Autism vs trans - clashing views

Well I’m autistic, but I mask well, I am also very polite and the polite thing for your DS to do in this situation is to call the trans child by their current chosen name & refer to them by their current chosen gender.

Explain to DS that in social situations; politeness often has to win over bluntness or what he sees as honesty. Basically little white lies are often acceptable.
To avoid causing huge upset & offence to the individual he is addressing; to keep friends, & to avoid him from being bullied for any perceived rudeness or bad behaviour.
It will be difficult for DS to initially understand / accept this viewpoint but he will find it a lot easier to function in society going forward if he does.

Sadly when you are autistic you can’t always be your true self in this world; there is a lot of hate for neurodivergence.

My personal beliefs on the trans situation are live & let live.. I have a couple of trans friends & it’s all good.
But obviously a lot of others feel strongly in the opposite way.
I just think that at school.. as a fellow pupil you should never decide to upset or cause hurt when it can be avoided. That principle should be more important than ‘being right / honest (in your DS’s view) I think.

I was being ironic by flipping the confession over.

Two autistic children not understanding eachother. Hardly news. Your son is correct

When I’m talking to someone I never use their pronouns anyway, if I want to avoid it in conversations with others I just use their name.

A couple of years ago now DD11’s end of year school report gave her 1/5 for kindness. I mean we found it hilarious as she’s very matter of fact. I did laugh and ask her if she could try and be a little bit kinder at school. She said that they’re always told that they’re perfect as they are at school so why should she change something about herself if she’s already perfect and that she’s kind to the people she cares about - even if it isn’t that many. I thought it was a fair point actually as how many posters do you get on MN that prioritise every fucker but themselves and struggle to say no due to being people pleasers at great detriment to themselves. School have had her looking after the younger FS/Y1 children and she is very kind to them as she says they need more help than someone who’s crying because they don’t want to be ‘on’ at tiggy.

So no, I let her choose what she thinks is appropriate and try to talk through the other persons point of view so she is more well rounded and can think about it herself. If I told her to be something she is not I don’t think it would be good for her inner confidence and would make her more stubborn. She’s a strange one but very entertaining.

These have been well-documented regularly seen responses to women suggesting that a male person putting on a skirt has not become female. I am sure we have the screenshots if you haven't seen them. I don't expect this child who is OP's DS's classmate has done anything quite so vile but does need to learn that expecting 29 other children to deny the reality in front of their eyes and pretend they don't see what they see is very unkind. A girl can have a short haircut and wear trousers and use the name George. This has been happening for many decades - it was hardly a new phenomenon when Enid Blyton wrote the Famous Five books in the 1940s. But children who want to do these things need to understand that their control and rights and autonomy only extend to their own body and do not reach inside the heads of their classmates.

I have no idea. I've never said anything like this? Maybe you have be confused with another poster, though honestly, if someone is saying those things I'd report it.

Yanbu. Life is difficult enough for your son to navigate without pressuring him to learn to lie.

Encourage him to try to avoid using any 3rd person pronouns in the presence of this kid. Use their name instead of a pronoun, or make the sentence about several children so that plural They applies.

Nb at some point tackle his mistaken belief that the valid reality of sex could disappear with surgery. There is no surgery that makes a male into a female or vice versa. Male or female sex is encoded into every single one of the 30 trillion cells in the human body. A male body that has had cosmetic surgery is still a male body even if it is missing a bit. A female body that has had cosmetic surgery is still a female body even if it has an extra bit grafted on. Nevertheless it's important that your son should respect the classmate's choice to use a new name and to follow different sexist stereotypes than the ones that society expects for their birth-sex - but your son does not have to believe they have actually changed sex or pretend that he believes it by using wrong-sex pronouns.

So where does the calls for beheading, die in grease fire, and so on infinitum come from then? If the “be kind” is reciprocal?

I don’t think that ever is something that would be taken into consideration @peaceatnight !
From the posters on here and in general life who support this ideology “bekind” is always a one way street!

I think most parents encourage their dc to be kind to everyone, don't they? Regardless of your beliefs, we're talking about kids here!

Does this work the other way around too? Do you teach the trans identified kids to be kind and friendly to the kids who don't remember their preferred pronouns?

I agree that the factors relating children' mental health are complex and multifaceted. Amongst those factors will be about acceptance, social cohesien and identity. My original statement still stands <<I think I would be teaching my children, autistic or not,to be kind and friendly. >>

Not true.
Extremely harmful frequently rolled-out transactivist trope.

Any risks of suicide are related to multiple possible underlying factors which are what led to the gender questioning of the child in the first place; and/or being groomed on line to say they will kill themselves if they are not affirmed.

Harressment - so he isn’t be harnessed to call someone something they are not?

respect goes both ways

“In general life you can speak how you like.”

No you can’t. Harassment and hate speech have repercussions.

Usually when a child has had severe mental health or behavioural
issues in the past, and this is now lauded as the reason for it. Accept it or you’re bigoted is their way of forcing everyone else to accept change except where it’s actually needed.

I never said that there is.
I specifically said that nobody can be compelled to use wrong sexed pronouns which is why the compromise of using the chosen name is the correct way forward for all

Well said @peaceatnight

This is incorrect

autistic children are at a higher risk and once you normalise for this - ie account for the fact that many trans children are also autistic- then the disgusting and inaccurate suicide argument is easily proven to be false

however people exploring their gender in online communities ( I have been there ) are encouraged to think and talk about suicide ideation against all the principles and guidelines of organisationS helping to prevent suicide

This is exactly why the trans movement
has been so morally repugnant in telling kids that their mental health depends on other people using their ‘chosen pronouns’ and respecting their ‘chosen identity’. Making yourself hostage to what every individual you meet thinks about you is a highway to zero resilience and dreadful MH.

All the data points to vulnerable children being disproportionately likely to claim trans identities. The way the ideology is marketed ‘ affirm me or I’ll die’ is cruel, wrong and dangerously irresponsible.

Every adult who has endorsed and supported this child harming movement needs to reflect on this.

This movement has been marketed to suit adult agendas, not vulnerable children’s needs. There are adults with settled gender dysphoria who chose to manage those feelings without transitioning. Why do you think the trans movement never platforms or promotes their views and stories? If they cared about trans kids and adults, they would, right? After all, Learning to manage those feelings without lifelong medication and surgery and all the life long and often severe side effects of that is absolutely the best outcome, hands down.

But this is never even presented by the trans movement as an option. Because the trans movement is not about the individual and what is best for them, it’s about shoring up the ideology. Despite the harm that causes.

This is incorrect. You misunderstand what they protected characteristic means.

The protected characteristic is undergoing transition. You cannot be fired or discriminated against when it comes to housing or things that that due to under going transition.

There is no obligation to go along with preferred pronouns.

I just looked and it is quite easy to find cases where people have got into trouble for refusing to use people’s preferred pronouns. Eg This man who lost his tribunal:

https://www.bmj.com/content/367/bmj.l5925

I imagine/guess you’ll be fine if you avoid he/she and use they or you. But I’m no expert.

Trans children/ adults are at significantly higher risk of suicide . I think I would be teaching my children, autistic or not,to be kind and friendly. I dont think we should leave it to school kids to sort out a human rights act.

Your DS isn't wrong. My DC is AuDHD and continued to call friends by their given name after they announced they were now the opposite sex.

One is a real activist and has a go at DC for disrespecting them by still calling them Sue and not Bob. DC explained that due to their AuDHD they just can't retain info and Sue is Sue. (By the time they leave school, Sue has dropped Bob and reverted to Sue again, as did 99% of the girls who claimed they were a boy).

DC is fully aware that a person cannot change sex.