New NHS guidelines on IVF treatment to extend age limit up to 42 - what do you think?

Fucking. Hell.

I probably need to bow out now before I get my second ever MN deletion.

The total misunderstanding and lack of basic willingness to hear people's really heartbreaking experiences is quite astonishing. I (naively) never realised that fertility issues could bring out such strong opinions.

I second those who are discussing what other lifestyle / life altering
but not medically necessary treatments should be rationed. Breast reconstruction post mastectomy? Of course. No need for it after all. Treatment for skin conditions? Well it's only a bit itchy / disfiguring / uncomfortable. The person who has been in a fight on a Saturday night after too many pints and needs stitches? A plaster would do.

Bollocks to the psychological and emotional consequences.

You're quite right johnnybear - survival of the fittest means I should not have had treatment that enable my beautiful, clever, funny little DS to be born.

I am sad to see that there is very little tolerance of alternative opinions on this thread, to the extent that unless you are an infertile woman your views aren't deemed valid.

dammit companies not countries :(

Well i'm sure that you'll agree ginand slim (since you're so well educated) that insulting someone's level of education and reading matter isn't a terribly intelligent or polite way of making a convincing argument.

No the people who increase the strain on the NHS are, in no particular order:

boy racers
other stupid drivers of which there are too many
Friday/Saturday night drunks (male and female) out clubbing
said drunks becoming violent outside clubs
drug dealers (NB dealers, not addicts)
smokers (said with a heavy heart since DH is one, although this too is an addiction)

etc
etc

Women who long for motherhood are not the root cause of the problem.

What do you think the NHS should be used for BlackSwan?

evilgiraffe hehehe it's not the easiest language but the Dutch speak English as well, if not better, than me so I'm very fortunate! Been here just over a year and I can still only just about twist my tongue around the basics and count to 10 which isn't much English tends to be used in most international countries.

I know that a lot of women do travel from the UK to Belgium to be treated, although that is privately of course. The NHS is wonderful, don't get me wrong, but the outlook here is so much more helpful to women and families (in my experience anyway). Less ageist - and I do feel that putting an age limit of 42 on IVF is far too low, particularly with the advances in medicine and care in this day and age.

I did read your earlier posts actually Sheila, and found them ill educated. Having children would improve one of my conditions actually.

All this just serves to increase the strain on the NHS. Not just for the IVF session, but also for the resulting pregnancies/births or terminations. I'm completely against it.

Our bodies don't give us a blank cheque - neither should the NHS.

Since you care so much about overpopulation, johnnybear, I'm puzzled as to why you fathered 4 children.

well said evilgiraffe

Ginandslim maybe you could read my earlier posts and then come back and discuss?

You have raised the level of debate no end there.

So let me get this right you as a father of 4 have the right to use up the world's resources with your oversized family but a couple wanting an IVF baby don't.

Oh and it isn't bending nature,the same happens in the Petri dish as that in the body.It is a very mundane procedure,less nature bending than a lot of cancer treatments I suspect.

I appreciate people have differing points of view on this, but if people could remember how deeply upsetting even thinking about this topic is to many others, it would help. As I said earlier, being infertile is like being in a permanent state of grief. Wording your comments accordingly would be both helpful and kind, even if you disagree with IVF for older women, or anyone at all.

Yes thank you Johnny.

You obviously feel strongly about this, which is fine, but perhaps you could create your own thread about it.

In the GP actually sat there with us both in his office, me complaining of two weeks of pain every month, that we'd been trying to conceive for over a year. He sat there and told me to take paracetamol for the pain.

err, Sheila, actually the causes of my infertility are diseases.

Why don't you go do some research other than the daily fail and then come back and discuss?

I'm not criticising anyone for wanting a child desperately, and I feel compassion for women in this situation, but that is a separate issue from whether IVF should be provided by the NHS.

thixotropic - yes you may have seen earlier we fell foul of that. Kids were nearly grown up and estranged due to poisonous ex (will not go there). And yet they claimed that was enough reason not to even investigate my fertility problems (which included a great deal of pain).

I wish everyone trying for a baby all the luck in the world and of course they should try everything available...and I'm sorry if anyone is offended but i still stick to my own beliefs...we didnt have this option a few years ago and for as painful as it people got on with it...what is the emotional cost to the women (and their partners) who go through it time and time again and it fails...what is the success rates?...what are the dangers?...what is the average costs?....We have spent millions of years evolving and a part of that is the survival of the fittest...ok so here we go on johnnybear bashing but its still a fact...we are trying to bend nature to our own means and I think if you just take a look past our own tiny world then maybe we could see that this is just another way of increasing the population...we are bringing more children in to a world that will not be able to cope...I know I must sound like a heartless bd but I can see the future and its not bright..its very dark in its the next couple of generations will be the ones fighting for survival....i urge you to take a look at the following link and see the numbers out there and show you how much is left....again I'm sorry for any distress I may have caused but the fact is we are bringing more people in to a dying world without thought..xx
www.worldometers.info/

I just think it's bloody outrageous that if the man has kids from a previous relationship, no matter if estranged or adults, then some trusts wont fund IVF.

I was gobsmacked when a good friend had to pay for her own IVF because her dh had grown up 2 kids with his first wife.

How the Fuck can that be the same for the woman as having her own child?

And yet if shed moved 5 miles over the border, 3 cycles on the NHS.

Bonkers.

It would be good if it was the same for everyone.

Enable them to try to have one, Sheila. It's a basic human drive, you can't just turn it off - believe me, I'd be a lot happier if I could.

Livingzuid - really interesting perspective, thank you. The Dutch are clearly way ahead of us! The thought of a two-week wait for an appointment sounds like some sort of fantasy land. Maybe we should emigrate, I have a Belgian friend who could teach me Dutch...

Errr. I think you'll find pcos,endo and depression cased by childlessness are.

Sheila I find your lack of comprehension and empathy startling.

I have paid into the NHS since I was 22. I have barely used it (before 2012 usual screening and a bout of bronchitis).

Is it the word "desperate" which troubles you? Does this indicate desire and want and therefore entitlement?