AIBU to consider leaving our knitting group over its new policy?

It’s just that trans women are men, and men in the whole love a bit of mansplaining.

You seem to have missed the key point that transwomen are men.

The op likes it as a women only group. She thinks changing that to mixed sex, whether by advertising to invite transwomen, or other means, would not suit her.

She's allowed to feel that. She's allowed to leave.

Contrary to some on this thread, she is also allowed to set up a new women only group if she wants to.

Men’s Shed isn’t a hobby group, it’s a medical charity specifically for mental health to counter isolation and loneliness because men are at higher risk of suicide. The correct comparison to men’s shed is a rape center for women or a breastfeeeding support group for women,

Insist on it being put to the vote.

it’s very likely than many others quietly agree with you.

that will hopefully put an end to it.

ask how she’s going to get around EHRC guidance without opening it up to all men as well?

if that fails go back to inviting your friends to your house.

OP you are getting a hard time here from people who woefully do not understand the law . Come over to the feminism forum and ask there if you like .

But for the benefit of those giving opinions which don’t reflect the law.

An association with rules eg a subscription of more than 25 members has to follow the Equality Act.

If you are currently a single sex association you take advantage of the single sex exemption. Transwomen are men and can’t join a single sex association for women . They can join a mixed association open to all men and women .

Your new Chair would not be complying with the law wanting an association of more than 25 people for women and transwomen and not others .

The committee could be sued for unlawful discrimination by any man who wanted to join what would now be a mixed group. Any woman suffering a detriment, perhaps someone who has suffered SA or DV could also sue for indirect discrimination. Other women could too, but given it’s knitting and not somewhere where you might undress or be in a vulnerable position or state this might be harder to show though I take your point about men affecting the dynamics.

Tell the Chair and committee they would be putting themselves at great risk for being sued . That should quash any notion.

I’m in a women’s knitting group. It started as just a group of friends and extended from there. We meet twice weekly in an hall that has to be booked and paid for and go on trips etc so it has become more formal over time and has a treasurer, secretary, social secretary etc. I and two other friends were founder members but we take a back seat in the organisation now. We attract lots of younger members (30-somethings!) which is great. I (early 60s) love socialising with people, hearing their views etc.

The new chairman (woman) has recently decided that we should announce that we are ‘trans friendly’ and try to attract trans women and non-binary people. Apart from the fact that I don’t know what non-binary people are other than people who don’t sign up to gender stereotypes (most of the women currently in the group don’t go in for nails / make up / fake tan etc anyway so what’s the difference?) I don’t want men in the group, trans identifying or otherwise. I’ve been sexually assaulted a few times in my lifetime, as has another of the founder members. We’ve also always appreciated having a space away from the male gaze and voice, where women can have their voice centre stage for once. I know a number of the current members are also extremely concerned about this new push and would feel pushed out too if any men join.

I have no desire to ‘out’ myself as a ‘TERF’ by complaining or pushing back as it would in their eyes make me a ‘bad’ person and I always try to do good by everyone. I just disagree wholeheartedly with the idea that men should be treated as women because they say so. It seems so seething misogynistic. I’m deeply sad about the whole situation and think I’m going to have to leave the club, because the current chairman seems to stand for things that I don’t. I appreciate women’s rights and they don’t seem to give a fig. What do politics have to do with knitting? Do I just leave? Do I wait and see whether any men try to join before leaving? I can’t be arsed to fight back even though I would have a LOT of (currently silent) supporters.

I don’t blame you - to be honest I don’t want men in my sewing group trans or otherwise! They can go off and do their own stuff !

Is the new chair(wo)man Jackie Weaver?

Why is this the same thing? White people are white people, black people are black people these are objective facts. TW are not women so your argument is a false equivalency isn’t it? Unless you think it would be ok for a white person to identify as a black person and make changes to their appearance that they feel would allow them to ‘pass’ as black? And then to self identify into groups/award/opportunities that had been created specifically to meet the needs of black people.

I'm not talking legality. I'm saying: why would you bother opening it to only some men? You may as well let them all in. Either go unisex, or keep it to actual women only.

This isn't right I think. It's legal to open a group to two sets of protected characteristics (sex plus gender reassignment) otherwise LGBT groups wouldn't be allowed (sexuality plus gender reassignment).

Is there likely to be a population of trans knitters where you live? It's quite a niche. If transpeople account for 0.55% of the population and some of those will be transmen then the likelyhood of a transwoman knitter signing up to your group doesn't sound very high.

I’m in a women’s knitting group. It started as just a group of friends and extended from there. We meet twice weekly in an hall that has to be booked and paid for and go on trips etc so it has become more formal over time and has a treasurer, secretary, social secretary etc. I and two other friends were founder members but we take a back seat in the organisation now. We attract lots of younger members (30-somethings!) which is great. I (early 60s) love socialising with people, hearing their views etc.

The new chairman (woman) has recently decided that we should announce that we are ‘trans friendly’ and try to attract trans women and non-binary people. Apart from the fact that I don’t know what non-binary people are other than people who don’t sign up to gender stereotypes (most of the women currently in the group don’t go in for nails / make up / fake tan etc anyway so what’s the difference?) I don’t want men in the group, trans identifying or otherwise. I’ve been sexually assaulted a few times in my lifetime, as has another of the founder members. We’ve also always appreciated having a space away from the male gaze and voice, where women can have their voice centre stage for once. I know a number of the current members are also extremely concerned about this new push and would feel pushed out too if any men join.

I have no desire to ‘out’ myself as a ‘TERF’ by complaining or pushing back as it would in their eyes make me a ‘bad’ person and I always try to do good by everyone. I just disagree wholeheartedly with the idea that men should be treated as women because they say so. It seems so seething misogynistic. I’m deeply sad about the whole situation and think I’m going to have to leave the club, because the current chairman seems to stand for things that I don’t. I appreciate women’s rights and they don’t seem to give a fig. What do politics have to do with knitting? Do I just leave? Do I wait and see whether any men try to join before leaving? I can’t be arsed to fight back even though I would have a LOT of (currently silent) supporters.