Bailing because the 'kids don't want to'

I'd not make play date plans with her anymore op. Next time she suggests one just say you'd rather not for now as it's been inconvenient and disappointing for you and your son when she cancels at the last minute because either her or the kids don't fancy it.

How can a grown adult be so oblivious to how rude this is?! Like you if we make plans in my house we stick to them. My youngest sometimes would rather stay on minecraft or something and I am permanently exhausted so it's not like I live for playddates but if we have plans, we aren't flaky about them.

I think it's about her not being able to parent. We all know how hard it is to stop a child who's gaming so she just caves in instead of turning off their PlayStation which a decent parent would do when you have somewhere to go.

Before deciding to meet again I would tell her that "Please don't make any plans if you can't follow through because then my dc is upset and we have wasted our time while we could have made other plans." How does this work when there is school or a medical appointment? Surely she's able to stand her ground then so it's clear she doesn't respect you and therefore can't be bothered.

I have a friend like this. She's a really good friend in every other way, so I don't want to lose her friendship. I don't tell the kids that we're meeting up with her.
That way, if she turns up, it's a surprise for them. If she doesn't, they don't know anything was ever planned so there's no disappointment.

She is teaching her children terrible social skills.

Terrible friend and quite honestly if she is allowing her children to rule the roost and basically dump people and plans to play on the PlayStation she is a terrible mum! I would probably say something but that’s me!!

You should talk to her about it and ask her why this happens. I'd cover the following points:

1. There have been X occasions where we've arranged a play date and then on the day you've said your children don't fancy it.
2. My child feels really disappointed when this happens.
3. I sometimes turn down other plans because of the one we've made with you, and then when you cancel last minute we're left without a play date for the day.
4. Is there an issue here that we can work together to resolve?

She might not be aware that she's inconveniencing you when she does this, maybe she's from a family/friendship group that operates on very loose, changeable plans! If you tell her that doesn't work well for you then she might make more effort to keep the play dates you arrange. Or she might stop making the plans with you in the first place. Either way, hopefully she stops wasting your time and disappointing your son.

I have a neighbour who has canceled play dates with us last minute on several occasions now (I've lost count!). She has ADHD - I'm no expert but I've Googled what impact this could have on her ability to honour plans she's made and found: "Executive dysfunction, time blindness, and low mental energy make it hard to track time, remember details, or follow through when the day arrives." We are still friendly but I've given up on making plans with her now, we just see her and her kids at the local park when we all happen to be there!

ETA: in the 4 years my neighbour and I have been friends she has managed to keep ONE play date we had prearranged at the park. She's never honoured any of the play dates we've arranged at each others houses.

@holiphant I have a friend like this. It's got to the point where I don't even mention we're seeing them until the last minute - I'll just say we're going to the park or whatever and then when we're nearly there I'll go oh it looks like "Ben" and his mum are coming.

It's always a last minute "we're feeling really tired/"Ben" doesn't feel like coming out" etc or sometimes literally just "sorry we'll have do it another time"... We just go out anyway and then I inevitably get a text later on from her moaning that her son has just been on the PlayStation or tablet all afternoon 🤷

That's a terrible thing to do to you. No wonder you've binned her off. And that's the world's worst excuse for not following through on her offer and commitment. Awful behaviour.

Shes not a close friend.

Yes, like others I would say that your kids are getting too disappointed and that it’s better to take a rain check for a while. Then wait for her to initiate something. You may wait for some time!!

Your friend’s parenting approach is creating kids that are part of the reason why society is the way that it is. 😑

Many of them will stay living with and being 'kept' by their parents a long, long way into adulthood. The wheels will fall off once the parents become of retirement age and can no longer afford this.

That's really rude. If she'd help you in other ways like you said, then I'd imagine the reason is she can't stand up to her kids. She is in for a hellish ride through teenagerhood if that's the case!

Oh no that’s not good! And I say this as someone with sen kids.

Is it genuinely the kids or is she just flaking and using them as an excuse?

Next time just reply as breezily as her but deliberalty make it awkward for her: "we're already here" or, "no worries, I'll bring them over, they love the playstation"

She has a thick skin treating you that way.

Yeah, it is not what I would call great parenting but 🤷‍♀️
If you still value the friendship/kids enjoy the play dates then I would start not firming things up until the actual day or even an hour before if she is really bad and never tell your children ahead of time. I’ve done something similar with flaky acquaintances over the years and it works quite well. If you really need to plan ahead e.g. ticketed events/further travel then make sure there is at least one non flaky person going too.
e.g. FF: fancy meeting up in the park on Wednesday afternoon?
you: yes, great free at moment on Wed afternoon. Let me know on Wed morning if it still works and we can firm it up then.
Do not tell the kids and do not chase her/say no to anything else/put anything else on hold in the meantime. If she contacts you on Wed morning to firm up and you are still free great - if not then ok too.
Don’t invite her to things you plan (unless group events) with much notice (same day really), and again - don’t tell this kids until it is actually happening.

I have a friend like this (although not with the children allegedly deciding if they're attending on the day). As I like her a lot and my kids like her kids, I just make plans and let her know I'm going and if she wants to she can turn up, like I'll say I'm going to soft play at this time if your their on the day it would be great to see you if not, no worries. I don't tell the children either so they have no expectations and are just really happy to see their friends if they do turn up. Weirdly I think I see her more now! It stressed me out and now I have no expectations so it's nice if we do but doesn't impact our plans much.

@holiphant
No kid should have that much of a say unless they're in danger
I know she's a 'friend'
But I'd say it with a very tiny 'f' at the beginning.........

It doesn't say how old they are, only mentioning that OPs child is eight. My kids were both older than that when the possibility of neurodiversity was first raised. I hadn't realised because they were doing well academically and it was my normal. I used to make commitments that I didn't manage to follow through on or which created upset for a long time before I learned an approach they could deal with. I also get that it is difficult for ND children to cope with change of plans, and that's why I am wondering if this Mum isn't giving her kids enough notice to get them out the house without a meltdown and when they are settled sometimes just decides it's easier to leave them as they are.

I think it’s okay to do occasionally as long as you give decent notice. There’s the odd occasion where I can tell my kids really really don’t want to do something, so I cancel it. But they also know that cancelling last minute (in this case I mean several hours before, not actually last min) will mean people don’t want to hang out with them if they do it often because it’s being a flake. It’s a bit of a balance between trying to teach them sometimes it’s okay to cancel if you’re not feeling it as long as you’re timely vs teaching them not to be flakey.

I don’t think your friend is being a good friend and she’s not teaching her children to be good friends - which will probably bite them on the arse in adulthood.

My brother-in-law's partner is like this with my nephew. It's always "P doesn't want to ..." or some health problem of hers as an excuse as to not meet up. And I made the mistake of saying about it to my MIL. They didn't understand what I was saying about giving a young child too much power and autonomy and "ruling the roost" as I see it. I had already decided to throw in the towel re. organising meet-ups (it was nearly always me doing so) but I doubt she'll ever speak to me again now anyway, so problem solved 🙄🤔 I must be SUCH a terrible mother to think that the parents get the final say on arrangements. Also, if we've committed to something we'll always stick to it (other than illness or an emergency).

But what ages are her children? I mean, is it a playdate because they’re friends with yours and want to play, or a playdate because you’re friends with the mother and want to chat?

Not ok, I would sack her off as a friend

I’ve got a friend that does this: our boys are the same age. Quite often she will cancel at last minute. One time a few of my sons friends cancelled on the same day, and my heart was sad for him waiting for his pals.

the next time we were meeting with them, my son decided he didn’t want to go: he wanted just us to hang out: usually I’d give him the lecture about not letting people down. But he reminded me that they often cancel on us

I might get shit for this but I'd probably start to find any child parented like this absolutely insufferable too.