Please or to access all these features

Site stuff

Join our Innovation Panel to try new features early and help make Mumsnet better.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

McDonalds Ads - tell us how do you feel about them folks?

609 replies

JustineMumsnet · 01/03/2011 16:22

Good day MNetters,
We've been asked if we'd host ads for McDonalds, so we thought we'd ask what you think. Would you object to banner ads (ie like the one at the top of the page) on Mumsnet?
Let us know.

OP posts:
BaroqueAroundTheClock · 07/03/2011 12:59

well I don't really want boden or most of the other advertisers........

MilaMae · 07/03/2011 12:55

2 threads do not a ballot make.

Often on threads you get one or two vociferous posters and a bandwagon approach starts to happen.If a very brave poster puts her/his head above the parapet then other points filter in as people feel a tad braver and more able to contribute.

This thread is no different from any other and to base such an important decision on a thread is not right in mvho. If you were to send a round robin e-mail to every member and go with that majority it would sit better with me.I'd be very disappointed and my views of mn would change in that it was no longer the same place I thought it was and I'd be on here far less frequently(no bad thing probably) but it would be a fairer decision.

Having said that I think mn will loose a lot of it's integrity, and I think will have less of a voice if it did run with an ad.

Justine if you don't mind me saying you seem to have ignored many of the very good points about why a McD ad would be wrong. The only argument for an ad is people don't care and there are big bucks involved. It's as if said points just don't matter to you and unless the baying majority of a thread came into play you're happy to close your ears to some important issues,take the money and run. Hmmm some similarity to our current government methinks.

You say mn won't go bankrupt without the ad so why even consider it,nobody particularly wants it ,many sadly just don't care. Are their really no other decent companies willing to advertise on here that would generate similar revenue?If I was a company selling something used by mothers this site would be my first port of call,I can't believe you're not bombarded by requests.If you're not you should be.

Sorry to be so blunt but I'm very Sad and rather disappointed about the whole issue.

glasnost · 07/03/2011 12:53

And a simple but salient point. Why risk disappointing a third of your users (I suspect many more actually) by running these ad's? There are plenty of other companies out there.

Why do you feel you HAVETO acquiesce to McD's?

Youllskimmer · 07/03/2011 12:41

It doesn't show you support Macdonalds but it shows you accept Macdonalds.

glasnost · 07/03/2011 12:33

CAPITAL punishment I meant. Damn this one finger typing while bfing!

Eleison · 07/03/2011 12:32

That was unclear: I mean, the fact of not accepting all adverts entails some endorsement of the products that are allowed to advertise? I don't know. Ads don't bother me: they all seem equally nasty and manipulative but their saving grace is that they are frankly and clearly in ther own separate paid-for space, with 'liar' marked implicitly above it.

glasnost · 07/03/2011 12:31

The ratio being 2 to 1 pro McD's is a facile argument. Most are pro catital punishment. Doesn't make it right. Plus I'm sure alot of those against were dissuaded from posting by some of the bizarre aggression heaped on those who dared speak out against. And compare the calibre of the posts for and against. I know who I'd rather be aiming for as MNetters.

How sad and disappointing this all is.

Eleison · 07/03/2011 12:28

I suppose that as long as a company is selective at all about taking adverts, it does carry the implication that the products that get through the selection are 'ok'. So perhaps ethical advertising is a bit 'all or nothing at all'

What does "akin to a social enterprise" mean, for a limited company?

SexyDomesticatedDab · 07/03/2011 12:19

Even if McD have improved their buying policy I would not wish to see more fast food adverts on parents sites.

slim22 · 07/03/2011 12:02

What misty said much more eloquently than me.

basically, we just want to know what you are REALLY thinking Grin but of course you have no duty to answer

MistyB · 07/03/2011 11:57

Justine A reminder of what it says on your "About us" page:

Mumsnet is akin to a social enterprise. Though the site is a business and we hope to be a profitable one, our overarching aim is not the pursuit of profits. We manage Mumsnet with the aim of serving our community as much as serving our shareholders and we endeavour to conduct business in an ethical manner.

With this in mind, Mumsnet supports the WHO/UNICEF International Code on the Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes and we do not accept advertising from a number of companies including Nestle and McDonald's, and for a number of products, such as formula milk and cosmetic surgery, that we believe do not sit well with our philosophy - namely to make parents' lives easier."

So what has changed? Does the fact that McDonalds were responsible for the destruction of large portions of the rainforest no longer matter? Does the fact that the number of obese adults in this country has doubled in the last 30 years matter? What about the cultural insensitivities of selling food with undisclosed meat products (in fries) in countries with large populations of vegetarians or the illegal actions of selling products with banned food colouring?

Of course, you are entitled to change your stance and you are not actually a social enterprise with aims and objectives that can be challenged by it's members but in fact a profit making business. But I would like to ask the Justine and Carrie who sat round the table in 2000 if they would ever see a day when you would accept advertising revenue from McDonalds and see that they have to say?

There are many companies who's ethics could be questioned from a broad spectrum of view points and the realities of running a business have to be taken into account when making these decisions.

By all means, challenge companies in a discussion, but if you do have questions about their ethics, don't hide behind the pretence that you are not endorsing a company by allowing it to advertise on your site - the mere fact that you initally stated you would not accept advertising from this company and are now canvassing opinion implies that you would see a link between Mumsnet and McDonalds - only you can decide if you are comfortable with that.

PaperView · 07/03/2011 11:54

Justine - IIRC there were some posters who felt it suggested that you supported Tory and Labour policies.

piprabbit - it does to me but i am aware that i will be a minority. I usually am.

Eleison · 07/03/2011 11:51

sorry typos!

piprabbit · 07/03/2011 11:50

Inclusion of an advert doesn't imply endorsement or support for the product or company, it merely implies that MN is not taking definite steps to boycott the product or company.

Eleison · 07/03/2011 11:50

Ugh! That's the reality that depresses me: talk site, where women have achieved an unprecedentedly authentic voice for talking to one another, without mediation from a centrepoint with its own agendas, becomes "valuable database for pollsters/advertising research/think tanks etc" -- where that same voice can be projected, processed, and sold pack to women in an apporved form.

JustineMumsnet · 07/03/2011 11:48

@PaperView

Justine, i think that by having ads on the site (ANY advert!) then you are saying that MN supports that product and/or company.

Interesting. I don't agree though really - we carried ads for Tories and Labour during the election.

OP posts:
slim22 · 07/03/2011 11:46

Thanks for the clarification Justine!

It would be a very valid strategy and tbh, I would be very humbled indeed if MNHQ did not go down that route.

It just seems that MN is such a valuable database for pollsters/advertising research/think tanks etc... that it would be foolish not to go for it.

I couldn't care less about McD tbh, I just think it's a bit....vulgar?

PaperView · 07/03/2011 11:45

Justine, i think that by having ads on the site (ANY advert!) then you are saying that MN supports that product and/or company.

JustineMumsnet · 07/03/2011 11:38

@slim22

If your revenue depends on this sort of endorsements so be it, we don't want the site to go bankrupt, but if you are thinking upping the stakes in view of a sellout, I'd be very disappointed.

I think you have done a great job and have something very valuable in your hands now. If you think that you are reaching the tipping point and will cash out on this in the near future (my bet, and kudos! you should), we would like a hint, because it would become a very different place indeed.

Slim22 - we're not about to go bankrupt if we don't get the McD's ads. Neither are we upping the stakes for a sellout. We are as we always have basing our policy on who we don't allow to advertise on a discussion with members. As we thought it might have, views about McD's have softened. By our calculations those who don't object have outnumbered those who do by around 2 to 1 on this thread and by a higher ration than that on the AIBU thread. Hence the change in policy. Glasnost - no we had not decided to change policy before we asked the question. How could we - what if everyone had said no to McDs?

OP posts:
Eleison · 07/03/2011 11:38

That's an interesting thought slim. Would it be something like the career of the Body Shop -- with early marketing heavily based on social activism, paving the way for becoming a big enough brand to move on to more mainstream ground? Is that quite a common trajectory for businesses?

slim22 · 07/03/2011 11:30

feeling very sad, because am really convinced its looming!
But again, you have worked very hard for this, so go for it!

slim22 · 07/03/2011 11:28

If your revenue depends on this sort of endorsements so be it, we don't want the site to go bankrupt, but if you are thinking upping the stakes in view of a sellout, I'd be very disappointed.

I think you have done a great job and have something very valuable in your hands now. If you think that you are reaching the tipping point and will cash out on this in the near future (my bet, and kudos! you should), we would like a hint, because it would become a very different place indeed.

glasnost · 07/03/2011 11:21

As I suspected. MN had already made their minds up. When will the ad's be appearing?

So MN should rewrite their own policy too. When the consultation arrives on cosmetic surgery ad's appearing don't anyone out there be surprised.

McD's have cleaned up their act in the same way BP had. By employing a better ad agency who's cannier at appealing to the ethical consumer. It's all about the image.

Eleison · 07/03/2011 11:14

Thanks for making good on that background info.

JustineMumsnet · 07/03/2011 11:06

Good morning all,
Thanks to everyone for contributing to this discussion.

First of all, some have wondered why we asked. Well, our advertising policy has always been informed by discussion with MNetters - obviously your views matter as the last thing we want to do is take a decision about the site that loads of Mnetters would object to. We are very conscious that you choose to come and post here and that there's no lock on the door Smile so although clearly you can't please everyone all of the time we don't tend to take top down decisions on stuff like this. I strongly believe that without consultation, the site would be a very different (and less special) place.

Mumsnet's business model, however, is advertising. We need the ads to generate revenue to pay for our staff and servers. We don't think there's another model that works for mumsnet and so the ads are something we have to live with.

That said, we clearly won't work with everyone and we view our policy on advertisers and businesses we work with as a fluid one, determined in consultation with Mumsnetters.

In this particular case the advertising agency who works for McDonald's approached us to say they had a brief and would we be up for taking ads from McD's - they are looking to target parents with a new campaign they are doing. It doesn't mean we'll get their advertising if we say yes, just that we'll be one of the sites in the mix for consideration.

We have traditionally said no to McD's because we've had this discussion periodically and over the years quite a lot of folks have objected because they felt McD's buying policies, in particular, have been unethical (The Fast Food Nation critique). Last time we we had this discussion - maybe a 2 or 3 years ago - the reaction was around 50-50. We asked again this time because there is some suggestion that McD's are getting their act together on this issue a bit (although we don't claim to be experts). And indeed it seems that analysing the response on this thread (and the other one in AIBU) it does seem that the "don't minds" now outnumber the "do minds" by some way. So we are of a mind to change our policy on McD's

In general, we don't believe that display ads (ie the image and text ads around the place) on MN carry our endorsement. We wouldn't actively endorse a number of companies that we take display ads from - either because we'd never tried their products or didn't think they fitted over-well with the MN Brand. The only actual MN endorsements we give are as a result of our Product Reviews or following focus groups/testing. We will generally give closer consideration though to who we allow to be Discount partners, who we allow to sponsor bits of MN (and use words like sponsored by or in partnership with) and the type of language we'll use with relation to ads - we try to avoid the cheesy type of "we're so pleased to be partnering with xxxx".

We do also believe this is a site for grown-ups, not children. Much of the subject matter and language used is rather adult [understatement] Grin and it's definitely an adult, not children's audience we are catering for.

Broadly speaking my personal view is that we should get the management of companies we end up boycotting, like Nestle, on for a webchat and put them and their policies under scrutiny. I tend to believe that engagement is the way to change things and that people should have a right to reply, but I do recognise that others feel that they'd rather not give such companies a platform. Anyway, thanks very much for your thoughts on this. As said we do operate a fluid policy and nothing is set in stone; and we are always very pleased to hear your thoughts and expertise on this or indeed anything else.

OP posts: