AIBU to think empty first class should be opened on crowded trains?

Me too. I have never yet been able to secure a cheaper fare by trying to book as far in advance as possible. I’ve just looked on Trainline and my son’s uni tran fare home is the same in 12 week’s time (their advanced booking limit) as it is tomorrow. Even the first class option is the same. Maybe year’s ago it was a thing but it’s not now, at least not where we are.

Absolutely!

No standing allowed in first class.

It’s always a good idea to try and book seats though. At least that way you’ve got a fighting chance of having a seat. I’ve learnt the hard way myself to remember to book a seat if I’m on a train for more than an hour (if reserving is an option).

Yep but that isn't what you buy in first class. That was my point badly explained!

When you purchase a standard class ticket, the terms of carriage only say they have to transport you from A to B and there is no guaranteed seat with the ticket.

When my kids were very young we too were on an overcrowded train, I asked about seating in first class and they said yes it was available, but I had to pay (which I did as I was feeling pretty desperate, it cost around £90 on top of my already bought standard ticket). It wasn’t in my budget as a single mum but needs must. It honestly didn’t occur to me that I should have it for free. Having children in tow is hard but it’s not an illness that was inflicted on you, it’s just life with kids. I had a terrible journey on a crowded train a couple of year’s ago, I had a back injury. I pondered upgrading but didn’t feel entitled to a free pass because I was in agony standing. Another passenger must have seen my pained face as he offered me his seat about 40 mins into the journey, I could have hugged him. 😭

Sadly, because it is such a cramped space, it would be very easy for others to overhear or observe such an offer and people can get remarkably aggressive if they perceive that others are being offered something they are not. I have witnessed this myself on public transport. I know that in a nice, courteous world, we would all agree that someone carrying an infant would be offered a seat somewhere but even then... think about what you just wrote. Why did nobody around that lady stand up to offer their seats in standard class? I have done that previously for older people on the long London-Cornwall run and sat on my suitcase in the vestibule between carriages. I would have done it for a disabled person, a pregnant lady, someone feeling unwell etc but not many others offered to give up their seats, not even when train staff went through the carriage asking.

But that is what you pay for, the assurance that getting on a train there will be space and will be a seat. The woman with baby and luggage etc someone who was sat down could have equally given up their seat to help.

You wouldn't be able to pick and choose, you don't own first class.

No, I wouldn't have an issue with those people being brought into first class, not at all. But I would have an issue with it being made a free for all, so I end up crammed in with pastie/cider guy and his ilk again.

So all those people who had their train cancelled and are now on a train with no seats, except for first class are now expected to stand? Including the op who had an autistic child with her? Or including the elderly and disabled, they are all supposed to stand even through the cancellation wasn't their fault? Nice, there's a word for people like you.

Nobody likes a pedant!

Can't! Not carnt.

Equally, I think people's default to self centredness is rife these days, what happened to empathy and being kind.

That works both ways though. There's often a staggering lack of empathy or kindness on display in the standard carriages. Last time I was on a lengthy journey in standard the bloke in the seat next to me was working his way through a bag of Gregg's pasties and a 2 litre bottle of Strongbow. The train was packed and it was hot and the smell was making me feel sick. Various other people were getting the weekend started with bottles of wine, singing and carrying on. One fella was clearly several drinks in, doing impressions of Liam Gallagher, staggering up and down the aisle. It was hell for me. No consideration for the people who just wanted a quiet journey home. Never again. So if it's selfish of me to pay for first class and expect it not to be packed to the rafters with people who haven't paid for first class, then so be it.

Carnt you read? I said first class should be available if there are seats free.

Equally, I think people's default to self centredness is rife these days, what happened to empathy and being kind. I know for a fact, due to two personal experiences that years ago you would be offered to sit in first class and not be turfed out. The first time having a young baby 17 years ago and standing up with them attached to me in a baby carrier, the ticket inspector led me to first class and told me to take a seat. The second time was similar but this time toddler and baby and he helped me with the buggy. I really do think all this selfishness is the reason for our demise!

Not the same at all, trains are subsidised by the public purse, they are a public service, whereas planes are very much a commercial affair.

Has it occurred to you that if trains are canceled they are also canceled for people with first class tickets too? There aren't necessary any seats available there either.

If a trains been cancelled where you have booked a seat but there's no seats available on the next train yes you should be allowed in first class. It's not your fault the train was cancelled and it's not your fault your booked seats are not available so first class should be the option when there are free seats. It's not all about what first class customers want 😡🙄. I was on a train recently on an extremely hot day and the conductor told us to sit in first class because it was the coolest carriage. I don't care what the first class customers thought, it's not all about them

Well, if you have paid for first class for all the reasons mentioned upthread, I think you are at least entitled to a refund of the difference between first and second class. After all, we don't mind people having the seats but first class is first class for a reason.

I once paid for first class as I knew the train would be busy and I've had problems in the past with people refusing to move out of my reserved seat. I was expecting a nice quiet carriage, sitting in my own seat and being served free drinks and snacks.

At the next station, we were told the previous train had broken down and all the people from that train would be getting on.

Ended up with people piled into first class so we were jammed in like sardines and the free refreshments were unable to be served.

Understand why they did it and feel sorry for the people who were disrupted by the broken down train but it was also frustrating not getting the extras I'd paid for.

But even if they declassify 1st class, it still wouldn't get rid of the problem as if trains are running at busy times such as Christmas or another train is cancelled then there aren't sufficient seats for everyone. On GWR for example, there is only one full first class carriage and a much smaller one near the galley and that is usually full as people (especially older/disabled) book in advance for longer journeys especially the London-Penzance route.

I think they should get rid of it totally.
Trains are crowded and lack seating. It is dangerous for people to be standing when they could sit down in another carriage.This reduces accident risks. Why don't we just make the travel experience better for everyone?