AIBU to consider leaving our knitting group over its new policy?

The chair either knows a specific transwoman who wants to join, or, more likely, is just virtue signalling.

Some people just cannot leave their politics at the door.

I don’t think this problem is true, I think it’s invented to scream TERF views into the MN obsessed echo chamber. Cringe.

This! In spades!!

Do men who want to knit, of whatever 'gender identity', ever think about setting up their own groups? Maybe there's just not enough interest.

@NullaEffugium king George V1 was a keen embroiderer. He made a full set of chair covers. They are incredibly intricate!

Exactly. So the steps would be for @Solentseeker to say that we need to have a vote on changing it to a mixed sex group, and to change the name if it explicitly says women in the name, this isn't entirely clear.

And depending on the vote, which should be anonymous, @Solentseeker can then set up a women's group or not. I imagine it would be pretty popular if she did.

Be fair - the OP has said repeatedly that she's absolutely fine with transmen joining, and women who self-identify as non binary. She says she knows numerous transmen through her daughter's friendships.

It's the men wanting to present as women she has an issue with.

I agree knitting isn’t a ‘lady thing’. So a man who wants to knit can join a mixed knitting group, can’t he? The sort of chap who thinks ‘no actually - I want to badger a women’s group to let me in, because I identify as a woman’ is not respectful of the existing boundaries set by the group ie the original founders wanted it to be women only.

It’s not like football where you need 22 players. Anyone who wants a mixed sex group can set one up & see who else wants to come. Some women might happily join both.

Or, as above, a group where a majority want to change the rules can reasonably do so & those who don’t like it can break away.

You just can’t have a women’s group & let certain men in because of their special feelings.

Which is both OP’s point & the legal position.

I don't know how she intends to market the group specifically to trans people? In most areas of the UK they really are very few and far between.

Surely it should just be that she wants more people to join, and that it could be open to both sexes?

There should be a vote on allowing it to stop being women only.

It's true the women could split off and form their own single sex group but that seems unfair as the founding and core membership. But I guess if some vote against it they might do.

What is she ignorant about?

It's because trans women are as much of a threat to women as any other man. Op didn't mention wanting to exclude lesbians so I imagine she's quite happy to include them as they are women. If a trans man wanted to join they are also not a threat. If it was going to change to a uni sex group then women could make a choice whether it's an acceptable risk to include men in the group

Same reason there are 'women only' sports and work out groups - some women don't want to be surrounded by men. Women are allowed to have their own spaces! Same way Men are allowed to have men only football teams

The poster you were responding to specifically said that they feel anyone female, including trans men, should be welcome. So it's not about trans people not being welcome, it's about males not being welcome.

In response, you quite clearly forgot trans men even existed, because you ranted about how 'trans people' were just all 'men in women face' to 'terfs', completely ignoring what the poster actually said. Very transphobic of you.

(And misogynistic in my opinion, but that's by the by.)

I have a son and I would not want him thinking he's entitled to be in women's spaces for any reason. Committing crimes is completely irrelevant, not all trans women are criminals - the point is that they're all men. Women are allowed to have things just for themselves and that is ok. It's not 'avoiding' men, it's not divisive and it shouldn't be problematic.

Women are legally allowed their own spaces without any type of man in them:

Private vs. Public Status: Under legislation like the Equality Act 2010, private, non-profit clubs that have a distinct selection process and limit benefits strictly to members are generally exempt from sex discrimination laws when it comes to club membership.
No Essential Exclusion: Gender-exclusive spaces are widely accepted if there are equivalent options available for both genders, and if the exclusivity doesn't prevent either gender from accessing essential employment, education, or public functions.

You misunderstand. It is not that knitting is a 'lady thing. It is that being present in a women-only hobby group is a 'lady thing'.

If a man wants to knit socially, he can start his own group. Or the women's group can vote to include men. But they can't vote to include transwomen but continue excluding other men.

Are you really, genuinely ignorant of the way that (some) transwomen want to join women-only groups purely for validation? And that they are not interested in mixed-sex groups because there is no validation to be had there?

I said the post sounded hysterical not you.

Womanface is like blackface, both unacceptable imo but you are welcome to disagree.

Yes, and it needs to be an anonymous vote, not hands up, as we know how that goes.

The group should have a vote on this I agree.

There are not the issues that come with say the Ladies Pond or competitive sport, however it does change the nature of the group.

The group is shitting itself over the idea of a trans women joining (women facing, pretending to be a women whatever you want to call it). So that is clearly what we are adressing as its a women knit group....

If I am making orange juice, I only want oranges. A banana that identifies as an orange is not acceptable. I would exclude all yellow fruit, yes.

'Woman-face' is gross to many women. Just as 'black-face' is gross and now (thankfully) totally socially unacceptable.

What she doesn’t want is to be put in a position where she’s supposed to applaud some bloke having a lovely, validating time being in a ladies group because he is a lady doing lady things with other ladies

That's your take on it though, and prejudice showing - wanting to exclude just because you think "only doing it for wanting a lovely validating time doing lady things with other ladies"

Others think that's a load of crap. How about it's just another person wanting to do a craft they enjoy with others?
As for knitting only being "a lady thing" - that's a very outdated attitude. The 50s are calling and want you back ..

I haven't read the full thread

But that's what happens when groups get to big ..the strongest personalities take over and set the pace .
Just quietly invite a few of the original group,or whoever you like to coffee at your house ,and do some knitting together,then next week do the same .
Your house ,your rules ,then just quietly step back from the larger group
No drama ,you do as you please in your own home

They could start their own "trans knit" group. But no, these men who masquerade as women need the validation of being in a woman's group, it is essential.

That’s because the claims of sympathy and understanding are mere surface politeness due to fear of being bullied by aggressive men trying to invade women’s space. It’s obvious when you look at it logically, that the lack of evidence = evidence.