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Original poster

Are these people really British?

237 replies

glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 14:07

In 1688, foreign strangers were arriving on British shores daily. The locals complained of despoilment of their environment. Londoners complained that French was everywhere, and not a word of English could be heard spoken! The French immigrants were denigrated either for being too poor, thus a drain on rate-paying parishioners, or too prosperous, at the expense of local merchants and business owners.

(Taken from Thou Savage Woman by Blessin Adams, great book!)

That sounds exactly like what I hear the media saying about immigrants now! So when the far right are making sure that Britain is for the British, shall they make sure we all trace our lineage back to the 1600s, and make sure no descendents of those awful French immigrants count as British?

OP posts:
Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:57

glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:56

The first one isn't necessarily for financial gain either

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It is. Couples always pick the better financially. Let's not play naive to that. Would be pretty weird to move to country where you will be financially less stable than in the other. Takes quite some counting though sometimes!

IcedPurple · 21/07/2026 16:56

Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:45

Sorry but ehy do you think people move countries? Most people don't do it just "cause I fancy it". It is for personal gain. Usually financial. There is also some adventure benefit thrown in, but no one I know emigrates just because of the adventure unless it benefits them in other way. Finance, language, work experience. I should add safety or better quality of life too.

Edited
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I agree.

You do sometimes hear of people heading off overseas for 'an adventure' or 'to see the world' but this is very much a first world privilege. And it's usually a youthful indulgence too.

The vast majority of people emigrate for pragmatic reasons. Usually to enjoy a material standard of living which would be unavailable to them in their home countries. This is why emigration is nearly always from poorer countries to richer countries. You don't hear of too many people setting off to build a new life in the Philippines or Nigeria.

Original poster
glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:56

Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:55

Fair enough. At least the middle one isn't financial gain. Still personal one, but I accept that one

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The first one isn't necessarily for financial gain either

OP posts:
SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:55

KatiePricesKnickers · 21/07/2026 16:55

How do they survive for 5 years with no benefits?
Foraging for food in the woods?

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They eat swans and catz and dogz

KatiePricesKnickers · 21/07/2026 16:55

aliasfrog · 21/07/2026 16:06

Hello, illegal immigrants can't claim benefits. I know because I am a benefit assessor. You can only claim if you have indefinite leave to remain as an immigrant which takes minimum 5 years of living and working here plus thousands of ££ spent on the visas and nhs surcharge.

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How do they survive for 5 years with no benefits?
Foraging for food in the woods?

Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:55

glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:50

Some people move because of being in a relationship with someone from another country, some people move because they are gay and want to live somewhere that is more accepted, some move for a different way of life

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Fair enough. At least the middle one isn't financial gain. Still personal one, but I accept that one

SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:55

IcedPurple · 21/07/2026 16:53

I'm not sitting through all that!

They were 'Commonwealth citizens'. Not 'British citizens'.

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But as you don't know, that is not (a) the law and (b) not what Enoch said.

I had no truck with his views. However they are perfectly articulated (unlike this thread). Which is why they are open for debate.

E2A: More spelling

SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:53

AuntieBiotics · 21/07/2026 16:52

You should read some of the stuff written about the Irish immigrants in Liverpool/Glasgow in the late 1840s.

You could alternate it with tales of what the English did to the Irish since whenever. Although given the obsession with the early modern period, start with Oliver Cromwell.

IcedPurple · 21/07/2026 16:53

SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:44

Actually they were British Subjects. And that was the whole problem.

Damn, more facts.

Here's Enoch Powell explaining it.

E2A: Spelling

Edited
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I'm not sitting through all that!

They were 'Commonwealth citizens'. Not 'British citizens'.

Persephonia1966 · 21/07/2026 16:53

And a century late there were there Gordon riots largely triggered by the fear that Catholicism was incompatible with British values and a general suspicion Catholics were by their nature, drawn to authoritarian governments and would undermine the UK from within if given too much privilege.
I can't imagine anyone saying that about religions today.

AuntieBiotics · 21/07/2026 16:52

You should read some of the stuff written about the Irish immigrants in Liverpool/Glasgow in the late 1840s.

Original poster
glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:50

Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:48

So what do you think are reasons to emigrate somewhere which are not personal gain.
Fo you think people move to make less money or have worse life?

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Some people move because of being in a relationship with someone from another country, some people move because they are gay and want to live somewhere that is more accepted, some move for a different way of life

OP posts:
Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:48

glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:47

You said most, not all

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So what do you think are reasons to emigrate somewhere which are not personal gain.
Fo you think people move to make less money or have worse life?

Original poster
glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:47

Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:45

Sorry but ehy do you think people move countries? Most people don't do it just "cause I fancy it". It is for personal gain. Usually financial. There is also some adventure benefit thrown in, but no one I know emigrates just because of the adventure unless it benefits them in other way. Finance, language, work experience. I should add safety or better quality of life too.

Edited
Show quote history

You said most, not all

OP posts:
Notsodisney · 21/07/2026 16:45

glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 15:32

I think it's really sad to have such an opinion of immigrants

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Sorry but ehy do you think people move countries? Most people don't do it just "cause I fancy it". It is for personal gain. Usually financial. There is also some adventure benefit thrown in, but no one I know emigrates just because of the adventure unless it benefits them in other way. Finance, language, work experience. I should add safety or better quality of life too.

SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:44

IcedPurple · 21/07/2026 16:41

Before the EU Britain was part of and led the commonwealth and most people who lived in commonwealth countries were British.

That's not true at all.

People in pre-independence India, Ghana etc. were subjects of the Crown but they were not British citizens, because they were not British.

Show quote history

Actually they were British Subjects. And that was the whole problem.

Damn, more facts.

Here's Enoch Powell explaining it.

E2A: Spelling

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

https://youtu.be/L7Zfvcb3mWI

Naunet · 21/07/2026 16:43

ThaneOfGlamis · 21/07/2026 16:40

I think that people have been unhappy about similar issues since there were humans. We out competed the neanderthals to start. Then the older group of Europeans were replaced by those with lactose tolerance from around five thousand years ago. I would say fear of mass migration is hard coded.

I would argue its more about protecting our resources, something that almost every animal does. Its perfectly natural, a simple survival instinct.

IcedPurple · 21/07/2026 16:41

Octavia64 · 21/07/2026 15:17

Before the EU Britain was part of and led the commonwealth and most people who lived in commonwealth countries were British. So prior to the Second World War there were British people all over the world - India, Hong Kong, Ghana, parts of the Carribean etc. these British people had (largely) freedom of movement within the empire.

nobody held referendums on the British Empire but then nobody asked the people who lived in the countries that were occupied/colonised either.

you’d have to go back almost so the sixteenth century to have a time where British people were only in the British isles.

Before the EU Britain was part of and led the commonwealth and most people who lived in commonwealth countries were British.

That's not true at all.

People in pre-independence India, Ghana etc. were subjects of the Crown but they were not British citizens, because they were not British.

SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:40

Ethelspagetti · 21/07/2026 16:33

Yes that’s right. They get the right to stay then we help them apply for benefits with UC sometimes PIP. I know this because I’m a translator and help them apply.

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I think we've all had enough of experts.

JimBobsWife · 21/07/2026 16:40

SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:39

Non answer noted for the thread.

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It’s not a non answer. You just don’t like it because you didn’t like my first answer.

ThaneOfGlamis · 21/07/2026 16:40

I think that people have been unhappy about similar issues since there were humans. We out competed the neanderthals to start. Then the older group of Europeans were replaced by those with lactose tolerance from around five thousand years ago. I would say fear of mass migration is hard coded.

MyDarlingRose · 21/07/2026 16:40

British = person with British citizenship. Their heritage can be African, French, Asian, American, Chinese…. Their citizenship is what makes them British.

Original poster
glitterpaperchain · 21/07/2026 16:39

Ethelspagetti · 21/07/2026 16:33

Yes that’s right. They get the right to stay then we help them apply for benefits with UC sometimes PIP. I know this because I’m a translator and help them apply.

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Key part of this being 'they get the right to stay'

OP posts:
SerendipityJane · 21/07/2026 16:39

JimBobsWife · 21/07/2026 16:17

Populations across sub-Saharan Africa hold significantly higher and deeper genetic diversity. Despite migration figures being high, people born in central, southern and eastern England form a fairly uniform genetic cluster.

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Non answer noted for the thread.

Verv · 21/07/2026 16:38

Im all for a bit of Protestant immigration.
Would make a nice change and everyone loves a bit of retro.

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