Bailing because the 'kids don't want to'

Wow. The next time she asked me I'd be honest and say look, it's unfair how you keep cancelling I don't think we should rearrange.

She obviously doesn't care about your or your son's feelings!

Are her kids maybe neurodiverse? Mine are and it took me years to realise that once they were beyond the toddler stage I had to prep them for plans - letting them know at least a day in advance, talking them through what would happen, and letting them feel like they had a bit of control over the situation. For a couple of years I'd make the plans, announce them in the morning, they'd melt down and we'd either have to cancel or the day would be a mess. I wonder if a similar thing is going on here? I realised they needed lots of notice to be able to enjoy a day out with friends long before we realised they were neurodiverse by the way.

Sounds like when we go away with extended family, on our first trip the family with the youngest children (so harder to entertain, I do understand!) found the pool amazing, and now it is the only expectation of the entire group. So I suggested we go somewhere different next time, something that caters for all ages (children aged 2-17) and the response was there will have to be a pool, even though no one else likes swimming

its easy. stop agreeing on playdates with her.

TBH she might be a nice friend who’d pick you up at 3am etc, but some people are so focussed on their own children and what they say etc they can’t see their own behaviours

Children should always be important, but they also need to learn right from wrong

Bin her off as she can't be bothered and she's using the kids as an excuse. She's probably on her phone instead of spending real time with real people.

I have a friend like this. i think it’s her interpretation of gentle parenting. i agree it’s annoying and rude!

It's a new style of parenting, which makes the child the centre of the world. It can't be good for them long term.
I had some people to stay with their 4 year old. We live in a touristy area and I had loads of interesting trips planned. On Day 2 they took their child to the swimming pool. The child enjoyed it and that was it for their stay - they insisted on going swimming every day and the trips didn't happen.

My friend's DH is a driving instructor, properly qualified, who had successfully helped the DC of several mutual friends to pass their test. As a favour to friends, he offered mates' rates. Added bonus for nervous teenagers of being taught by a familiar, trusted person. Until it came to "Emma". He drove all the way over to the family home, only to be told that "Emma" wasn't feeling very well, vague symptoms but not really up to it.....not even a call or message to prevent him setting off, and I suspect that "Emma" (and her DM by example) felt it was OK to flake because after all, it was only an arrangement between friends, Never mind that the slot could have been filled by a pupil paying the full fee.
DM was astonished when he suggested that it would be better for her to book lessons with a "proper" instructor and take it more seriously, at the full going rate, naturally.
A reputation for flakiness does nobody any good in the long run.

Very rude behaviour

It is rude and very unfair on you guys OP. I think I would let her know that it upsets your child when she cancels. Maybe next time she suggests something, say you would love too but only if she's sure they can make it as the last few outings were cancelled and your son was disappointed. Might make her think differently.

Do the kids not like each other? We had this problem, a mum arranged a playdate at the local park and ds10 didn’t really like her son - definitely didn’t want to go, forced him and he spent the entire time playing with other kids and ignoring her son. She asked again and I had to make excuses.

Many years ago I worked in a call centre and could not hear the caller because of a very loud TV. When I asked politely if she could turn it down she refused because "my children are watching TV." I told her I was sorry but I couldn't continue with he call and terminated it. People can be unbelievably rude and thoughtless.

Definitely not on. Kids should not be in a position of dictating their parents' social life and as PPs have said, this is setting a bad precedent. They'll think everything revolves around what they want and they'll end up with no concept of compromise or just politely putting other people first sometimes.

Agree with @Ethelspagetti
Keep it breezy - agree to meet if it’s something you want to do anyway, don’t make a fuss that Amy and Joe will be there too… if they end up going then it’s a nice addition, if they don’t then it doesn’t spoil your day.
If any plans involve prepaid tickets, get payment upfront.

I feel like it is just disrespectful of my time

It is! Agree with others - don’t agree to make plans with her again. And be direct with her about why not! “I don’t think advance plans work well for you and your DC - let’s just see how we all feel on the day” is a decent bet if you don’t want to cut off the friendship. I must day, though, in my experience the “flexible” types really don’t like it when the boot is on the other foot and they are the ones whose time is dependent on the whims of others…..

My sister used to do that. I ended up explaining to her that my kids were now upset, as they were looking forward to meeting him. In the end I didn’t tell my kids if their cousin was meeting us or visiting because it wasn’t worth the hassle. He didn’t want to come because he was on his iPad! Which shouldn’t have been given before the planned visit/meet up!

Yep

No that's not normal.

She s probably just a lazy parent. Pretty normal to have kids that moan about doing things, but also normal to completely ignore that and get on with things.

This is a good suggestion if you want to maintain the possibility of still meeting up. Only accept or make suggestions that would work for you and your child regardless of whether she turns up or not. And let.your son know that friends "might" be there.

Perhaps what those two things (meeting a demand for a pickup at 3am, and not making kids stick to an arranged playdate) have in common is that she can't say no, even when people are being unreasonable.

I suspect she sees her dc playing nicely and chilled at home, and can’t resist the opportunity of a break. The holidays are knackering. We have all been there when our dc are busy building Lego village together quite happy together, and having to drag them out feels like a chore, most of us though, would never let a friend down for such trivial non reasons.

I had a friend like this, she was much better as a friend just to me (not dc) and so we jet up for dinner, drinks etc instead. If she is fairly reliable when it’s adult meet ups I wouldn’t give up a 3am friend. She clearly is laid back and a go with the flow person, she might find all the planning tiring, and is better suited to being spontaneous.

I don’t know if you can be bothered to adjust the way you meet up. I would prob just prefer to see more reliable friends.

Obviously I can't know for sure, but I wouldn't necessarily say this is the case. I do think there are increasing numbers of people who put their kids in charge and are seemingly incapable of getting them to do things they don't want to do at that moment.

Yes it's rude and selfish.

Though I'm struck by OP saying that the friend isn't selfish and flaky in other ways ie where the kids aren't involved. I suppose the answer is to only meet up one to one without kids.

She's making a rod for her own back letting her kids always call the shots like that. We have friends who indulged their kids like that. They'd start expensive hobbies and then "not feel like" going etc. The parents would drop out of planned nights out because the kids "didn't want to go to grandma's". Eventually they both started school refusing after lockdown and never went again. They're now young adults, live in their bedrooms, no education/jobs/friends and are both suffering from depression. Their parents are tearing their hair out with despair.

Yeah, this wouldn't work for me. It is rude and disrespectful of your time, and super indulgent of her children (frankly to their long term detriment).