Are daughters still expected to shoulder most care for elderly parents?

Sorry for your in-laws. My in-laws also have 2 sons. They are in their 90s and need lots of support and bil and dh provide this (esp bil tbf) with help from sil and myself.

Fil was rushed into hospital for an emergency op at the weekend and dh has been with him every day whilst bil stays with his mum and looks after her. It would be unthinkable for one of them to have a fall and no one to know.

My uncle did more than my mum for their parents.
DHs uncle also did a lot for his parents.

So its not always the case, no.

I'be extremely surprised if, on average, women didn't do vastly more elderly parental care than men, as we do more of all other kinds of care. C'est le patriarchy, and yeah, it shouldn't be like this, and we need to stay vigilant and vocal about any assumptions and unfairness related to this.

Obviously there are loads of individual counter examples. I know men who care heroically for elderly relatives, I know women who choose to completely eschew this form of labour.

And every situation is different, so I make no judgement about individuals unless I am fully informed of the context.

I provided a lot of care for my late father who had dementia - I was happy to do this although I obviously wished it hadn't been necessary - but I loved him very much so wanted to do what I could. I would have liked it if my brother had helped more, but certain things I just don't think he felt capable of. And at the end of the day, it was my choice to give what I did - nobody put a gun to my head.

Should my mom require care, I will also be willing to provide it. Again, I do have a choice.

But only you fully know your own circumstances, OP. Don't give more than you are prepared to lose.

Op its hard isnt it. I have 2 sisters we all do a day. But the more you do... sister does day thats her limit. She right you could be on road 7 days week. 80s. I find its expected too.

Hospitals absolutely expect it. When my Mum was discharged from hospital, the nurse and the OT said “It’s good that you have a daughter, she will need to do x, y, z…” My Mum (thankfully) said, no she won’t, she has children, a full time job and doesn’t live near me.

There was a thread on MN yesterday which was an eye opener.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5565452-aibu-to-ask-how-much-your-husbands-contribute-to-household-bills?page=1
Most of the posters boasted that their husband pays most of the bills. Many of the posters do not work or only do a bit part time.
It is not surprising that women have the time to look after their elderly parents ( not the in laws though)

Look some will come on here to immediately say things like ‘My DH goes to see his elderly DM five times a day’ . And some men are like that. But they are RARE.

In reality, we all know, the majority of men do not lose an ounce of sleep over their elderly in need parents, and think absolutely nothing of leaving them to it. It doesn’t even enter their heads. They are totally self centric and self focused. After many years of seeing this in my own relatives, in friends’ relatives, in strangers’ relatives, I’ve just accepted that many men are extremely selfish and uncaring. They are like a different breed to most women. Even the men who are mild mannered, outwardly kind in disposition and perfectly polite and agreeable. They just have a breath taking tendency to not give a shit about someone else’s pain or trauma or health needs. It’s quite scary if you think about it. Which is why we scrabble around focusing more on why women get roped into these roles more because it’s actually quite hard to swallow the cold hard facts. Men don’t care as much. We are just the less selfish and more loving sex. Men seem pre programmed with a sensitivity chip missing. They just don’t care. Simple as that.

Were you standing next to your brother at the time? Do you have a brother that the nurse knew about it? If not, then isn't it possible that the nurse referred to you simply because you exist and are known to her?

In my personal and professional life I can think of many sons who have taken on caring roles for elderly parents and other relatives. And that includes a young man whose mother was diagnosed with a brain tumour weeks after he graduated and as he was about to move abroad for work. He abandoned his career plans and moved back home to care for his mother. She lived for another 10 years, and for the last probably 4 or 5 years of her life he did absolutely everything for her.

If woman are disproportionately taking on caring roles when there are brothers who could share that load, then there must be a combination of factors at work. Maybe it's down to how much they care about their parents, how much they care about what other people think about them. Maybe it is because they do have more time, and if they don't have more time, then why are they managing their time in that way? Are woman more easily guilted into doing things?

I have a sister, no bothers. My BIL is easily more caring than my sister and me. He has a brother, no sisters. He not only took on the bulk of the caring role for his own parents and an elderly aunt (sharing that care with his brother) but has also of his own volition involved himself in various ways in the care of my own elderly parents.

Ah so other people's experiences are just staristically insignificant outliers @littlebasketofapples whilst your experience is reflective of The Truth.

Are those figures exclusive to elder care or do they cover other types of care too? And how are they derived? Men are more likely to provide care for parents alongside working so Im not surprised that they dont appear in the figures as carers. My dh and his brother provide a lot of support or their parents but I doubt that's captured anywhere - who would know?

I would say that a lot of people, including some women / daughters, do have greater expectations of daughters to take on caring roles. I mean, the minute you become a mother you take on a caring role. Men traditionally take on a providing and protecting role - care, but a different kind of caring. That’s not sexist, that’s recognising that men and women are not necessarily interchangeable - whether that’s down to nature or nurture 🤷‍♀️

But - and it’s an important but - the above is true at the population, not the individual level. Many women are not cut out for caring roles, while many men can be brilliant at them. But societal expectations are set at the population level, not the individual.

i had lunch with an old friend yesterday. We are both mid 50s, both have two sons and ageing parents. At one point she was bemoaning the fact that we both have boys and said -half jokingly - that she was trying to set up one of her granddaughters to look out for her in the future - because the boys will never do it! So yes, that’s a pretty common assumption.

I always thought that the caring role of my mum and dad would fall to me and my sister and my brothers would just waltz on and out but I've been proven wrong. My dad fell ill at start of year and the four of us all railed round to help, my brothers would shower my dad (dad had dementia so wouldn't of known who was doing it) but my brothers took it upon themselves, me and my ds would get his clothes out as db would just put anything on him. We all took it in turns to do dinner, ( mum was starting to struggle) dad died a few weeks later. Mum got worse but the care carried on, just me and ds showering mum. Someone would hoover, someone would do grass. Mum now in care home and 2 of us visit everyday but we all support each other ( she doesn't have long) both brothers have taken extended time off from work and have even been shopping for clothes for dm as she lost a lot of weight. Their both married but their wives have been surprised how much they have stepped up. One has even started cooking at home, which is a massive surprise. Going by the other comments this is unusual.

Agree!
I won’t be by that daughter because I would be hopeless at the type activities described here -don’t have the patience. Prefer to pay for qualified people who are not b emotionally involved. I absolutely do not ever want my DC have the lives curtailed by caring for me in that way. And would be irritated by any fuss.

When my mum had a stroke my sister called me to come from work and go to the hospital with her. My sister then went home as she has a young baby. My mum stayed in hospital and died that week. All 4 siblings including my brother were with her in the last few days but if it hadn’t been terminal they would have just popped in for visits and the majority would have been left to me. I work full time in a very demanding job but because I have always gone above and beyond and done way more than my hrs my boss told me to go and do what I needed with my mum. So it was partly circumstances but also, I think it was expected that someone female would do the majority. I would have dropped everything and done whatever she needed me to for however long she was unwell and needed it.

Funnily enough I don’t want my sons caring for me. I would rather pay for care so they can get on with their own lives. I assume I would feel the same about a daughter but I don’t have any daughters. Under no circumstances would I want a daughter in law to care for me.

No, only if you let it!

My parents chose to live closer to my DB, who hardly ever visits them never mind helping out. They were all delighted with the move.
I don’t step in when he doesn’t help,my journey would be longer and I work full time. Their choices made.

On the other hand my DP was really good at supporting his late parents.

Set your boundaries, support them with seeking appropriate help.

Surely by their 60s some men will be caring for wives/partners who have developed ill health which may partly explain why the numbers even up a little by that age.

And care doesn’t necessarily involve showering and toileting someone. It could be doing their shopping, managing their finances and taking them to appointments.

DH does as much as he can for his widowed mother who lives 4 hours from us. He calls her most days, visits once a month for a weekend when he will cook for her and take her out (she has limited mobility and can’t go out independently). Also sorts her finances. She has carers twice a day.

BIL lives a 15 minute drive away and rarely sees her or calls her, or takes her to an appointment. His wife will take her to some appointments and do anything that means someone has to be there in person e.g. will go round if called by the falls alarm people. She does all the comms with DH, BIL rarely responds. BIL and SIL work similar hours with the same flexibility.

Basically he manages to hide behind the sexist assumption that it’s for women to deal with elderly parents and either doesn’t care or is oblivious to his mother being quite lonely and housebound. I’m glad DH is better than that but it’s interesting how men are able to get away with not having any obligations to other people.

We, specifically DH has always been main carer for his parents, now just his mum, he dropped hours at work to be able to do this, I don’t know what they would have done without him, I still work full time but help where I can, both my parents died many years ago. DH does have a sister, who already worked part time, lives local, but leaves the lions share up to DH/us.

All theses ‘elderly’ (what age does someone become elderly?) who are living on their homes alone would surely be better in a home with social contact? If they need carers , can’t go out or manage their own finances -very easy now with online banking and CC all utilities etc online - they are not by any means ‘losing their independence’ by going into a home / since they are clearly not independent anyway. And would free up houses for families.I’d hate to rattle around alone with no social life -on the home my grandmother lived in there was as much or c as little socialising as you wanted and lots of stimulating activities and outings.

In MILs case she is 81 so young by care home standards and mentally ok, just physically frail. It’s hard to find home settings that cater for her needs (not great for social contact if most have dementia) and she isn’t keen, she likes being in her house. She has friends and neighbours who drop round. She can do her day to day online banking and shopping, DH mainly deals with savings and spent a long time sorting out the complicated arrangements his dad left!

My MIL takes great pleasure from her lovely home, surrounded by her own things and freedom to make her own decisions. She’s capable of managing her own cooking and cleaning just can’t get out and about on her own.

In a home she’d have to follow someone else’s rules, wouldn't be able to cook or choose her own food etc etc.

I can tell you absolutely that even though she’s a bit lonely she would absolutely not consider “social connection* a worthwhile exchange for the freedom of her own home.

As she becomes less capable we’ll provide additional support, arrange cleaners, carers etc but we wouldn't put her in a home unless she needed it for her own safety. She’d hate it.

Not here. DH visits his mum, organises carers/cleaners/gardeners/attends hospotal apts. We are 240 miles away. His sisters do fuck all and whilst they live on another continent vosit about every 10 and 5 years respectively and to date use their mums like an hotel. I am waiting to see how fast they arrive for the reading of the will.

I'm an only, I visit my mum regularly, deal with paperwork, appointments, have applied for attendance allowance and blue badge. 110 miles away. As she gets frailer I expect to visit more.

If and when necessary, DH and I have already agreed we will have to divide our time between them and home. I've already eyed up flats to rent near my mum if necessary. They are 90. If they need to go into a home, they'll be visited 2/3 times a week. A relly presence extrapolates to better care imo. However, saying that both are frail and have several health conditions and I suspect care will have a limited duration. We are both semi retired and accept that work will have to cease when they need more.

I have never done my own cleaning. Mum never did her own cleaning. Other people can be paid to do this, unless people have nothing or family has an eye to what will be left to inherit.

Then that’s fine.
My own mother is 85 and independent - does all her house stuff/admin/deals with builders/travels abroad/gets taxis to the supermarket… Goes to art classes/book clubs etc… I encourage that.
But if she needed personal care and brazen housebound. Would be a different scenario.
And there are homes for people v without dementia! My grandmother moved into one aged 99… and sharp as a tack. Was a lovely place.