To find colleague’s zen like contentment inspirational?

What do you think succeeding in life means though? If someone has continuously strived in the workplace/capitalist sense for promotions, more money and the lifestyle that comes with it, but is constantly stressed and burnt out and has very little downtime to enjoy the trappings of that lifestyle, are they really more successful than someone who is at a lower level and earns less but is genuinely content and happy, and has more time and freedom to do things that aren’t work?

The more senior roles in my area don't just mean more responsibility, but more hours - both in terms of the extra workload but also being contactable outside off office hours, unofficially and in a formal rota. I wouldn't want that, regardless of the money on offer (and it's not that much, as it's a banding system)

He earns more than enough in his current role, doesn’t think the pay increase is worth the extra work.

Herein lies one of the more challenging societal problems.

My first promotion saw me earning nearly £10 an hour at a time when minimum wage was around £5.50.

I've been promoted three times since and earn around £20 an hour and minimum wage is nearly £13 an hour.

So I was promoted one step and got paid double, but now I'm four levels up and not even earning double. My role hasn't got easier, so now I think why bother going further up? At some point minimum wage will get close enough to my current salary that I can change to a job I'd like to do for less stress (yes, I know I'll get bashed for implying minimum wage jobs are a piece of cake but that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying I've worked in a cafe before and I loved it so why wouldnt I do that if the pay difference was negligible and I might even get tips).

@PermanentTemporaryband 6 is the sweet spot, I heard you get taxed a lot on band 7.

I completely get this - my professional satisfaction is from doing my job well, and also in earning enough to not need to work all the time.

I’m immensely grateful that career-driven people like my bosses exist, so that I can work for them 😝 but I have no desire to bring that stress into my own life, even though I’m now old/senior enough that I could go for a ‘boss’ role. I have been told that my personality type is ‘all about the fun’ and managing people/complaints/finances is definitely not “the fun.”

Pity there’s not more people around like this who have lots of knowledge/experience in their job because they have been doing it a long time.
Generally it seems like lots of people get promoted to their level of incompetence and mess everything up, whilst blaming the people below them.

This is me….im a b6 nurse and have never wanted to go for promotion. I’ve enough money to live on, no kids, almost retired so no mortgage etc. I like seeing patients f2f and zero interest in sitting at the computer or attending meetings all day which is what I’d get at a b7.

I’m like your colleague. I’ve reached the level and salary I want to get to and live a comfortable life on it. It’s not about having no aspirations. I had aspirations in my teens and twenties, I’ve now met them. The only aspirations I have now are in my personal life. Having a happy life with my family is my main priority. Getting a promotion and extra pay, along with stress and longer hours wouldn't bring me more happiness.

That doesn’t sound very zen!

Good for him! I've had many roles in my life in different areas, from delivery girl to senior regional management.

I've settled now in my 40s into a 'one rung up' technical role. The pay is excellent for the level of work required. I work a 3 day week and run a multi child household comfortably on my salary alone.

I've been asked a couple of times to consider applying for my managers job, but why would I take a 5 day week high responsibility job managing people for a net pay increase of about 2000 a year? There lies madness!

Not necessarily wealth, just progression. I’m an academic so not wealthy but I’ve risen from a working class home where nobody completed GCSEs let alone a degree, masters, PhD and postdoc like me. I’m always striving to learn more, progress, shift gears. Some people are satisfied floating along.

Or perhaps his aspiration is to earn enough money and still see his child grow up and have his marriage survive. Most very senior people in any company are a bit of a red flag to be anyway. There are some good eggs, but more are personality disordered than at the lower levels, which is partly why they got into these positions in the first place. Why have the hassle for more money you don't need and less time for non work related stuff. It only makes sense to those who are driven by power and admiration.

I used to have a lady in my department who did a brilliant job, intelligent, diligent etc. loved her job. But the company had a 'everyone wants to improve and get further up the ladder' mentality. Every year was a struggle with her PR as all the forms we had to fill in, were about what the progression plan was, she didn't want one, I knew she didn't want one; but the system didn't seem to be able to handle it.

I agree @YourOliveBalonz I think it's different also if you're in a career where you started in an entry level job or one where you go in at a particular point due to training. I'm in social work, and lots of people move around within it but stay at a social work level, rather than moving up to management, because that's the job they trained to do and want to do. The nature of the job of a front line worker compared to management is completely different, it's not just a case of taking on some extra responsibility/duties and I understand why many would prefer the hands on work.

But, perhaps in his personal life, the part of life that actually matters, he’s doing things that some can only dream of?! Aspirations are different for everyone, careers only matter to people that are career driven. Perhaps his aspirations lie in seeing all the world’s cultures or whatever it might be. Perhaps he finds career driven people boring?

I think it’s hard to imagine if your own career path is based around ascending from one level to the next rather than staying in one role. I’ve experienced both, and if you haven’t you may not realise that there can be as much challenge and change in the same role over the years - it is not just ‘doing the same shit’.

Some people stay in the same job because they CBA but many still care about their work, still enjoy the challenge of what they do, accumulate the sort of knowledge that others rely upon and are content with that. Conversely, there are also some work-shy not particularly skilled folk who play the game of leap-frogging from one job to the next job up, boasting skills they barely had time to test out, and I think many would recognise that sort of successful person in their own workplaces…

I wonder what his wife thinks of his ‘zen’ attitude to life…

it sounds like he is very valued in his place of work beyond his expertise as a lawyer. That I find impressive. I'd love to work with someone like that.

Exactly. To me it seems he has progressed really well in his internal world. I mean we don't know if he truly is as happy as it seems, but don't we all just not want to be bothered by much and be happy? it seems his purpose is not to progress in work and I find that to be impressive. There are other areas in life to progress in that may be not visible to anyone but ourselves.

And yet there is every indication that this man does have a place?

There's also no indication he is 'pootling' or whatever other patronising turn of phrase you'd like to pull out. There's evidence that his bosses think he is a high performer by that fact he has been approached several times.

They’re not, you know. Some posters arejust aware that in some fields there’s no place for contentedly pootling or someone who’s not striving to make partner, as the OP describes.

There are a few posters falling into the fallacy that ambition and drive are only measured in promotion and more money.

I don't think anyone without ambition or drive gets a lawyer job, does all the academic qualifications and is kept around doing their job properly.

Management is many (most?) people's idea of hell and it's often just put up with as a way of making more money. If money is what you want or need, that is all fine, but I reckon most of us would choose to stay doing the nuts and bolts of work we actually enjoy rather than trying to direct other people to do it.

He sounds amazing. How wonderful that he has hit a sweet spot in his career. He seems like a decent guy and would probably be a great leader, but aren't there also a lot of assholes in senior management? He might have decided to avoid this at all cost.

It would be amazing to have someone like that in an environment that it not money motivated, like a charity or working with children.

I "missed" deadlines for highly encouraged level up. I am doing fine with money I get, could be nice to have more, but it has to be the right position for me. I am not going to go from no line managment responsibility to responsibility for 5 people for couple hundred pounds a month which would also take me away from what I like doing. Been there, done that.
It seems to confuse some people when some of us are just happy where they are and doing what we do.
It's not a lack of drive or ambition or being apathetic. I did more in my life than many of my colleagues. I probably worked more hours than them in total as well in the same working years...
I don't want to go back to stress, not being able to turn off work and all that responsibility for others.
It baffles some, frustrates my LM😂
I don't have kids so I don't have to fight tobring more money in to cover that costs.