bounds for rational examination?

Why the urge to get neuroscience into the name?

I think it's hugely misleading and would end up pulling in the kind of posters you're aiming to avoid me who will be disappointed at the lack of science content.

Oh no your free reign comment was perfect.. its exactly the attitude that illustrates the tiresum part of these threads.

People can chat amongst themselves about invisible gods that don't exist unmolested so why can't we talk about what we believe in?

But why does it affect you personally (again not aimed at anybody specifically) if another person has a different belief or experience to you? It can get hugely personal on woo threads, usually with a side order of 'point and laugh' when sometimes people just want to talk. It's why although I do openly state that I'm Pagan on some threads I would never share actual experiences on here, my life and beliefs are not a target for Atheists and the like to laugh at.
A dedicated topic might be good for some of us.

"Current research areas for neuroscience"?

I agree, gamerchick, this thread proves the need for a discrete topic perfectly.

Personally, I'm very highly educated, Cote.

Good name suggestion, Bruno.

'Body/Mind/neuroscience' would be a totally inappropriate description of any thread I've read on 'woo' though. That would surely come under the P/R/S topic?

A more apposite description of the woo threads everyone enjoys so much would be 'The Unexplained'. Suitably non specific, but sums up the kernel of the discussion - describing, discussing, hypothesising on that we can't explain.

I suppose my shorthand "spout crap" was a little lazy and unfair.

What I actually mean, and I'm sure you were able to understand that, is that you can't expect to stop people debating the validity of your statements just because you've got your own topic.

"who has the right to say what and what isn't crap? "

People.

Those who have a bare minimum understanding of physics, chemistry, biology (i.e. the real world), to be specific.

Reality isn't subjective.

THIS ^

Us who believe want to be able to talk about it without having to constantly fend off people who don't. I don't understand why that is so hard to see? it's not hard.

Where is the sneering, gamerchick?

If you correct a mathematical calculation, is that because you hate the person who has made the mistake? With real venom, no less.

Or could it be that you just want to correct it because it is wrong?

I'm glad those who are regulars on the woo threads are here ramping up the sneering it's totally proving the point of why we want a dedicated topic.