To refuse to lend DS £1,200 when he's still booked to go on holiday?

No way would I lend him money. If the children needed food I would buy it for them. I definitely wouldn’t encourage his selfishness.
What are his GF health problems. Is there no wfh type of job she could do.
Even supermarket shelf stocking overnight is an option. Sometimes there are options if they look hard enough, or is it easier just to rely on others to support.

You would be wise to refuse. Accepting would encourage him to believe bad behaviour works.

Why and how do they know this? If you are so flush that you have £100 to spend on nails each month why would they need to even consider looking at anyone else’s money?

Plenty of teenage or young adult children don’t understand what people really have and if they see someone else has a job, a home a holiday a year they somehow come to the conclusion that they must also have enough to pay for someone else to do the same. Adults also seem to do the same looking at mumsnet with people saying to just give money/ pay deposits, help children move out and pay rent. £1200 is a ton of money to give or loan to two people who don’t work by choice and are not likely to be working. How did they get in that much debt when on benefits with the son living at home? Blackmailing his mother with pay per view is a shitty thing to do. It would be one thing helping them out with bits, paying for stuff for kids or treats if they showed they were actually fucking trying themselves. Plenty of people would take a year or more to save 1200 why should they loan or give it to someone else who is making choices they wouldn’t make?

There’s another thread going about why offer 30 hours to non-working parents and you can see in this situation how desperately disadvantaged children like this are, with irresponsible parents having child after child, not able to manage money, putting themselves first. So depressing.

You are inventing a dept that only ever gets paid in cash. Parents can regret mistakes without being financially extorted by their adult children.

You have no idea whether he will become a good father or a good partner and you certainly don’t know that lending him £1200 will make it happen. People grow up by facing consequences. Not by learning that threatening their parents get them something they want.

Good for you, but your personal spending habits are completely irrelevant. And Emergency fund money is not spare cash. So your advice is to reward emotional blackmail. Manipulative behaviour should not be encouraged .

I feel for you, OP, that’s not a situation anyone would want for their DC. Regardless, I wouldn’t lend the money - it’s a holiday and if he couldn’t have afforded it then he shouldn’t have booked it. I’m sure he’ll come crawling back when he needs childcare or favours.
He’s a father and needs to earn if his GF can’t work.

He could always get a cheaper holiday in the UK for 3 days so the children don’t miss out . Don’t pay for their holiday , if she is in debt now she’s unlikely to pay you back , maybe she should ask her family!

Why should you give money to pay his girlfriend’s bills at the cost of going without , let them go to citizens advice to get support for managing debt . Maybe they could both get a job and be responsible . I can’t see the relationship lasting tbh . This is reality and if he wants to be a good dad get a job . Don’t feel guilty .

Don't give him the money, it's probably for spending on holiday anyway. I'd say I don't have any money, how does he know you have that much money? Tell him nothing, plead poverty they way they are.

He lost his job for being a prat.
He had repeated warnings about health and safety issues. He kept ignoring them and carried on acting like a prat.
Do you know how important health and safety are in the construction industry?

He lost his carpentery job through laziness and the assumption that he could live off you if fired. I would not give him £1,200 to spend on a holiday, (particularly if he used the nauseating expression 'making memories').

He'll never have to grow up and try to keep a job if you keep giving him money.

Obviously stick to your decision and don’t lend him the money. He’s been running rings round you for a very long time. He thinks you’re a soft touch, you must lay down some boundaries and don’t let him use the children to blackmail you. I’m wondering if it has ever been suggested that he has ADHD? Or some other underlying behavioural issues?

oh its so easy for people on here to give advice when not in the situation, especially without any kids of this age. This is a bloody shitty age for sure, letting the make their own choices and mistakes and trying not to step in and parent to much is really challenging. Not to mention they turn 18 and suddenly think they're an adult but with no life experience or clue of the responsibility. Push too hard and risk loosing them, don't push hard enough and watch them screw up badly - its a nightmare!!!

my inital concerns here are the situation with the GF, he was 15 and she was 22 and she got pg!!!..... this is a huge red flag here which i think people are overlooking as she is the older party, why on earth did school not follow up on safeguarding here? were the police ever contacted?

Maybe have a sit down conversation with them, let them know you'll always be there for him and your grandchild, however you're not a financial support option for them and shouldnt be made to feel guilty for that. They need to establish a better arrangement for living so that he can be a full time parent and partner, they also should speak with citizens advice to work out what benefits they're entitled to and possibly job centre for him as well.

supporting in this way is pretty much all you can do, you cannot be a financial support though as he'll never manage on his own otherwise

'...His gf doesn't work due to a health condition...'

Well, of course she doesn't...🙄

He was 15 when a 21 year old woman slept with him. Perhaps that is a matter for the police?

Why, it's gf debt not ops sons. I also think its going to be for holiday stuff/her cc debt. Let's face it, any person with low enough morals to be having sex with a 15 year old isnt likely to be Mother Teresa in other aspects of their life. I think they just realised how expensive an Italian holiday is going to be.

You see my question is if she’s that poor why does her son think that she has the £1200
My kids know who in the family would have £1200 lying around and who to ask if they wanted it or needed it so clearly this is the opinion his mother has a spare £1200
I didn’t raise this kid, so I won’t be sending my money to him, nor did I allow my 15-year-old to get sexually assaulted so I have no penance to pay.

Lots of could’ve would’ve should’ve in this case isn’t there?

Are you the girlfriend?

But it's not £100 a month is it?
He'll be back for more. He'll keep making stupid decisions and happily watch his mum get into debt.

He will happily use his grandchild as a means to blackmail his mother. Yet isn't bothered enough to live with the child or get a job. Or even keep the job he had.

But by all means, send your manicure money to him. Not everyone has that cash lying around every month FFS.

I am also going to mention ADHD.

As others have said, I wouldn’t lend the money, and would also suggest you get him to move out.

Tough love lessons now I’m afraid.

You need to put your foot down. The more you do for him, the more he expects. If he is the father( l wouldn't be too sure of that) he needs to behave like one, and go and live with the gf. He sounds like he swans about doing whatever he likes when he likes. He should be with his gf, helping with his child, night feeds etc, behaving as a father should. I know it is hard, but you are his biggest enabler. If they have no money for bills, how have they paid for a holiday to Italy? I think the money he wants to "borrow" is for spends for the holiday, not bills. Unless you teach some tough love, he will continue to treat you, the disgusting way he does, nothing will change for the better, it will be worse. As a mother it goes against all our instincts, but he needs to man up, be a father, a full time father, he needs to know his responsibilities, and will only learn by you telling him, he is out. He needs to live with his child, and grow up.

The asking g for money and using the grandchild as weapons won't stop, believe I know. I am now NC with my AC as this went on and no matter what you do it will never be right. If you refuse you are "toxic" if you give in they will play you until you do something else that "ovetsteps their boundaries". Say no now and save yourself the stress, debt and heartache that will inevitably follow. If he's "adult" enough to father a child and play house with this woman then hes adult enough to sort his own finances and learn that holidays don't come before necessary living costs.

What a shitshow.

but what is the 1.2k for specifically? Its an awful lot of money for someone who claims benefits? I would presume its not for rent as that would be subsidised, so what do they need it for? Maybe they have bailiffs at their door? If ask what it’s for specifically and if its a necessity (council tax, rent, utilities) then I’d be asking for their acc reference numbers and paying it in myself. I wouldn’t hand over the money but I would also not just leave them in a mess if it’s essential bills as that could result in nasty consequences and there’s a GC involved.

He needs to become an adult now and move in with his girlfriend and child.