Whole families on UC, PIP, DLA and carers' allowance for each other?

You are free to think and want that, it doesn’t offend me in the slightest.

How will my quadraplegic mate be up and dressed a full hour before his carers arrive?

This thread is rather tacky. At one point due to a SERIOUS condition which almost cost me my life, I was signed off work for more than 3 months and have to rely upon a modest amount in benefits, as I had a mortgage at the time, I didn’t qualify for anything else during that period and that didn’t cover half my mortgage costs. However, the contempt and sheer elitist attitude I encountered from the job centre staff down to every day folk when my I mentioned I was currently on benefits was absolutely appalling.

Despite having multiple surgeries and still no long term fix, I’ve gone back to work full time (against my consultant advice) because I can’t afford to live, feed my son and function (racked up so much credit debts to keep my head above water) and having to wear adult nappies, I then get even more appealing comments directed at benefit claimants. They’ll say ‘see, you’re really sick but if you can work, why can’t they?’

In both situations I felt like crap, one as direct result of being on benefits and second for people using me as a reason to continue to bash people on benefits.

FYI I am struggling to physically and mentally do it all but as long as I get a slap on the back from people like the OP, it makes my chronic pain, indignity and mental and physical burn out, OK.

I am sick of people making threads and lying about their intentions.

OP you can absolutely have your opinion and I advocate it but say it with your chest.

The school environment can be very mixed with parents on benefits and those who work.

Sadly though by the end of Autumn Reception term there seems to be cliques formed with parents on benefits and working parents hanging out separately so the kids don't tend to mix outside of school. This means disadvantage kids have even less exposure to extra curricular activities and opportunities while working parents and going from club to club and theatre shows at the weekends.

Maybe some kind of support to get the kids to all these opportunities so they can see themselves what they could achieve and break the cycle.

I would rather he had more money and less went to the people who claim they are very disabled and need PIp while simultaneously claiming they are a carer for someone else who is very disabled and needs Pip.

Pip and carers allowance should be mutually exclusive. That would put an end to a fair amount of the scamming

Obviously that's an exception.

About 40% of PIP claimants are psychiatric conditions. Granted some of those will be very high level need, possibly impatient care level. However I'd wager a lot of those claims are people who could offer some sort of work. We've all got stories of neighbours, acquaintances etc claiming who don't really need to. But perhaps they are the smart ones because they take home more than my FT teacher wage once housing etc is considered.

Surely you can not be serious?

But you can already work and claim pip?

I am guessing you wouldn't be able to care for someone else who was disabled enough to qualify for PIP though?

I'm a qualified social worker with four disabled children. Medically disabled with genetics that didn't manifest until they were into their teen years. We had no idea. Me and my DH are educated very highly, but I won't give those details.

I have seen families with generations of challenges to overcome and none of it was ever related directly to disability. Disadvantage takes several generations to really overcome.

I am not working as I am caring for my children myself. I'm not in the UK so the same criteria doesn't count to qualify for benefits. I am very capable of supporting my children practically and do all the way. I don't get a carer payment because my DH earns way too much. I don't work in paid employment because I have way too many days where I wake up and my well planned day is suddenly changed to having to go to emergency. I do lots to help my children (two of whom do get disability payments) and I do it well.

Do you know why I can do it well and more than meet the standards you have laid out? Because my DH earns a lot of money to enable me to do that. Supports are expensive. Many are not so lucky to be that capable of self-sufficiency either through income or lack of skills. It's a privileged position to be able to say parents need to help their own disabled children more. It's expensive, time consuming, takes skills a lot don't have. Then some parents just don't have the personal capacity to do it day in day out.

I think you are being judgemental and don't really have in depth knowledge of this area, OP. It's not that simple.

Because the benefits parents are on the gate every day, they go for coffee together because they aren't at work, they go to each others houses in the day because they aren't at work. Wheras the working parents are at work.

Voucher schemes are more expensive to administer. They achieve no benefit to the public purse and would be just empty appeasement to people who don't like the thought of disabled people receiving money. I'd take a very dim view of a government who caused a higher cost to the tax payer just as a sop to these people.

You’re being silly. The comment wasn’t directed at all claimants, but at those who are able contribute to some type of work. Clearly there will be instances where a claimant cannot work. Obviously the comment was not directed at someone quadriplegic……..

But there's little point when PIP pays enough to survive without working.

In which case you would have to wonder if the person with depression was best placed to be a carer.

Anyone denying the existence of families like this hasn’t spent enough time in SEND circles or around schools in deprived areas.

Both my children have disabilities. One attends a special school and the other I had to home ed through secondary school years.

I am fortunate to have had a solid upbringing and excellent education. My husband the same. We have fought tooth and nail to hold onto our careers, and keep developing them, through 16 extremely challenging years managing health crises, juggling hundreds of different doctors / OTs / physios / etc etc, adapting our home and lives around one child’s physical disabilities and learning disabilities, and the other’s neurodivergence, connective tissue disorder, and epilepsy.

It has been an uphill battle all the way but in some ways we have had good support and generally ok services.

So on one hand I say ‘there by the grace of god go I’.

On the other, it has been a lonely ride. I have tried attending a few SEND parent / parent carer meetings ups over the years. As has my husband. Taking time off work to make connections with others in similar circumstances and to contribute to advocacy efforts. Yet each time, the groups are without fail overwhelmingly attended by the same types. The ones there for the free biscuits and the £10 ASDA voucher.

And don’t get me started on ‘home ed’ groups. What I saw there was truly frightening.

People often have bright ideas about conditionality that obviously haven't had much thought put into them. The quadriplegic point has already been made. Another issue is the failure to explain what sort of community work do we have that would be suitable for all claimants, fit around work for those already in employment, that could be supervised and that wouldn't become more expensive than it is just to pay them what we do now. Wanting people to work more doesn't in itself create roles where the value of their labour outweighs the costs of extracting it. And then there'd still be people who can't or won't do the work, as there always have been, so we'd still need some kind of solution for them.

It's a difficult situation, but the reality is that we have a society that isn't constructed in a way allowing all of us to earn enough through our work to live on. This is likely to get worse, not better.

I wonder if anyone's considered that some people would just sell the voucher and get the money that way

Quite. Because you have to be so depressed you can barely function to get PIP (if you are honest on the form)

What about all the employed people claiming PIP, to attend your meetings would likely mean losing their jobs as they’re no longer available to work.

My husband has a severe physical disability, he also has a mental health condition, when he was in receipt of PIP he would have counted under claimants with mental health conditions. I’ve never met anyone who receives PIP who doesn’t need it.

Seriously? That’s ridiculous. It won’t be a pittance on the national scale. This needs stopped. How can anyone claim to need a carer whilst also claiming to be someone else’s carer without feeling disingenuous is beyond me.

They aren’t bashing everyone on benefits, just a specific group of people that have no motivation or need to push themselves or their children towards a life where they don’t need them. You can’t seriously believe they don’t exist - generations of people on benefits, living in council houses, not valuing education - I know plenty in the area I live. They are a drain on society, not contributing anything positive.

With the thought that this sometimes is the case in my mind, I think it's a case of shit life syndrome.

People tend to form relationships with those in similar circumstances. That's the crux of it.

It really is best to try to hang out with people who are better than you. They will raise you up. If only by a fraction.

Unemployed man, living at home lazy as hell or just a bit strange meets unemployed single mother who is on benefits (yes obviously some single mothers work. Obviously.) not working when she could.
He cocklodges as he has a certain charm while she thinks she's lucky as she's not as attractive as him.
They are already trying to get the kid diagnosed with autism etc for more money.
She 'accidentally' gets pregnant (at 30).
Yet another child is born to this.

Neither have any particular loyalty to each other.
Her because deep down she's been used. Him because he's an user.
So one of them cheats eventually.
The cycle continues until they age themselves out of the situation.

Meanwhile predators sensing the weakness of the 'family unit' abuse the children.
The children go on to have shit life syndrome.

Well, having a child who was less than 3 years old when I was on benefits, there was an element of caring I had to do irrespective of bleeding out my back passage, having malignant tumours removed, having ongoing bowel surgery.

So I will always have an element of care giving, my child was born before I became unwell and becoming disabled and sick doesn’t mean it exempts me from such duties. Yes, I relied upon my elderly widow mother and siblings to provide support when I physically was in hospital etc.

So the snarky point you’re trying to make is a moot point with me.

But unfortunately so true.