To not understand attitude on here to grandparents helping with childcare

I think there are two quite distinct scenarios.

I completely understand why GPs might decline providing regular childcare for working parents. It's a big commitment that will limit their own freedom in the long term, and not for everyone.

I do, however, think it is very strange and quite miserable that some people think it is "entitled" to expect occasional help from GPs in an emergency or, God forbid, to allow them the odd night out. I can't imagine becoming so selfish and distant from my adult children that I wouldn't want to make their lives a bit easier from time to time.

Tip of the iceberg, let me assure you.
Something will have to give. Thanks for your sympathy

@Stickonstarsfrustrating.

It's fair and made my point quickly and effectively.

You certainly noticed it 😊

Look, I’m all for acknowledging women as an unpaid resource, but that’s a gas 😂

I was under no illusion my parents would help. DF pretty much ignored me growing up & was/is only interested in DB & his DC. DM was SAHM & didn't do anything for us (recently said it 'never crossed her mind to know where we were/take us anywhere'). So I knew she wouldn't ever skip her social outings or tv programmes to help, even in an emergency. If she did, you'd hear about it for months.

MIL did help sometimes. We didn't have a great relationship, but I appreciated it. IL's always turned up for things, too, like DS's primary school graduation (DM didn't want to skip her walking group). DM used to whine that the DC went to MIL if they were both in the same room. When MIL died DS was distraught as he'd spent a lot of time with her. He barely acknowledges my parents as he doesn't know them well. DM also complains we don't take her on holidays like her friend's DC do. I now, gently, tell her why. You reap what you sow.

We've done it alone. We are missing the free work dinner 'thank you' next week because we have zero childcare. I was always jealous of a friend whose MIL - that ran a business - dropped everything to help, had the kids almost half the time, took them to activites, paid for everything, because my SAHM friend was tired & needed a break (kids both in school).

Agree.

I think it is entitled to “expect” support, but also think it is lovely when it is offered and enjoyed. But I absolutely think that elderly parents who need help and have given children should in turn be helped.

"I think women are resources to be used up like a worn out dishrag and I'm pretending not to understand the problem with demanding their free labour till they drop dead"

Fixed your title for you.

I know, it annoys me most days.
We’ve had the talk many times and it’s a loooong marriage rocking conversation with my husband who is absolutely devoted to her. She’s not a bad person - very pleasant, but too flustered and risk adverse to help with practically anything.

It’s not a transactional competition it’s just how things pan out for obvious reasons. It’s normal to invest in relationships & for there to be give & take.

One of my friends moved to Yorkshire, the main reasons were house prices & to be closer to one set of gps. I still see her mum as she lives locally & all she does is moan that her daughter abandoned her & can’t take her to appointments & how lucky my mum is to have her dc close by. She never even did one evening of babysitting or helped them
financially in any way despite having the means. Of course my friend can’t take days off work & drive down to London to take her to the GP & why should she.

My parents live over 200 miles away, my MIL died when eldest DC was very young so we’ve had zero help on a day to day basis. Am I bitter about it? I was, I’m not now though. It was the little things that frustrated me and people claiming to have no help but in the next sentence saying they were going out with their partner that weekend. In many ways the hardest thing was the strain it put on our marriage in the sense we could never go out for dinner and even just have a few hours away. We made that work though and now they’re old enough to be left for a while we can do some of those things.

My DC going to nursery never bothered me, they loved it and going to school wasn’t even a minor step for them. It was more the lack of understanding of things. So for example if you’re out and need to go the toilet you have to take the pram with you but if you’re with a parent they look after it. Those sort of unseen things that people with a lot of help just don’t understand.

For me it’s not black and white that people seem to think.

My parents have no interest in helping, even in emergencies. I remember when my son had chicken pox mostly scabbed over and back to normal. I asked my parents if they could watch him that day as he still couldn’t go back to nursery. They said no as they had planned to paint the bedroom (they are retired and could do this any day). That’s really stung and I have various stories like this that I never ask them for anything now.

They also went 4-5 months without seeing my kids last year even though they could have.

For me it’s not a lack of childcare or helping. It’s a lack of interest in my children. It’s stings.

My PIL live too far away to provide childcare but they make more of an effort to visit/ video call etc. They seem excited to visit and I have no resentment towards my PIL but I do my own parents. Regardless if someone does childcare it’s about showing an interest in your child and wanting to help them of you are able.

Expecting grandparents to do as they’re told?! We’ve crossed wires here.
I’m talking about grandparents being willing to help in the same way they themselves might have received help.

@Stickonstarswhy on earth are you staying close to your MIL, you need to move.

I do live close to both gps but we had help with deposit & gps are actively involved so we want to
stay close.

I think there is a middle ground. I'm the GP in this scenario. I do loads of care for my GC. I love them and although it's exhausting, I choose to do it.

As long as the attitude of the parents is gratitude all is fine. But as soon as expectation or entitlement creeps in, they are on a dangerously slippery slope. I'm not obliged to do what I do so I do expect that if for any reason (doctors, occasional times when I can't do it) I'm not available, I won't tolerate whingeing or complaining. There HAS occasionally been a bit of that and I bite back at it.

Fortunately, of late, everything has been fine.

I just think it’s a really sad state of affairs when grandparents who are able to, choose not to help, or “don’t want to be grandparents” - Wtf is that about?!
I totally understand that I am so privileged that both my parents and my husband’s parents were retired and totally willing to look after our young children whilst we worked, for a couple of days a week. They also would drop everything if we needed them (and still would now). And now the shoe is on the other foot slightly, and as they get older, we do everything we can for them. Because we’re family and that’s surely what we do for each other?

Some people have gps that are both involved

But when a couple plan to conceive do they include their parents in the decision or just have whatever babies they want and expect grandparents to do as they are told

I know. We never take it for granted. Sadly no grandfathers on either side. DH dad died and mine buggered off before I was born.
Sad for the kids as our grandfathers were amazing

You’re so lucky

Both my mum and MIL are brilliant. Both have very close relationships with our children, as our grans had with us.
I was more than happy to pay for FT nursery but both insisted they wanted to do a day each. If they ever had anything come up (rarely) they would swap with each other or let us know so we could sort an extra childcare day. It was never an issue. And they covered all illness if they couldn’t go to school (obviously nothing that requires A&E or an emergency appointment, we haven’t had any of that).
This was pretty much the same arrangement we had when we were small with our grans.
We will be on hand to help them too as they get older. MIL is 10 years older than my mum but still very fit and active fortunately.

Many families model this though, my gps helped out when I was a dc so I grew up thinking it was normal & that my parents would be involved with my dc. I also expected my DH to be a hands on father because my dad was, I don’t see as entitled.

I also grew up seeing my parents help my gps as they got older and I do the same now for my parents. I don’t think they are entitled for expecting family to pitch in.

I'm 54 and have grandchildren ranging from 17 to 1. By the time I'm officially old enough to retire they will be grown up or nearly so

And I was looking after my own kids from 1991 until DS went to uni in 2022. That's a long enough stretch of childcare for a bit thanks

I do find that grandparents help out less these days. I don’t begrudge them for it, but it would just be nicer if were a little more there for each other.

My grandparents helped with caring a lot more than either of my child’s grandparents. They haven’t even baby sat. I’ve asked my MIL (70s) and she just got flustered and made excuses why she couldn’t. Yet, I pay the premium on living in a small house in an expensive part of UK so that we live by my MIL in case she needs anything. (desperate to move away for more room)

On another thread, it was pointed out to me that there is a generational difference, in that grandparents today may both work FT in careers, whereas, before when I was a child most families survived on the father’s salary - so the grandmother was freer to help.
Plus people are having kids later because they’re broke, which means the grandparents may feel too old. I think they’re fair points that make the situation different today.

Neither of my child’s grandmother’s worked in 9-5 salaried careers, but culturally, there has been a shift and they just don’t seem eager to help.

It feels to me like this generation of new mothers are sandwiched between work, children, no family support and caring for elders, all at the same time. I know I’m not the only one. Many of my friends are in a similar position.

While I don’t believe it’s tit for tat, there has to be some acknowledgment that people are living longer these days and grandparents may need that help they are perhaps reluctant to give to the children or grandchildren. It can’t just be one sided.