Brownies incident stopped me singing, starting to see how messed up it was.

Not if they can’t get it to fly at all!

We?

So they don’t build it themselves then? You have to help them? Do you help with the listing of all the items etc too? Is there any of it they are expected to do independently?

It does make me wonder if Jason Arday got the Instructor Activity Badge at Scouts...

Wouldn't be hard to improve the flying distance then!

We build a new one...

What if the thing they built doesn’t fly?

Well she clearly wasn’t impressed! Sounds like it made no difference anyway though to your life

For the Brownies Aviation badge the girls have to:

1. Challenge themselves to come up with at least 40 things that fly. They can be manufactured and natural.
2. Build an aircraft and see how far it goes (you can use paces). Think of ways you could improve the flying distance. Either by using a different launching technique or making alterations to the aircraft.
3. How high can you make it go? What materials will you use? It could be paper, a recycled bottle or even a balloon rocket. Your choice.

This one is popular with my girls.

@Anarchy99 I was a very good singer at the time. I had passed my choral bands in church choir and also got my entertainer badge at Brownies too for singing and playing the recorder and piano.

Probably, but I really don't see the problem with earning a badge in the process. It gives the cubs something to aim for, to put on their uniform to signify the things they've done, to aim towards getting the top badge by attending regularly and trying new things, and often pushing themselves out of their comfort zone zone. Their badges show their journey through scouting, which I think is a lovely thing, and they should be proud of them.

I get that you think all awards should be given on merit, not effort, and I can see why that should be the case with some activities, such as piano exams, karate gradings etc, where you move up to the next level. But that's not what cub/brownie badges are for, and it's not how they work. It's a different thing from many awards/exams. It's not an award in that sense.

Possibly. But you can be more sure that if they'd then been told they'd "failed" a badge for not being up to scratch, that inspiration would disappear pretty fast.

Would the children not have been inspired through just doing the activity in their sessions?

And that’s fine if everyone understands that having, say, a baking badge doesn’t mean you are a good baker, it just means you turned up and baked something

It means that you learned how to bake something - even if the outcome wasn't quite what you'd hoped for. Perhaps that child will be inspired enough to go home and try again. We did the chef badge, and I know of at least two children who now cook regularly for their parents. They may not have done that if we didn't give them the inspiration in the first place.

Out of interest, have the badges become easier to get, over the years?. I'd say not in the 15 years I've been a cub leader.

I kind of get long service awards for volunteers.

It doesn’t horrify me at all. But it appears that most badges are no different from giving them out for every year or to mark occasions. And that’s fine if everyone understands that having, say, a baking badge doesn’t mean you are a good baker, it just means you turned up and baked something.

Will it horrify you to learn that we also have badges that are literally just for participating?! We have anniversary badges for every year they are a member (I have just got my 20 years' service award for volunteering, is that meaningless?) and then special occasion badges to mark certain events e.g. the coronation, 100th World Thinking Day etc. For those the only requirement is to be a member at the time of the event. Are they also pointless, or just a nice token to mark an occasion?

Not sure why they can’t be ‘engaged’ without a participation trophy but there you go. People obviously think it’s a good thing.

@budgiegirl Out of interest, have the badges become easier to get, over the years?

If that's the case, why do you need a judge? Everyone passes, so no judge is needed. Having a judge there and awarding a badge suggests, falsely, that the child has worked hard and achieved something significant. They almost certainly believe that they've achieved something important, and their parents probably believe it too. But in fact, they haven't, they've just had a quick go at something.

Because that's not how scouting/guiding works, and has been working for over 100 years. The earning of badges is a big part of the ethos, and it covers a huge range of different activities. Scouting is more popular than ever right now, with most groups having huge waiting lists.

In my opinion (and the opinion of the majority of parents who send their kids), scouting works. It turns out good, adventurous kids who are willing to help others and give things a go.

You may not agree with the badge giving, but the kids love it, it helps them to stay engaged, and they have fun learning along the way. If you don't agree with it, don't send your kids. We won't be changing the system any time soon.

Then why.not just do sessions to let them have a go? Why do they need something that is seen as an award?

I agree. It is a participation trophy, nothing else.

It’s a shame for those who do a great job and actually deserve a badge when they see their fellow brownies getting one for not doing very well. It’s probably a bit demotivating

It's not encouraging mediocrity, or dumbing down. It's encouraging children to take part in an activity, give it a go, see if they enjoy it. It might spark a whole new hobby or interest, in which case they may go on to do great things with that hobby. Or they might not, but we're exposing them to a world of possibilities. What's wrong with that?

You just make it very clear that you are encouraging mediocrity. It's dumbing down. Children are capable of so much more. I think that dumbing down - expecting very little and rewarding children for doing practically nothing - does nobody any favours in the long run.

In the case of the Entertainer Badge, they earn it by taking part in a show.
In the case of the Backwoods Cooking Badge, they earn it by learning about how to light, look after, and cook on a fire.
In the case of the book reader badge, they earn it by reading 6 books, talking to us about them, and learning how to use a library, dictionary etc.

So badges are earned, not just given, because the children have to do something to earn them.

As I said, for the majority of badges, there is no test to pass, no skill level to reach. This is not true for a few of the badges, but these are the exception.
For the majority, by taking part in the activity, they will earn the badge. If they sit on the sidelines and don't take part, they don't get the badge.

Wow. So that’s why so many people think it’s okay to inflict their hideously tuneless warbling on others!

I can’t be the only one who would have seen through that encouragement (unless it’s realistic like ’okay you aren’t great but you might be able to learn’) as insincere and meaningless

I can’t sing - I do enjoy it but I only do it if I’m out of earshot of others, because I’m considerate.