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getting together information and support for EVERYONE in the child protection system

287 replies

Spero · 21/01/2014 16:50

I am posting here, mainly because I am not sure what I am doing and I don't want to do anything against the rules or contrary to the site ethos.

In a nutshell, a lot of us have been contributing to various threads since before Christmas about the child protection system in the UK and all the controversy that has arisen since the case of Alessandra Pacchieri and the issue of 'forced adoption'.

We have perspectives from every part of the child protection system - there are birth parents, adoptive parents, social workers, lawyers etc and we think it could be a good idea to try to do something to bring us all together, to help people get access to information that is balanced and useful, particularly if they are facing care proceedings or worried they might be.

At the moment, we are thinking a blog could help, with different people providing short posts about their experiences and providing links to other sources that we know are credible and reliable. This could be very valuable for all of us - I am a lawyer for e.g. but I would love to know more about what doctors working in child protection are looking out for, and I would like to get more perspectives from birth parents about what they think is good or bad about the system.

We are also wondering if there could be a separate topic in 'Parenting' - Dealing with child Protection issues or similar, which could link to the blog, once we get if off the ground.

So sorry quite a lot of info there. Trying to précis

  1. We have a lot of untapped knowledge and experience and would like to pull it altogether to provide a good source of reliable and balanced advice
  2. We would like to start a blog, does anyone want to contribute or can think of snappy name?
  3. We would like to use the power of mumsnet to steer people towards our information and provide another platform for discussion and debate
4.What's the best way of going about this?

Any comments, thoughts welcomed.

OP posts:
Spero · 22/01/2014 20:29

weregoingtothezoo, thanks for posting. Would you be ok with us linking to your blog if we get something up and running?

Yours could be a very valuable and helpful perspective. As you say, just letting someone know she is not alone can be helpful.

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weregoingtothezoo · 22/01/2014 19:33

I'm a birth parent, and now recovering alcoholic. I have a fair bit of experience of being the other side of this. My story is somewhat atypical, in that I was holding down a full time professional job, and DD's preschool had no concerns, when she was removed.
She was eventually adopted due to 'risk of emotional harm'.
I am still grieving but would love to help someone else feel less alone as they go through the child protection process, just having someone walk along side me without judgement would have meant so much. I also feel that if someone educated and fairly well balanced completely misunderstood the system and was misled throughout, what chance do people less fortunate than me stand.

I already blog about my recovery from alcoholism and from losing my DD here

Spero · 22/01/2014 12:56

She has also told me to go and look at this
wordpress.org

So its a good thing my 3 day trial finished early...

OP posts:
Spero · 22/01/2014 12:49

familyencyclopaedia.com

My blogger friend just sent me this link as kind of site we might want - I think it looks very professional - and a great resource! I wasn't even aware of it.

Ours would be more practical based, with views from as many different people as we can get, but this looks the type of thing which could be helpful.

What do you think?

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Spero · 22/01/2014 10:11

thanks Garp. I think your contributions are and will be very valuable.

I think we can at least all agree on one thing - that we want the best outcome for the child in every case.

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NoseWiperExtraordinaire · 22/01/2014 10:00

Well said Garp Thanks

inlovewithgarp · 22/01/2014 09:03

HollyHB - and quite frankly any of the Conspiracy Theorists - speaking as a birth parent who has been through this and on behalf of parents faced with this, please stop. Please.

These "theories", the statements being bandied around as fact yet without evidence, the advice that is being given to flee, to run, not to work openly and honestly, not to seek help when it's needed, to be coached to say the "right" thing, never to trust a system or it's workers - it's not helpful to us, it frightens us even more. We hear these statements and believe them - because we are threatened with losing the most precious thing to us. And in a lot of cases we believe them because it's easier than confronting our own failings as parents.

Yes, there are mistakes and miscarriages of justice. Nobody denies that. And it's abhorrent and I for one feel sick for those children and parents.

But they are in the minority. It just feels like they aren't because the public is much more likely to hear about them via the media.

As I said upthread, ss took my baby at birth. I believed that to be the wrong thing for MY CHILD. So I contested their plan of "forced adoption" and - lo and behold - justice was done and - very very recently - I won. I was steadfast, I did not give up.

But - more importantly - I confronted the reasons why this was happening to my family. And I worked and worked and worked to repair the damage I had done. I educated myself on the law, I searched desperately for advice - even posting here - I eventually put together bits and pieces of advice, put my case together and fought. In my search I came across the Theorists. They absolutely terrified me. I took their advice on board - noting that the path of staying, confronting, fighting was the much more difficult option.

I can categorically say if I had taken the Theorists advice, I would have lost my baby forever.

Having the balls to stay, to fight, to work in partnership with the very people opposing me meant my baby and I are to be together.

This resource of Speros - and the invaluable contributions being suggested - is long overdue and desperately needed for ALL of those in the CP triangle to work together for the good of the child

Sorry, know this is a long post, but it's from the heart.

Spero · 22/01/2014 08:03

If people want to share all their experiences, good and bad, that could be helpful to others.

But if people want to assert as FACT that babies are being targeted before birth for removal to meet adoption targets, I think we are entitled to ask for proof of that assertion.

OP posts:
tombakerscarf · 22/01/2014 08:00

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Spero · 22/01/2014 07:55

If you can do a simple short piece, it would be great to provide links to more technical detailed stuff so people who want to investigate further can.

I think there is loads of helpful stuff out there, it is just finding it that is the problem. I would like us to be a gateway.

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ThisIsMySpareName · 22/01/2014 07:53

No probs. I'll have a think about how I can explain it without getting too technical.

ClairesTravellingCircus · 22/01/2014 07:50

I havi no experience or knowledge I can share to contribute, but just wanted to say this is a brilliant idea!

Well done spero et al Thanks

Spero · 22/01/2014 07:49

That would be brilliant. It is the 'target' story that has gained so much traction and is causing so much fear.

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ThisIsMySpareName · 22/01/2014 07:44

I'll help if I can. I'm a performance manager for social care so can explain what we have to report nationally and hopefully try and de-bunk some of the 'adoption targets' nonsense.

Spero · 22/01/2014 07:42

MrsdeV - you have experiences from a number of perspectives, so it would be very helpful for others to be able to read about them and see how you dealt with it all.

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MrsDeVere · 22/01/2014 07:39

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Spero · 22/01/2014 07:30

I have had a PM from someone who wants to contribute and this is my reply

What I am thinking of at the moment is lots of short posts from as many different perspectives as we can get from anyone who is involved in any way in the child protection system - for e.g. , hello, my job is X. This is what I do, this is what would worry me, this is what would reassure me, this is how you the parent can help me do my job, here are some links to more information/blogs etc.

I don't want to censor anyone, there is no agenda here other than getting clear and accessible information easily available so parents are n't simply diverted to the FASSIT sites and other similar unhelpful resources.

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Spero · 22/01/2014 07:23

I really don't want this to descend into another babysnatching thread.

I have had years of this and its really tedious.

Worse than that, it doesn't actually help anyone at all.

what we want to achieve here is setting up a resource that might actually do some good for parents going through horrible stressful times, that might help to disseminate information that professionals need, about research, medical intervention etc, etc.

If there is anyone who wants to start arguing for targets for snatching babies etc, I would be grateful if you could start another thread.

Holly, you are clearly of this view so maybe another thread would meet your purposes better.

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Spero · 22/01/2014 07:21

Holly - 'fly under the radar'

this sounds very disturbing. Is this in tandem with Ian Josephs advice to 'think very carefully' before reporting even sexual abuse?

This is intended to be a resource to help parents and professionals understand and navigate all areas of the child protection system NOT to give abusive parents tips to stay out of the limelight.

OP posts:
Spero · 22/01/2014 07:19

There is a thread in relationships right now where the op is being given the following 'advice'

  • record and video everything
-move house -refuse to discuss past history with SW -go to FASSIT and 'taken' for further advice.

Which in my view is simply a recipe for ensuring that her children are removed from her care extremely quickly.

We desperately need more balance and resources for parents to access which don't promote the baby snatching conspiracy message.

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sydlexic · 22/01/2014 00:56

I think it is very difficult, many SW have made the wrong call and DC have suffered. They now have less decision making to do they just tick boxes yes or no. A certain amount of yes answers means the action escalates. They are not allowed to make a judgement.

Devora · 22/01/2014 00:33

I would agree with you that prevention is better than remedy, Holly. However, it sounds like you're suggesting we should be advising people (who may be abusing their children) how to remain undetected - you're not, are you?

HollyHB · 22/01/2014 00:21

It is often said that prevention is so much better than remedy.

Those who have come to the unwanted attention of social services can share how it happened so that others can learn how to fly under the radar so to speak. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Who to keep at arm's length, how to keep them at arm's length, what not to do, what not to say - because it will draw attention in ways that they will be regretted. Stuff like that.

edamsavestheday · 21/01/2014 22:40

It's a very positive idea and something truly useful that could come out of what are often very difficult threads. Understandably difficult, because people feel strongly about these issues, and often have very painful experiences.

A collaboration between people who have all sorts of different expertise - as professionals and as parents - could be wonderful.

Devora · 21/01/2014 22:35

I think this is a great idea, and would love to help if I have anything useful to offer.