AIBU to think upper middle class professionals downplay how much they game education?

I am not wealthy myself but happen to live in an area that has "up and come" so my more recent neighbours are much weather and I recognise what you describe.

It's this kind of fake hands-off humility that people present in public - "Tarquin just wanted to go to blah blah posh school, I wouldn't have minded if he had gone to the local comp really, I hear it's very good"

In reality you know they have tutored Tarquin within an inch of his life and put him forward for every entrance test going to actively avoid the local comp.
Why not admit that? Doing the best for your kids, whatever you perceive it to be, is what we all do.
If you are privileged enough to throw money at that, great, own it and don't pretend otherwise.

Actually, the sport and music provision was very important to us. And we were clear and honest about it.

Who lets their kids choose at 11?

Parents should listen to their kids views but do what the parent decide is best.

Friends are not the priority over education.

A 10 or 11 year old cannot possibly asses which school is best for them.

It's hard enough for parents.

Yes I think this is a better word for the behaviour….

I don't think it's true at all to say that most parents "dgaf" about their children's education!! That's a rather sad place to be starting from when approaching this topic.

I do think everyone has their own, highly personalised, version of "normal" though. To some, aiming for the top private schools is gaming the system. To others, it's just the done thing, what other option could there possibly be?

This is interesting. I don’t doubt you, but personally I have never heard another parent say anything like this. IME everyone was inclined to share what they were doing to help their children do well rather than otherwise.

Nor do I recognise the idea that most British parents don’t care about education. Do you think it’s an area or ‘class’ thing? Or maybe race? There is a perception that eg some white working class people are less interested than, for example, parents from other ethinic origins whose children are statistically high performing. But I’m not sure how helpful generalisations are.

Perhaps a GP sees a wider range of people than most.

I agree OP. The ‘progressive’ middle classes talk about comprehensive state education being a good thing and then buy a property in the catchment of a good comp, tutor for a grammar, or if all else fails opt out of state altogether.

There’s a lot of gaming education that goes on. Which is fine. Except for the rank hypocrisy of those who boast about their commitment to state provision and then use their money to elbow others out of the way to get the best for their child.

So not 'gaming' - but being disingenuous?

Maybe they just think “we’re sending our kids private because it buys them better opportunities” is so staggeringly obvious that it doesn’t need to be said? So they then focus on the secondary reasons they chose that specific school, which might be the music lessons 🤷‍♀️

It's not contradictory to change your mind when new information or situations surface and it's possible that this is what happened with some of your acquaintances. More importantly, why does that matter to you?

The DC of professionals could prefer public school if it's always been the accepted route in the family.
Our attitude to educating our dc was never ever brought up with friends.

I think they just mean they’re not strictly dictating the decisions or heavily pressuring their DC to follow a certain life path like some parents do. I don’t think they’re trying to claim that their DC’s choices aren’t influenced by their privileges at all.

They just mean aren’t telling their DC “you will go to (school parents chose), a tutor and specific hobbies are non-negotiable and you will study (specific subject at specific university) to become a (job)”

When I asked my DCs, oddly enough they wanted to go to the better secondary schools, too ...

Not really sure what you're complaining about tbh

I sold a one bed flat in a good school catchment area a few years ago. The estate agent mentioned the school catchment in the property details. I questioned this as nobody would be able to fit children in the flat! He said they still had people buying properties they had no intention of living in so they could use the address to get children into a good school.

What on earth are you talking about, it’s not gaming the system, take your tin foil hat off, all children will perform based on their ability, personality type and drive,

yes if capable and they wish to it gives them a better chance, of course if does, but that’s not gaming the system. It’s simply giving them a better chance, ultimately the child will still decide. You can’t force your child to do something as an adult they either don’t wish or are not capable of.

I actually don’t agree that this is the case. Our local FB page is full of parents who are obviously not UMC but who are deeply invested in which state schools in the town are better and how to get their kids into them. I think the % of parents who really DGAF is actually low, but if you don’t have the money for private then obviously your options might be limited and someone will end up with the worst school.

other parents DC being interested in prestigious but completely unrelated careers e.g. Doctor or investment banking who have obviously been guided by parents.

i think this comes down to “what is your normal”. If your parents have a lot of friends who work in the city/ in finance then it’s reasonable to expect that you might see it as a good career even if your parents aren’t doing that themselves or have guided you to it. It’s kind of a good job that dc whose parents aren’t doctors want to do it because no one who is a doctor is encouraging their dc down that path, that’s for sure 😂

It's a game of appearing laid back and not appearing to be a helicopter to a degree.

I used insouicantly to say, oh we just bunged them into the closest local schools - which we did. However those local schools were amongst the best in the land. We just had clever children and didn't tutor.

We let DC find their own way and make their own choices: all the way to Oxford and Cambridge .

They aren't gaming education @MyCyanAnt They might be gaming you a bit but their educational routes are the routes they know and expect.

This is always relative to something.
Maybe people in hereditarily wealthy families feel they are giving their children more choices than they had themselves.

You are not wrong in your observations - it is like a free choice from the pre-approved choices. Or, one might say, "just bringing the children up to make the right choices themselves".

Is it gaming the system, or playing the best with the hand you've got - within the system?

I agree OP. The rhetoric is very “oh this old thing, it just sort of happened like that…” but somehow they have just moved to Buckinghamshire (for grammar schools) or just happened to start going to church every Sunday (to get into the CoE “outstanding” primary).

It’s all pretty calculated but many don’t / won’t really admit their motivation. Own your pushy middle class behaviour (I try to, no point in being all shy about it).

i disagree with your statement that most parents don’t give a f. I think k a minority don’t but I think most parents do their best for their kids.

I am from a similar background and agree with your analysis. They are doing their best for their offspring but they don’t recognise their privilege.

I dont agree in 'gaming' but I do agree that some parents aren't outwardly honest about why they send their kids to private schools. They do often build a narrative around shopping around including state schools but the 'fit' was much better at the fee paying option/s or the kid preferred it. When really it'd be more honest to say we want to pay for our kids to have what we think is an advantage, through private education and tutoring (normally its both).

Gaming (as I understand it) means to manipulate, and that’s not the behaviour you’re describing. Wouldn't it be more accurate to say these people are downplaying their involvement, or at a push being hypocrites?

it will almost always be either a private, grammar or high performing comp on expensive catchment area instead of a genuinely average comp

You seem to be saying…nothing in particular here?

Given all options are available the child or adult involved is unlikely to pick the “genuinely average comp” nor as high earners is the catchment comp likely to be “genuinely average”. So not pushing the children / letting them pick is the truth.

Also quite usual for kids to pick professions their parents or others in their family / circle do.

This feels like a non-observation and that you have a chip on your shoulder.

Dh is a Dr and so are most of our friends. None of them (and certainly not us) would say our DC “will succeed anywhere”. We know full well that the environment a child is learning in can impact their academic performance. So yes we all try and get our kids into the best school for them to learn in, now that doesn’t necessarily mean private (in fact a lot of Drs are getting priced out of private education for their kids). But it might mean grammar school or buying a house in the catchment of the best Comp. Wouldn’t all parents try and get their kids into the best school for that child?