To not understand attitude on here to grandparents helping with childcare

Maybe people should think more before having children and then keep on having them with no thought on what they put onto others?

I helped out when I could, but had to work full-time to support myself. I didn't have the luxury of spending all my time with my grandchildren. I can't retire until I'm 67, by which time my grandchildren will be grown.

And when you mention grandparents, what you mean are the grandmothers. Women who have already raised a family, and like myself are having to work to keep a roof over their heads.

My mother brought up 4 children, and I never expected her to take on her grandchildren, too.

No this isn't the expectation. The point is that for a lot of men and women they WANT to be present and available and helpful in their adult children's life. It isn't a chore or a sacrifice or something to be weighed against holidays. It's the meaning of life. Literally.

I'm very much of the opinion that no help with childcare = no help in old age. Can't have it one way and not the other.

Yabu because not everyone is the same as your mum. Not all parents enjoy the baby/toddler stage. Many grandparents want to travel rather than babysit. Many grandparents work full time or have busy lives, and simply don't have the time to cope with small dcs.

My dm raised her own 6 dcs and that was enough. She was happy to leave the parenting of grandchildren where it belonged. She had a choice, not an obligation.

I'm 63, not a dgp yet, and I already know I'll only look after my (theoretical) dgcs in an emergency. I spent 40 years working full time. 16 years raising ds as a single mum with no support. Now I want a little freedom. That is not unreasonable.

I have two daughters, and I cannot imagine ever telling them they are on their own and not to look to me for help when they have families. I’ll do everything I can to support them and built a strong relationship with my grandchildren. Sure, holidays and hobbies are nice, and within reason I will make an effort to fit them in around childcare. But I am their mum, and they will be my number 1 priority for the rest of my life. I’ll always be here for them in any way I can.

My mum is like this. She is an incredible grandparent (and mum) and I am endlessly grateful to her. When the time comes that she is old and frail and dependent, I won’t forget everything she has done for me, and I will do everything I can for her in turn.

Because women are more than their caring abilities? Men are allowed a life why can't women be?

When people say "expecting help is entitled" i just feel like it misses the point. It's not really about expecting help it's about thinking the circle of life means it's what's hoped for and what's expected just like the OP looks after her elderly parent. No-one would say her mother is "entitled" for wanting and hoping and to some extent expecting her the OP to assist her in her old age so why is it so often seen as entitled when young people with children are seen as entitled for hoping and wanting their parents to help them when they are really under pressure.

If my child chooses to have children I will help out as and when I see fit. I like to think that would be a decent amount but I have to say I'm already drained from providing care for everyone else in my life for my whole life and being left with very little time and energy for myself. There seems to be an expectation of women in particular to sacrifice their own desires and needs to pick up the slack for everyone else, caring for elderly parents, caring for their children, their sick husbands, their grandchildren - there is never the same expectation from men. I don't blame people for reaching a point where they prioritise themselves for a change.

My own mother barely helped with my son and I was a single parent (no involvement from the father whatsoever) but I never asked her did and didn't expect her to. She has done enough caring in her life (and still is) and I chose to have my child and it was my job to raise him, I never expected any help but was grateful for any that came my way.

It was always important to me that we had robust childcare in place for the day-to-day stuff. I would never expect my parents to do regular childcare or school pick ups etc. They have their own lives to live! If they want to be fun grandparents, that’s great! My parents took my son and his cousin to the theatre and out for pizza last week. Fantastic! But I would never expect them to do it out of a sense of duty or feel like they have to say yes.

I agree with you entirely. It might be a bit romantic as my children are still small but I pray they want me around and rely on me when they are older. I truly hope they want me to look after their children and that I am still able to do so. My mum helps but it's entirely on her terms rather than want may be helpful to me. It's what fits in with her life and as long as her life isn't interrupted too much she will help. I find it quite sad as I wish I had a better relationship with her and that we saw each other more.

I think expecting help is entitled. But many of my friends have parents who are very happy to help and love taking care of their grandchildren. That is lovely but I don’t think it should be expected. Both my parents moved very far away before I had children. We’ve never had any childcare of any kind from family. That is fine, it is my parents choice and I would never expect anything from them. My grandparents were very hands on and I was very close to them. My children are not particularly close to their grandparents which isn’t surprising given that they have not spent that much time with them. If I have grandchildren one day I would hope to be an involved and supportive grandparent. But I don’t think there is anything wrong with grandparents choosing not to be particularly involved.

Most of my friends who have a lot of family support and very appreciative and would never take it for granted. I’m happy for them that they have that support and that their children have great relationships with grandparents. But I do judge the people I know who expect their parents/in laws to be available for child care whenever they want it. I don’t think it’s right or fair.

It does make me sad that my children aren’t close to their grandparents. But I don’t resent my parents/in laws for choosing to live their lives. They didn’t ask to be grandparents.

I agree BUT only because I adore my mum and we help each other and we are close. We also live 10 minutes away so it's easy.

Many people have awful parents and strained relationships. This is not a straightforward answer.

I had, I guess, the worst of both worlds. My DM had zero interest in helping me with childcare. She loved my DCs but didn’t look after them alone at all. I always had to be there doing the mundane bits & she would do the nice “treaty” bits.

However, when DM became seriously unwell, I was the one looking after her day in day out whilst looking after an autistic teenager, a 10 year old & a newborn baby. DM used to resent DD coming to her chemotherapy appointments because it meant I’d take DM in & then go for a walk with DD & come back. She wanted me to sit with her throughout as other patients’ daughters were. DD was 6 weeks old & breastfed when chemo started. She was allowed on to the oncology unit but not actually into the room where treatment was taking place.

I have always made a very conscious effort to parent very differently.

Never had a day’s help from my parents with DS. He’s now 12. My mother told me, when I was about 13, that she didn’t want to be a grandmother, so as far as she’s concerned, she isn’t.

And bless you for that - v.rare for MN, where parents are expected to 'give', 'give', 'give' at all times. I get so angry when I read posts like the OP's post - but it is personal. Never had the chance to thank my Dad properly for everything he did for me, all I wanted to do what to graduate from uni, get a job, earn and send him on a proper holiday, but he did not live long enough. Would never inflict my dc on my mum - after the difficulties she had, working all her life, hard physical work. We managed somehow and only presented our dc to their grandma supervised by us, well behaved and reverential to her. This utilitarian approach, exploiting this 'love for grandchildren', as if it is not possible to love your grandchildren without having to be their servant or nanny.

I don't think it's entitled at all, but I think some people don't actually look at their parents properly and realise their expectations are too much. Many of my friends have parents in their 70s/80s and expect them to do nursery aged care, full days, multiple times a week, or getting school aged children ready for school, and doing the school run later the same day - while not noticing their parents are getting more tired and less capable. My children have one grandparent - I want him to feel he can have fun with the kids when he wants to see them, rather than being tied to times and full days and naps and meal times etc.

I must admit I’m jealous of people who get help with childcare. We have no family close by / able to help so my husband and I have never had an evening off or night off together in seven years. I do sometimes feel jealous of friends who have a weekend away or even a night out.

I think that it’s absolutely normal for grandparents to look after their grandchildren for the occasional day/evening/weekend. I think that I would feel quite upset if my parents wouldn’t do this, obviously with distance, free time and health issues allowing. My parents have only looked after my children on a very few occasions but this is because we live far away, I know if we lived nearby they would have loved to have them often.

I think that expecting your parents to become your free childminders is another thing entirely. I’m sure that lots are quite happy to do a day a week or a few school pickups but it’s such a huge commitment and when you’re depending on them to look after your kids so that you can go to work then it’s so hard for them to say ‘actually we’re not feeling great today can we give it a miss’.

And yes I do have a dad he did babysit occasionally especially after he retired he is dead and my children are devastated but my moms refusal to help out in a blue moon was actually hurtful she had a lot of help from her family and in laws when I was growing up she was just very VERY angry that people expected her to have anything to do with her grandchildren

@HollyhocksandPeons I agree. We had very little parental support when our children were young, but DH and I are happy to help our parents (in their 80's) now. It's got nothing to do with whether they helped out with our children!

Lots of people don’t live near their parents.

possible over example: my mum lives in Lancashire and my brother lives in New Zealand. Clearly she isn’t going to be helping.

It must be very nice if you have parents that are the combination of the right age, local and interested to be involved in family life.

A lot of families don't tick all 3 boxes.

Family childcare was never going go be in the equation for us and that's OK.

I'm not falling over myself to do elder-care, but that's not tit-for-tat about childcare, it's an awkward combination of distance, being at a busy life stage, and the practicalities of dealing with someone with a difficult personality who is now facing the consequences of many poor choices over decades.

Honestly I probably am a little bitter no-one ever helped me with childcare my mom never helped I had to beg her to watch my daughter so I could have a smear test when she was a toddler (not in nursery or school) my mom cancelled the day of so the dr did it while she was cranky in her pushchair behind a curtain ive had nurses hold her while ive been to hospital appointments and I need to be weighed by the time I had my second I had stopped asking for occasional emergency support she has never babysat so I can work or socialise or even do the shopping my kids are nearly grown now and don't know her at all

This
We had to move hundreds of miles away to London for jobs.
When we had our DC, our mothers were caring for their parents. Our DC's childhoods were a combination of nanny, sahm and au-pair. Grandparents helped in emergencies but were a day away.

DH and I are mid 60s, we have one 8 week old grandchild, but they're thousands of miles away. DH and I are also looking after our very elderly mothers, from a distance, and working.

The DC have properties, no student loans, and we will happily contribute towards childcare, it's quite a good tax wheeze out of spare income. However, I do not want to be committed to regular childcare from 8am to 6pm. I've worked for 40 years and the next ten are mine and DH's time. We would of course help at the drop of a hat in an emergency. We just want to be grandparents, not childcare. Also, we are ten years older than our parents were when GC came along.

I am.sorry if people find that strange.